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CATS Long Term Transit Plan - Silver, Red Lines


monsoon

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This project is a NC Turnpike project, though. I don't think those are as easy to shift money from like we are simplifying here, as the budgets for those include significant revenues from the tolls. Also, the purpose for this project (while lame) was for supporting infrastructure for freight traffic (trucking) from the airport and the new intermodal yards that will be built there.

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CATS has launched a new sales website where you can buy day passes and roundtrip tickets. Any-10's and monthlies don't appear to be available yet, but I can't imagine that they're far behind.

I don't know of other transit sites where you can buy tickets like this. I know several that sell their electronic reloadable passes online, but not regular tix.

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I'm glad Gastonia is coming to their senses and realizing what most of us understand--that the Gaston Parkway is designed to line the pockets of rural land speculators at taxpayers expense and will probably only hurt the city's economic development efforts. By contrast, a plan put forward to use the money for other purposes might actually grab some regional support... enough to perhaps make the legislative changes needed to make it a reality.

Cost of Garden Parkway-

$1.5 Billion (est)

Cost of other projects-

North CR (Red Line):$375 Million (est)

Gastonia CR: $265 Million-$300 Million (est)

Last leg of 485: Approx $350 Million

I am pretty sure the approx $1 billion needed to complete the last three will produce far more economic benefits for our region than the Garden Parkway ever will. Those projects should cost less too based on current estimates.

Remember that about half (last I checked) of the $1.5B was slated to come from bonds supported by toll revenues. If the parkway isn't built, there's no toll revenue. The revenue that Gastonia is proposing to divert ($35M/year for 39 years) is the gap funding that was preliminarily approved by the General Assembly to pay the half of the parkway's cost not covered by the bonds. The present value of those payments is a lot less than $1.5B.

Rather than try to build a massive bypass, a more effective solution to manage I-85 traffic congestion in Gastonia would be to implement HOV or HOT lanes on the corridor in combination with good local land use planning to encourage more controlled urban growth that can be served by commuter rail new collector streets and other modes.

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This may seem like a weird idea, but regarding the Southeast Silver Line - Do you think they would ever consider Monorail?

There would be some difficulties in the City Center section, particularly if it starts at the proposed Gateway Station; however, if they began it around the CTC instead it might take car of a lot of those issues.

The thought occurred to me as the majority of the proposed line is down Independence, which seems to be the perfect place for a monorail construction as monorails have less frequent stops and need less space for construction purposes.

I'm sure there are some reasons this may not work, but I thought I would throw it out there and see the general reaction.

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CATS has launched a new sales website where you can buy day passes and roundtrip tickets. Any-10's and monthlies don't appear to be available yet, but I can't imagine that they're far behind.

I don't know of other transit sites where you can buy tickets like this. I know several that sell their electronic reloadable passes online, but not regular tix.

So I ordered about 10 round trip tix on the web site last night for next year ($2.99 $2.00 to mail them to me). The web order mechanism is unambiguous, 10 round trip tix for 2010. Much to my mild irritation some one from CATS (who was very polite and helpful) had to call my house to ask if I wanted the tix for 2009 or 2010.

Its a tiny complaint, but gezzz, if you are going to offer web ordering then at least set it up so it works without requiring phone calls.

I feel better now, thanks guys!

EDIT: I totally rescind yesterday's whining. I received the passes and it appears (based on the numbers on the bottom of the tickets) that I am the first to order the punch tickets. Given that I am happy to field a phone call to verify the system works. My sincere apologies to CATS.

(I had hoped to put a couple of the tickets in my wallet to end that panicked feeling of rushing to the machine as the train approaches the platform, unfortunately the punch tickets are too large to fit in anybody's wallet)

Edited by kermit
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Monorail is rediculously expensive. Not feasible.

The expense may be true as I have no clue as the actual costs. That said I still like the idea of it running down Independence. The fact though is that I agree it is probably impractical and unlikely.

Edited by Urbanity
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  • 2 weeks later...

