Cool Stuff in Other Cities

[Dale]

Still, not ashamed to call myself a Florida boy. My family has been here for nearly 250 years.

[spenser1058]

This has been a total fiasco and it finally looks like it’s over. A group of politicians, businessmen and general schmucks prized ideology and lining their pockets over people and were prepared to sell JEA down the St John’s River, all in the name of privatization. I wish this sort of thing was unusual in Florida, but under our government the last 20 years it has become the norm. What a complete waste of the public’s time, money and confidence.

https://www.jacksonville.com/news/20191223/mayor-lenny-curry-tells-jea-to-stop-sales-talks-jea-sets-emergency-meeting-for-9-am-tuesday

From the Florida Times-Union

To follow the months of this nonsense, just google Florida Times-Union JEA. 

Stop the madness!

[spenser1058]

Why don’t more cities have heavy rail?

https://youtu.be/bLtmJHHqbh8

From City Beautiful 

It turns out that for heavy rail you probably need five million people. The Orlando MSA is halfway there - keep on packin’ the new folks in!

[spenser1058]

https://twitter.com/forrest4trees/status/1215837970885820416?s=21

A fascinating Twitter discussion that sounds very like the ones we have on UP about Orlando. Turns out, though, it’s about the poster child for up and coming hipster cities: Austin, TX

[Dale]

11 hours ago, spenser1058 said:

https://twitter.com/forrest4trees/status/1215837970885820416?s=21

A fascinating Twitter discussion that sounds very like the ones we have on UP about Orlando. Turns out, though, it’s about the poster child for up and coming hipster cities: Austin, TX

I found it depressing, not so much that people of color can’t afford Austin anymore, I mean the people who were commenting.

[The ATX]

7 hours ago, Dale said:

I found it depressing, not so much that people of color can’t afford Austin anymore, I mean the people who were commenting.

Those are the types of comments/discussions made by people who don't like change.  People were saying the same types of things in the 80s and 90s as well.  

[Dale]

13 minutes ago, The ATX said:

Those are the types of comments/discussions made by people who don't like change.  People were saying the same types of things in the 80s and 90s as well.  

Yeah, I was thinking more about the heads-in-the-clouds types, the “Why can’t we be more like Singapore ?” types.

[spenser1058]

1 hour ago, The ATX said:

Those are the types of comments/discussions made by people who don't like change.  People were saying the same types of things in the 80s and 90s as well.  

Austin’s an awesome city and it’s not my purpose to pick on it. It’s just to show our Orlando folks that most fast-growing cities share not dissimilar challenges. Charge On!

[spenser1058]

Modern streetcar system on the way to Tampa:

https://www.thejaxsonmag.com/article/modern-streetcar-system-headed-to-tampa/

From The Jaxson

[HankStrong]

Nice!

[AmIReal]

2 hours ago, spenser1058 said:

Modern streetcar system on the way to Tampa:

https://www.thejaxsonmag.com/article/modern-streetcar-system-headed-to-tampa/

From The Jaxson

This will be tremendous. There is a lot of activity in the area north of where the line currently serves. This extension will improve access to The Straz Center, all the State buildings, a dozen large hotels, Armature Works as well as the  underserved Heights. It would be a crazy way to get to Ybor from the heights, but it would be very efficient to bring traffic inward to the core from highly occupied neighborhoods.

[KJHburg]

Up north for your state anyway in JAX and the JAX Landing is no more a pile of rubble.  I do wish downtown Orlando which I will be in later in the week had some of the high rises downtown JAX has.  the setting of downtown JAX on the river is beautiful as y'all know but I do think the downtown could be a lot more vibrant.  Not many people walking around town north of the river in the business district.     (I would post this in the JAX UP but it is as dead as a door nail) 

[JFW657]

I went to Jax Landing once back sometime around the mid 80's to the early 90's when it was thriving.

Nice place. Kinda like the old St Pete Pier.

Walked around downtown a bit and it was dead in the middle of a weekday.

Strange.

[spenser1058]

The government of Jacksonville has done everything possible in the last couple of decades to insure downtown stays dead. 

It was local developer Cameron Kuhn, who engineered the resurgence of so much of downtown Orlando (until Buddy had him run the bulldozers over the Jaymont Block), who met his Waterloo in downtown Jax.

More’s the pity. As recently as the early 80’s, downtown Jax was infinitely more successful than downtown Orlando. 

Despite City Hall, private groups have done a remarkable job in preserving Riverside-Avondale, San Marco and now restoring Springfield.

Jacksonville was once Florida’s major city and the premier city of North Florida and South Georgia (not to mention many of my ancestors). It’s sad that backward thinking continues to hold it hostage, most recently in the JEA debacle.

 

Edited January 19, 2020 by spenser1058

[spenser1058]

Sunrise over Tampa Bay:

https://twitter.com/coach_jeffscott/status/1218872401875886080?s=21

From (new) USF football coach Jeff Scott

[KJHburg]

I felt like downtown JAX has so much potential with its river front location large office towers but unfortunately there were as many homeless as visitors walking around downtown especially north of the river.    On the other hand went to downtown St Petersburg today and boy has it changed.  It was not too lively last time I saw it 15 years or so ago.  Now it was bustling Central is lined with bars, restaurants and shops and plenty of people walking around.  They have their new tallest in St Pete the newly completed One St Petersburg 41 story condo tower.  I posted a whole bunch of photos on the Tampa St Pete thread but not much activity there.    Much more lively than downtown JAX next up downtown Tampa which I know is pretty vibrant. 

