Economic Development - Expansions and Relocations

[J-Rob]

Not sure how I feel about tech behemoths moving into banking, but regardless it will be interesting to see if any of these companies (Google, Apple, Facebook, etc.) tap the Charlotte market for banking knowledge.  Let's be honest, Google moving into the SouthEnd seems like the perfect techie/hipster/yuppie fit.  No judgment, just saying it seems like SouthEnd is just waiting to be crowned with a tech giant outpost, and there are a few proposed buildings that need tenants.

https://www.bizjournals.com/charlotte/news/2019/11/13/google-in-talks-to-move-into-banking.html

 

Edited November 14, 2019 by J-Rob

[urbanlover568]

1 hour ago, J-Rob said:

Not sure how I feel about tech behemoths moving into banking, but regardless it will be interesting to see if any of these companies (Google, Apple, Facebook, etc.) tap the Charlotte market for banking knowledge.  Let's be honest, Google moving into the SouthEnd seems like the perfect techie/hipster/yuppie fit.  No judgment, just saying it seems like SouthEnd is just waiting to be crowned with a tech giant outpost, and there are a few proposed buildings that need tenants.

https://www.bizjournals.com/charlotte/news/2019/11/13/google-in-talks-to-move-into-banking.html

 

I'm all for it. Google's not going to be charging stupid fees banks have been able to get away with. I'm confident their site and app will be a Google times better than the banks. 

[Cadi40]

When can we expect some more information or a formal announcement?

Edited November 14, 2019 by Cadi40

[CLT2014]

51 minutes ago, mpretori said:

I'm all for it. Google's not going to be charging stupid fees banks have been able to get away with. I'm confident their site and app will be a Google times better than the banks. 

There are a good amount of banks now that don't have stupid fees like Ally or Discover (no account minimums or maintenance fees) or credit unions. People could move their money out of Bank of America savings account paying 0.03%, but they stay for other reasons (like going to a branch or familiar with the name).

Looks like Google's might have maintenance fees and it is essentially a re-skinned version of Citibank with the Google name. Really won't be any different than an affinity credit card for an airline, where the bank actually behind it is Chase or BofA: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/google-checking-accounts-will-come-with-citibank-fees/

Edited November 14, 2019 by CLT2014

[J-Rob]

27 minutes ago, Cadi40 said:

When can we expect some more information or a formal announcement?

Are you talking about the Vanguard rumor?  I don't think anyone knows (or it is confidential) or they would have told us already.

Edited November 14, 2019 by J-Rob

[Cadi40]

Just any announcement, some content that was posted yesterday made it sound like it was imminent.

[Guest]

Soonest any of us will know, is likely day before.

[U_R_]

5 hours ago, J-Rob said:

Not sure how I feel about tech behemoths moving into banking, but regardless it will be interesting to see if any of these companies (Google, Apple, Facebook, etc.) tap the Charlotte market for banking knowledge.  Let's be honest, Google moving into the SouthEnd seems like the perfect techie/hipster/yuppie fit.  No judgment, just saying it seems like SouthEnd is just waiting to be crowned with a tech giant outpost, and there are a few proposed buildings that need tenants.

https://www.bizjournals.com/charlotte/news/2019/11/13/google-in-talks-to-move-into-banking.html

 

Google  is already taking up all the space in a 30+ story building in Austin. In addition, they just announced they were doubling their footprint in Atlanta and taking 135k sq ft in 1105 WP. I’m pretty sure they’re gonna take a little break for awhile... but I could definitely see another giant like Microsoft come. 

[SydneyCarton]

Facebook is leasing a lot of space.  They’re clearly in expansion mode, and I can see them coming to the QC.

Edited November 14, 2019 by SydneyCarton

[U_R_]

54 minutes ago, SydneyCarton said:

Facebook is leasing a lot of space.  They’re clearly in expansion mode, and I can see them coming to the QC.

It doesn’t hurt to have two of the most popular social media apps in your portfolio (IG, FB). 

Edited November 14, 2019 by Ric0_0

[Dale]

I think Facebook is building a massive facility in Huntsville, AL.

[KJHburg]

While anything can happen I would look for companies more in our wheelhouse like HQs, finance  related etc.  Our tech community is growing greatly and fast and will continue to do so but look for the more familiar.  

Bold prediction here NC will gain 2 Fortune 1000 HQ by the end of the year one in Charlotte and one in Raleigh (that name is already floating out there) 

[Boricua]

Yes they are. My boy is one of the lead electrical engineers for the MASSIVE building. He's flying down weekly to work on it

13 hours ago, Dale said:

I think Facebook is building a massive facility in Huntsville, AL.

 

[CLT2014]

13 hours ago, Dale said:

I think Facebook is building a massive facility in Huntsville, AL.

Yes nearly 1 million square feet, but only around 100 employees will work there once construction is complete since it is a data center. 

[SydneyCarton]

14 hours ago, Dale said:

I think Facebook is building a massive facility in Huntsville, AL.

They also leased 1.5 m sf in a new tower rising in NY yesterday.    I can see them leasing at least 500k sf in the QC for a SE hub.

