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Hypothetical Light Rail (Union Station -> North Hills)

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Recently @Jones_ posted in the Triangle Economic News thread about Kane's desire for better transit at North Hills and how it would be amusing if he ended up being what could light a fire to cause light rail to actually become a thing around here.

This could be a fun exercise in the creativity of people on here.  If you had to figure out how to run a light rail line between downtown (let's say the new Union Station) to North Hills, how would you route it?  Would you go straight up Capital and over?  Would you add a jog over to Five Points?  Where would you have stops (if any)?  Are the kind of developer that would be frugal/conservative to the community, would you bulldoze a daycare while laughing from your corner office, would you find a balance somewhere in between?  Go go go!

I encourage use of Google's MyMaps to facilitiate and share ideas:
https://www.google.com/mymaps/

 

Edited by DPK
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Here's mine. Principal features are the swing west at Navaho/Tarheel (trying to serve Highwoods and maybe Duke Raleigh Hospital with a tram or shuttle), and hugging the belt line until it would swing out to the airport at Crabtree. Avoids old Raleigh neighborhoods and hits areas likely to use it I think. 

I am not married to this....just the first set of thoughts that came to mind after a quick look over of the situation. 

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3 hours ago, Jones_ said:

Here's mine. Principal features are the swing west at Navaho/Tarheel (trying to serve Highwoods and maybe Duke Raleigh Hospital with a tram or shuttle), and hugging the belt line until it would swing out to the airport at Crabtree. Avoids old Raleigh neighborhoods and hits areas likely to use it I think. 

I am not married to this....just the first set of thoughts that came to mind after a quick look over of the situation. 

I'd love to look at your map . . . but you need to change the sharing settings before I can view it.

Edited by Merthecat

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16 minutes ago, Merthecat said:

I'd love to look at your map . . . but you need to change the sharing settings before I can view it.

Sorry, see if it works now. I didn't even look at the default when I copied the link. 

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That worked, thanks!  I like your route, although I wonder if there could be some way to run through Glenwood South a bit longer.  And I had a great (if I may say so myself) vision of the Capital Blvd. wye.  I'll make my own map soon to explore those possibilities.

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1 hour ago, Merthecat said:

That worked, thanks!  I like your route, although I wonder if there could be some way to run through Glenwood South a bit longer.  And I had a great (if I may say so myself) vision of the Capital Blvd. wye.  I'll make my own map soon to explore those possibilities.

I should have prefaced by saying that I was assuming the old TTA/CSX route was what I was starting with, assuming some needed ROW and such already was available there. Since we are dreaming, we could certainly go up Glenwood via NS. Or in the street up north Person (some existing trolley tracks under Person still!) I echo DPK's call to be creative. 

 

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I have lately been thinking that light rail is not really a good fit for Wake County. For the first quarter century of having a transit system we should focus on regional rail: high frequency rail lines using existing rail rights of way and even existing tracks where it makes sense. BRT along certain corridors can fill in the gaps. From the Wake County Transit Plan, I would bump up the planned frequency of the rail line and add stations between Raleigh and Durham. Basically resurrect the 2005 plan. This makes Western Blvd BRT unnecessary. Next, I would add BRT along Glenwood and further up Six Forks.

25 years from now, it would then be time to consider an automated heavy rail line, mostly underground, to connect some of the high demand locations not already on a rail line.

Will draw a map some time soon.

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1 hour ago, orulz said:

I have lately been thinking that light rail is not really a good fit for Wake County. For the first quarter century of having a transit system we should focus on regional rail: high frequency rail lines using existing rail rights of way and even existing tracks where it makes sense. BRT along certain corridors can fill in the gaps. From the Wake County Transit Plan, I would bump up the planned frequency of the rail line and add stations between Raleigh and Durham. Basically resurrect the 2005 plan. This makes Western Blvd BRT unnecessary. Next, I would add BRT along Glenwood and further up Six Forks.

25 years from now, it would then be time to consider an automated heavy rail line, mostly underground, to connect some of the high demand locations not already on a rail line.