Lesson for Orlando big river views are nice but don't make a city center vibrant. 

[spenser1058]

The change in St Pete has been remarkable. Like downtown Orlando in 1980, it was remarkably cheap and some urban pioneers took the ball and ran with it. It also helped that the city ditched the Grumpy Old Men at the time.

Once it became the place to be in Tampa Bay thanks to organic growth, the developers couldn’t wait to get on board.

[spenser1058]

It’s interesting to me how different cities thrive on different sites. The Orlando room in SSC is dead while the Tampa room is quite busy. It’s just the opposite here on UP.

Ennis Davis or someone from Jax got into a spat with the SSC folks, took their marbles and went home.

What they created, which is now The Jaxson in conjunction with the local PBS station, has not only lively discussion threads but awesome content about urban issues as well.

 

 

 

[KJHburg]

well I found lots of interesting stuff in downtown Tampa,  now my 3rd Florida downtown.  That new 50 acre development on Water St is unbelievable.  First new office tower in downtown Tampa in 25 years (20 story tower) 2 hotels including a JW Marriott and an Edition hotel with condos on top, a 420 unit apartment tower.  Just massive and I started a new thread over in the Tampa St Pete thread for it.  anyway a few highlights from downtown Tampa and heading to the City Beautiful tomorrow!  it is a mini Miami.  Wish downtown Orlando had some of this height in buildings like Tampa does but I do think you will get there. 

https://www.urbanplanet.org/forums/forum/121-tampa-metro/

[Uncommon]

9 hours ago, KJHburg said:

well I found lots of interesting stuff in downtown Tampa,  now my 3rd Florida downtown.  That new 50 acre development on Water St is unbelievable.  First new office tower in downtown Tampa in 25 years (20 story tower) 2 hotels including a JW Marriott and an Edition hotel with condos on top, a 420 unit apartment tower.  Just massive and I started a new thread over in the Tampa St Pete thread for it.  anyway a few highlights from downtown Tampa and heading to the City Beautiful tomorrow!  it is a mini Miami.  Wish downtown Orlando had some of this height in buildings like Tampa does but I do think you will get there. 

https://www.urbanplanet.org/forums/forum/121-tampa-metro/

After you visit Orlando, please do a quick comparison of the 4 downtowns you visited and rank them in terms of vibrancy, skyline/architecture, cleanliness etc! I haven’t been to the 3 other cities in a couple years so I’m curious to see how they are improving their downtown in relation to Orlando.

[dcluley98]

Tampa is on the cusp of a huge transformation right now. The Riverwalk was a big deal for them after Channelside and now SPP/Water Street (aka Vinik-ville) is  going to connect it all together and truly transform the DT area to a liveable place.   Add to that proposed streetcar and other museum and arts/parks projects and it really will be different than you might remember  if you haven't visited in a while. 

[Dale]

39 minutes ago, dcluley98 said:

Tampa is on the cusp of a huge transformation right now. The Riverwalk was a big deal for them after Channelside and now SPP/Water Street (aka Vinik-ville) is  going to connect it all together and truly transform the DT area to a liveable place.   Add to that proposed streetcar and other museum and arts/parks projects and it really will be different than you might remember  if you haven't visited in a while. 

Just spent time in DT Tampa. WS is going to hugely transform a portion of the CBD. Other areas are stirring. Other large areas are blighted. Overall: making huge strides, but years, perhaps decades to achieving the sort of cohesion I see in DT Orlando.

 

[spenser1058]

18 minutes ago, Dale said:

Just spent time in DT Tampa. WS is going to hugely transform a portion of the CBD. Other areas are stirring. Other large areas are blighted. Overall: making huge strides, but years, perhaps decades to achieving the sort of cohesion I see in DT Orlando.

 

I haven’t been lately (I want to visit) but downtown Tampa has struck me in the past as too corporate and sterile compared to downtown Orlando and St. Pete. 

If you’re all about the tall buildings, that was another story. Channelside was much the same - I need to do the Riverwalk.

If all that’s changing, so much the better. I hope to see more personality over there.

[spenser1058]

Once again, the “suits”, as Jim Phillips called them, have struck.

This interesting video suggests that it was corporate stupidity rather than losing money that doomed Opryland.

As the video notes, it shared a common background with a number of second-tier parks. Opryland’s dense stand of trees and the idea of a theme park where the rides took a back seat to the shows made it unique.

I’m also biased as I worked two summers on the steam train there and had a great time.

https://youtu.be/Mw7H2FH38xc

From Expedition Extinct

[dcluley98]

https://www.forbes.com/sites/keithflamer/2017/08/28/water-street-downtown-tampas-3-billion-makeover-into-a-modern-metropolis-assisted-by-bill-gates/#2f37333b4ec8

The future 53-acre mixed-use redevelopment will cover 9 million square feet in 18 distinct buildings directly on the bay, including two new hotels, retail, office space, cultural amenities, and contemporary residences. The neighborhood revitalization will emphasize waterside pedestrian walkways.