Edited November 15, 2019 by SydneyCarton

[SydneyCarton]

Here's the latest about Sherwin Williams.  Apparently, it seeks 1m sf.

https://www.crainscleveland.com/manufacturing/out-state-option-surfaces-new-sherwin-williams-headquarters

[CarolinaDaydreamin]

36 minutes ago, SydneyCarton said:

Here's the latest about Sherwin Williams.  Apparently, it seeks 1m sf.

https://www.crainscleveland.com/manufacturing/out-state-option-surfaces-new-sherwin-williams-headquarters

I found the non paywalled version cached on Google:

The currrent Sherwin-Williams headquarters at 101 Prospect Avenue is at right.

Proof that The Sherwin-Williams Co.'s search for a new headquarters site extends to at least one other state and an indication of the scale of the project under consideration — a million square feet — have surfaced from observations by the top executive of a publicly traded Real Estate Investment Trust based in Atlanta.

Brent Smith, CEO of Piedmont Realty Trust Inc., said on the Atlanta-based company's conference call with investors and stock analysts on Oct. 31 that it's "in the running for a potential build-to-suit for Sherwin- Williams" at its Galleria office park, which is near Sun Trust Park, the home ballpark of the Atlanta Braves and about 10 miles from the midtown Atlanta arts and commerce district. Piedmont owns five high-rise buildings with a total of 2 million square feet in the park. Its overall portfolio consists of 55 properties in several major cities, from Boston to Chicago.

In response to an analyst's question, Smith said the Sherwin-Williams search is "very early" and the company has multiple Atlanta sites it could entertain. He also cited press reports that other suitor cities might be Charlotte and Dallas.

"I think I wanted to mention that," Smith said, according to a Seeking Alpha transcript of the call, "because it demonstrates the scale of the opportunity that we have at that location. It's effectively unhindered in terms of development only by the actual footprint itself is zoned for an effect of — you could build it even greater than 1 million square feet, although we think that's probably logical given the overall size of the site."

Smith was elaborating on the Galleria office park because his company recently bought two structures in the park to put all of the office buildings under control of a single company for the first time. He noted Piedmont paid $18.5 million for the development site alone.

Giving up the name of a potential tenant before it commits to buy or lease a property is generally eschewed by commercial real estate companies because it might alert competitors to a juicy opportunity. It's also anathema to state and local economic development groups, which as a rule maintain that secrecy is sought by companies until they commit to incentives and a location.

Michael Cantor, managing director and principal at Allegro Real Estate Brokers & Advisors of Cleveland, said he does not believe disclosing that it's wooing Sherwin-Williams hurts Piedmont in its efforts. Allegro primarily bills itself as a real estate consultant for companies and has run site searches for major concerns.

"It's actually helpful to Sherwin- Williams," Cantor said of the disclosure, because it proves to Ohio and regional economic development groups that the paint and coatings maker, which has a 150-year history in Cleveland, is seriously considering locations outside Northeast Ohio.

"The one group that would be unhappy about it being public would be state and economic development groups who don't want it known they are pursuing a particular piece of business to avoid competition," Cantor said. "The CEO might want the investors to know that it has a property for such a nice opportunity and would prefer for them to know before the company makes its decision known."

Sherwin-Williams, whose CEO, John G. Morikis, has said it would announce a decision by the end of this year or early in 2020, has not previously said how large its new facilities might be.

A million-square-foot office building could be 44 floors, if such a structure has a floor plate similar to that of Ameritrust Center, the ill-fated 60-story building that the late developers Richard and David Jacobs proposed building on Public Square. The site, considered a contender for Sherwin- Williams, remains under the control of a corporation linked to the Jacobs family and is used for parking.

The other big unknown is how large the research-and-development center would be — and Sherwin-Williams has mentioned the research center first when discussing its site search. The company's headquarters is in Landmark Office Towers, which it owns, although the 900,000-square-foot property includes a portion of office space rented to outside firms.

Mike Conway, spokesman for Sherwin-Williams, said in an email Thursday, Nov. 7, that the company had nothing new to report beyond its initial statement about its site search.

While Northeast Ohio has in its favor its status as the company's birthplace and the size of its current staff, Atlanta boasts the nation's busiest airport, with many international flights, which puts it automatically on the list of most site-search consultants for relocation of a global corporate headquarters.

The site that Piedmont's CEO pointed to is similar in size to the superblock in downtown Cleveland that is considered a potential new location for Sherwin-Williams, or part of one. Construction crews conducted soil tests on the asphalt parking lots there the week of Nov. 4. That sea of parking spaces is primarily owned by Weston inc., a Warrensville Heights-based real estate company.

Sherwin-Williams has about 3,600 employees downtown and 4,400 in Northeast Ohio. All told, the company, which had $17.5 billion in sales in 2018, employs a total of 60,000 associates and sells its products in 120 countries.