Will draw a map some time soon.

Orulz,

I like your ideas a lot. And I especially noticed and agree with your last comment about years later building an heavy rail lines underground. I have been to scared to say anything until you’re comments, so thank you for outing me...Lol :-)

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Orulz,
I like your ideas a lot. And I especially noticed and agree with your last comment about years later building an heavy rail lines underground. I have been to scared to say anything until you’re comments, so thank you for outing me...Lol :-)
My reason for suggesting going underground is not that subways for subways sake are good, but that there are some very big destinations (Cameron Village, North Hills, Centennial Campus, Crabtree) that could and should be directly connected to downtown with dedicated rights of way, but there really isn't any satisfactory way to do so above ground without extraordinary impacts (like bulldozing Five Points for example.)

I think Raleigh is at best 2 decades from even being ready to start this discussion, but eventually growth keeps up we will get there.

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On 1/20/2018 at 4:18 PM, Jones_ said:

Here's mine. Principal features are the swing west at Navaho/Tarheel (trying to serve Highwoods and maybe Duke Raleigh Hospital with a tram or shuttle), and hugging the belt line until it would swing out to the airport at Crabtree. Avoids old Raleigh neighborhoods and hits areas likely to use it I think. 

I am not married to this....just the first set of thoughts that came to mind after a quick look over of the situation. 

My turn 16 stations, 9.5 miles

Similar, except having the line loop for the midtown area (not sure if that is even realistic).  I'm thinking the whole Computer Dr/Barrett Dr of low-density office will eventually be redevelopment NH East style.   Follows mostly at-grade and along existing rail corridor.  Two rail bridges over the beltline, elevated tracks above Six Forks Rd in North Hills area, pedestrian bridge over Capital.

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I like the midtown loop idea. I wonder if you could do the same on the south end. Bring the track south along the Beltline to Centennial/Dix and reconnect to the rail line at NC State/Pullen.

 

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15 hours ago, Green_man said:

My turn 16 stations, 9.5 miles

Similar, except having the line loop for the midtown area (not sure if that is even realistic).  I'm thinking the whole Computer Dr/Barrett Dr of low-density office will eventually be redevelopment NH East style.   Follows mostly at-grade and along existing rail corridor.  Two rail bridges over the beltline, elevated tracks above Six Forks Rd in North Hills area, pedestrian bridge over Capital.

Thought more about it.  LRT needs to bridge over Wake Forest Rd in the 2 locations.  And probably good to have a park and ride station at the north end as well to try to steal away some of the car commuters.  Again, not sure how an offshoot line would work.

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3 hours ago, Green_man said:

Thought more about it.  LRT needs to bridge over Wake Forest Rd in the 2 locations.  And probably good to have a park and ride station at the north end as well to try to steal away some of the car commuters.  Again, not sure how an offshoot line would work.

I've been updating mine with stations sites that I think work better than the old TTA sites, and also sketched in a route to Capital Blvd from my north Raleigh Wye. 

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^ I had some of the same ideas, but I chose my routes a bit differently.  I planned 3 light rail lines, Red, Blue, and Yellow.  I also planned 3 streetcar lines, Green, Purple, and Orange.  The grey stations mark multimodal or shared route stations.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1Gcenf5h9wax6PQZGTn0oQcDyqY0qlzF2&usp=sharing

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Been working on this for a couple of days now.  It's still a work in progress, but I've got the main light rail lines mapped out, and I hope to get the Durham/Orange LRT system on here as well (I did include a small portion of it right near NCCU to show how everything will be integrated).  I will probably add a few streetcar lines as I continue working on it, but they will mainly branch out from the main LRT routes.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1IyxaBddzP2q4FCZn_nIRrfJ0eBs&usp=sharing

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I have taken this too far, and now added the Durham-Orange system to my map (in the closest actual proposed alignment I could manage). 

Also, I am enjoying everyone else's maps too....an excellent way to see what others have on their mind and how things can be approached differently. 

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