Wade Hampton Blvd. Strategic Plan

[PuppiesandKittens]

6 hours ago, btoy said:

Re-naming a street of this size could put a huge expense on thousands of business along the corridor.  For that reason along it should not be done.

That’s a valid point.

Isn’t Wade Hampton Boulevard also U.S.  Route 29?  Perhaps businesses who don’t want to use the name Wade Hampton could just use the name U.S. Route 29, as long as the street numbering can be kept.

Problem solved by just voluntarily reverting to the road’s other name.  Similar to how Pleasantburg Drive is also called 291 Bypass.

[rabbit seisin]

The fixation on on what I will call "symbolic reparations" serves little purpose other than to animate people's resentments. If you are upset by the name of Wade Hampton Boulevard I suggest you get over it and find a way to actually serve your poor and oppressed neighbors, of whom there are many. 

[PuppiesandKittens]

1 hour ago, rabbit seisin said:

The fixation on on what I will call "symbolic reparations" serves little purpose other than to animate people's resentments. If you are upset by the name of Wade Hampton Boulevard I suggest you get over it and find a way to actually serve your poor and oppressed neighbors, of whom there are many. 

Wanting to change the name of Wade Hampton Boulevard, and helping the poor and oppressed in other ways, are not mutually exclusive.  

And symbolic gestures matter.  The Wade Hampton name was adopted at a time of resistance to integration.  The name certainly mattered to the pro-segregation crowd, just as it matters to other groups.

Edited August 25, 2022 by PuppiesandKittens

[NewlyUpstate]

5 hours ago, distortedlogic said:

I get that but then where do we draw the lines? Washington and Lincoln were long revered and now a relatively large of group of people want their names removed from everything, because they find their names offensive and their deeds egregious. People could make an argument against naming things after Einstein because of his role in the creation of the atom bomb. Not everyone in Greenville likes Knox White and thinks he has been good for the city. Greenville is named after Nathaniel Greene, a Revolutionary War General, and a large portion of the country now thinks the entire founding of the country was evil; should we rename Greenville and Greensboro? There has only been one perfect person in the history of the world and his name offends LOTS of people; we can't even say his name in a school for example. You see the issue? It's impossible to accommodate everyone and it's impossible to keep people from being offended if they are looking to be offended.

None of those people you're mentioning rise anywhere close to Wade Hampton. People are always going to make "slippery slope" arguments, but at least make examples of something that's a similar level of gray

[distortedlogic]

2 hours ago, NewlyUpstate said:

None of those people you're mentioning rise anywhere close to Wade Hampton. People are always going to make "slippery slope" arguments, but at least make examples of something that's a similar level of gray

Maybe and maybe not. It could easily be argued that (aside from the mayor) Wade Hampton doesn't rise anywhere close to all the others; they are all MUCH more well known and way more people around the country have been clamoring to change their namesakes than Hampton's. But see, this is a good illustration of the problem. Who decides what level of offense is worthy of changing names? You may be more offended by Wade Hampton, but many people around the country are just as offended (or more) by Washington and Lincoln. Who decides what level of offense is enough? We can't remove everything that offends everyone. The people deemed worthy of namesakes today may be tomorrows villains. Some people will never be satisfied with this mindset. I think it is much healthier and reasonable to learn to have power over our own emotions rather than expecting everyone else to address and respond to them, in order for them to be tempered.  "I' can't be happy or not feel offended until somebody changes x" ...why give everyone else that much power over our own emotions?

Edited August 26, 2022 by distortedlogic

[NewlyUpstate]

53 minutes ago, distortedlogic said:

Maybe and maybe not. It could easily be argued that (aside from the mayor) Wade Hampton doesn't rise anywhere close to all the others; they are all MUCH more well known and way more people around the country have been clamoring to change their namesakes than Hampton's. But see, this is a good illustration of the problem. Who decides what level of offense is worthy of changing names? You may be more offended by Wade Hampton, but many people around the country are just as offended (or more) by Washington and Lincoln. Who decides what level of offense is enough? We can't remove everything that offends everyone. The people deemed worthy of namesakes today may be tomorrows villains. Some people will never be satisfied with this mindset. I think it is much healthier and reasonable to learn to have power over our own emotions rather than expecting everyone else to address and respond to them, in order for them to be tempered.  "I' can't be happy or not feel offended until somebody changes x" ...why give everyone else that much power over our own emotions?

You've gotta be kidding me. No one thinks Washington or Lincoln are worse than wade hampton. If so, please show me. 

 

You're just feigning outrage

[gman430]

I will support the name change but only IF it means we get more tower cranes downtown and more airlines at GSP.   Where is Alaska Airlines?  