 

 

 

Sounds like Atlanta might be the heavy favorite. The Braves Battery development will have a new 44 story building getting built near their stadium set to be finished in 2021. Atlanta could just be a stalking horse but their SE HQ is on the other side of Atlanta from the Battery and Home Depot's HQ is near the Battery.  HOWEVER I think this is worth considering:

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2018/02/28/lowes-to-become-exclusive-retailer-for-sherwin-williams-paint.html

[Madison Parkitect]

So a guy lets slip, before anyone at Sherwin Williams or anyone in Cleveland has confirmed anything about a possible move, that his development might be in the running to get the new Sherwin Williams HQ while on a conference call with investors? That's shady as hell.

[Dale]

I thought S-W had all but decided in favor of a downtown Cleveland site,

[J-Rob]

46 minutes ago, CarolinaDaydreamin said:

Sounds like Atlanta might be the heavy favorite. The Braves Battery development will have a new 44 story building getting built near their stadium set to be finished in 2021. Atlanta could just be a stalking horse but their SE HQ is on the other side of Atlanta from the Battery and Home Depot's HQ is near the Battery.  HOWEVER I think this is worth considering:

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2018/02/28/lowes-to-become-exclusive-retailer-for-sherwin-williams-paint.html

This kind of slip, if against Sherwin Williams wishes, might be enough for them to consider a different location if they weren't already.  That is why there are deleted comments around here all the time.  Company relocations are sensitive and can be fickle.

[Tyrone Wiggum]

6 minutes ago, J-Rob said:

This kind of slip, if against Sherwin Williams wishes, might be enough for them to consider a different location if they weren't already.  That is why there are deleted comments around here all the time.  Company relocations are sensitive and can be fickle.

I know when I've spent tens of millions of dollars on research and development my plans can be derailed by anonymous crapposters on obscure message boards.  Hmmmm where should we build our next 100k sf+ building.  How about Char... whhhhhhhhhhhaaaaaaaaaaaaaaattttttttttttt?  A redditor thinks we might build it in Charlotte??? That cinches it; fudge it all we're moving to Anchorage!

[J-Rob]

I mean, the CEO of a development company isn't an anonymous crapposter first of all.  Secondly, I wasn't suggesting people leave Charlotte over UP posts.  I was suggesting they don't like information leaked, and I am fairly positive people on this site have been told to delete posts.  On the other hand, if I was working with a developer that leaked my plans I would strongly consider other options.

3 minutes ago, Tyrone Wiggum said:

I know when I've spent tens of millions of dollars on research and development my plans can be derailed by anonymous crapposters on obscure message boards.  Hmmmm where should we build our next 100k sf+ building.  How about Char... whhhhhhhhhhhaaaaaaaaaaaaaaattttttttttttt?  A redditor thinks we might build it in Charlotte??? That cinches it; fudge it all we're moving to Anchorage!

 

[Tyrone Wiggum]

3 minutes ago, J-Rob said:

I mean, the CEO of a development company isn't an anonymous crapposter first of all.  Secondly, I wasn't suggesting people leave Charlotte over UP posts.  I was suggesting they don't like information leaked, and I am fairly positive people on this site have been told to delete posts.  On the other hand, if I was working with a developer that leaked my plans I would strongly consider other options.

 

Anchorage it is, then.

I just reread my post and I sound like an asshole, so I'm sorry; snark was intended but douchebaggery was not.  

 

[KJHburg]

I think Sherwin Williams is seriously considering moving outside of Cleveland markets.   Air service is not as good as Charlotte by any stretch much less Dallas and Atlanta.  That is not changing anytime soon probably.  I know there are Ohio natives on this board but it is somewhat difficult to get people to move to Ohio and very much so Cleveland unless you are from that area.  Long history in one place does that mean the company will stay there forever.  Exxon old Standard Oil decamped NYC for Dallas decades ago.  And the Lowes connection is important.   I don't this relocation or decision to stay in Ohio will be announced this year but by publicly announcing it like SW did means they want to consider other places that make a compelling case.  Don't count Charlotte out on this either.  There are plenty of sites in uptown Charlotte for a tower on this magnitude and developers that can get it done.   

[CarolinaDaydreamin]

16 minutes ago, KJHburg said:

I think Sherwin Williams is seriously considering moving outside of Cleveland markets.   Air service is not as good as Charlotte by any stretch much less Dallas and Atlanta.  That is not changing anytime soon probably.  I know there are Ohio natives on this board but it is somewhat difficult to get people to move to Ohio and very much so Cleveland unless you are from that area.  Long history in one place does that mean the company will stay there forever.  Exxon old Standard Oil decamped NYC for Dallas decades ago.  And the Lowes connection is important.   I don't this relocation or decision to stay in Ohio will be announced this year but by publicly announcing it like SW did means they want to consider other places that make a compelling case.  Don't count Charlotte out on this either.  There are plenty of sites in uptown Charlotte for a tower on this magnitude and developers that can get it done.   

I think if anything "leaking" the possibility gives SW cover and the possibility to test local/internal reaction. They seem to be one of the ones that would follow up with an aggressive semi public bidding war for incentives if reaction is net positive or neutral (usually well known name brand companies).