There are a series of "meet and greets" with the BLE artists this month. The first is Jan 14 with the artists for Parkwood-to-Sugar Creek stretch. More info on that and the other meetings here: http://www.charmeck.org/Departments/CATS/Riding+CATS/Transit+Meetings.htm

The artists will be talking about their past work and the communities the stations are going in. This will be a great opportunity to have input on what they create for each station.

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Streetcar junkies may enjoy the "Streetcar Technology Showcase" CATS is holding a the Government Center on Jan 29. It looks like a number of manufacturers will be showing off streetcar technology of some kind. I'm interested in seeing what is shown for hydrogen-powered streetcars.

Yipes. This has got to be some sort of political-schmoozin-back-scratchin-endorsment kind of event. I mean, is it normal for a Transit/City Co. to do an event like this? Or is CATS fishing for a sweetheart deal to get the streetcar up and running? (not that there is anything wrong with that at all!) I see this as the equivalent to taking your client to a suite at a sports event, a much larger scale.

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Yipes. This has got to be some sort of political-schmoozin-back-scratchin-endorsment kind of event. I mean, is it normal for a Transit/City Co. to do an event like this? Or is CATS fishing for a sweetheart deal to get the streetcar up and running? (not that there is anything wrong with that at all!) I see this as the equivalent to taking your client to a suite at a sports event, a much larger scale.

Where do you make that kind of jump?

Charlotte which has already openly voted for streetcar funding studies announcing that they are inviting manufacturers of streetcar technology to present their products at a Government building and invite the public to join in the review of the possible future bidders.

This has got to be the most perfect opposite example of the schmoozing a client at a closed door event for a sweetheart deal.

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This has got to be the most perfect opposite example of the schmoozing a client at a closed door event for a sweetheart deal.

I didn't mean it sounded shady. Just "convenient"...although now that I think more about it, it's not like the city is trying to help Bombardier sell more consumer grade steetcar systems... So what's it worth? :silly: I'm probably go check this event out.

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There is an opinion column in today's Observer that seems to take issue with the 2030 plan because it would have two separate central terminals.

While I agree in principle with the author's assertion that it would be better to have one central terminal I just don't see how it would be possible to make a single terminal for Charlotte without destroying the heart of center city.

Any thoughts?

http://www.charlotteobserver.com/viewpoint/story/1189072.html

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There is an opinion column in today's Observer that seems to take issue with the 2030 plan because it would have two separate central terminals.

While I agree in principle with the author's assertion that it would be better to have one central terminal I just don't see how it would be possible to make a single terminal for Charlotte without destroying the heart of center city.

Any thoughts?

http://www.charlotteobserver.com/viewpoint/story/1189072.html

It is clear the author was not interested in technical details, costs, or reality. It sounds great in theory, just like taking my hoverbike to work this morning sounds great.

In order for their to be one station for all the transit, the north line (and while we're at it, the connecting airport line) would need to be turned into a subway. They would need to go underground at the I-277 beltway in order for the station to be located under CTC. This would mean the technology would need to be changed from diesel commuter rail to a system more like MARTA. Which would mean it would probably need to be on its own dedicated, non-shared tracks.

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It's too bad the multi-modal transfer couldn't happen just outside of Uptown - like around 12th St. You know, bring the commuter rails in, transfer from Blue, bring the Independence Line in via Brookshire, carry the Airport line over to NCMF and then jog down onto 12th.

There is a good amount of land on around 12th between Tryon and Caldwell

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^Well - ours, right now anyway.

Its an understandable criticism. At the very least, I think the transit plan should much more clearly delineate how Gateway and the CTC will operate with each other. IE, how do people move from one side of the city to the other? What methods can be used to reduce the number of connections that have to be made?

HOWEVER, I think the author has never been at the CTC during a rush hour. That place is severely strained for space as it is. Dumping that many transit lines into one central location is just asking for trouble.

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All that op-ed to me was just to complaint that the Gateway station is 1/2 a mile from the Trade Street station of the light rail. The system does connect, it has always intended for a streetcar to connect the two major uptown stations, one being the hub for city transit, the other being the station for trains from other cities. You can't complain about the system plans falling short when the system includes something that solves your problem.

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