Seriously though, I find it funny how Wade Hampton Blvd never offended anybody previously over the past decade after decade after decade but now all of the sudden it does.   They might as well tear down Bob Jones University while we're at it just so all of the woke people can feel better about themselves.

Edited August 26, 2022 by gman430

[distortedlogic]

1 hour ago, NewlyUpstate said:

You've gotta be kidding me. No one thinks Washington or Lincoln are worse than wade hampton. If so, please show me. 

 

You're just feigning outrage

Just going on the multiple reports across the country the last couple of years about many people/cities/colleges/organizations wanting to change things named after Washington and Lincoln or take down memorials to them. I have only heard outcry about Hampton locally. I get that he was an SC guy but that supports my point about the others being much more well known. 

Not feigning outrage in the least (dangers of written text I guess, can't see expression or hear tone) because there's no rage there.  I'm simply stating another perspective on the original post about changing names. I'm not angry or upset in the least... just trying to provide a different viewpoint. 

Btw, just one more point; I think it is kinda ironic you say I am pretending to be offended by this when the major theme of my point is about people being too easily offended.  You or anyone else can disagree with my opinion on this and it won't offend me at all... I promise! 

Edited August 26, 2022 by distortedlogic

[NewlyUpstate]

14 minutes ago, distortedlogic said:

Just going on the multiple reports across the country the last couple of years about many people/cities/colleges/organizations wanting to change things named after Washington and Lincoln or take down memorials to them. I have only heard outcry about Hampton locally. I get that he was an SC guy but that supports my point about the others being much more well known. 

Not feigning outrage in the least (dangers of written text I guess, can't see expression or hear tone) because there's no rage there.  I'm simply stating another perspective on the original post about changing names. I'm not angry or upset in the least... just trying to provide a different viewpoint. 

Btw, just one more point; I think it is kinda ironic you say I am pretending to be offended by this when the major theme of my point is about people being too easily offended.  You or anyone else can disagree with my opinion on this and it won't offend me at all... I promise! 

Your "different viewpoint" is pretty crazy.

Yes people are angry about Washington and Lincoln too, but please do not try to compare them to Wade Hampton.

Just because people don't know about him, doesn't make him not a worse person. I've lived all over the country. In general, people don't really even think about South Carolina except those going to Myrtle Beach in the summer.

Edited August 26, 2022 by NewlyUpstate

[motonenterprises]

39 minutes ago, gman430 said:

I will support the name change but only IF it means we get more tower cranes downtown and more airlines at GSP.   Where is Alaska Airlines?  

Seriously though, I find it funny how Wade Hampton Blvd never offended anybody previously over the past decade after decade after decade but now all of the sudden it does.   They might as well tear down Bob Jones University while we're at it just so all of the woke people can feel better about themselves.

Being against bigots and slavery has nothing to do with being woke. I'm not liberal, but those are 2 things i don't stand for. Wade Hampton was a bigot and slave owner. With that being said. I don't really care what the road is called, but I understand why people of my ethnic background don't like it. I can understand why you can't see it. Your ancestors may have been on the benefiting side of it. 

[distortedlogic]

38 minutes ago, NewlyUpstate said:

Your "different viewpoint" is pretty crazy.

Yes people are angry about Washington and Lincoln too, but please do not try to compare them to Wade Hampton.

Just because people don't know about him, doesn't make him not a worse person. I've lived all over the country. In general, people don't really even think about South Carolina except those going to Myrtle Beach in the summer.

- Glad to see you're tolerant of other viewpoints.

- I never compared them or made any judgment about how bad they were, I just said people are offended by all of them and have called for removal of namesakes. 

- I agree.

 

[Galley]

Ambassador Animal Hospital is building a new facility a few blocks closer to downtown Greenville.  It looks to be three times the size of the existing facility.

[StrangeCock]

On 8/24/2022 at 5:47 PM, distortedlogic said:

It's the same argument as with other things people are renaming. We can't rename everything that offends somebody. People are much better off learning not to be offended by everything than expecting the world around them to change when they are.

This isn't about anyone being offended. Who cares if someone is offended? It's simply about whether or not it is right to have a street named after Wade Hampton. And it just isn't. He was not a great human. Not garbage level like Ben Tillman. But surely not good.

(I went to Wade Hampton High, by the way. They should change that, too.)

[Galley]

On 9/3/2022 at 12:48 PM, Galley said:

Ambassador Animal Hospital is building a new facility a few blocks closer to downtown Greenville.  It looks to be three times the size of the existing facility.

Their new facility opened on the 10th.  I stopped by to pick up a prescription, so I only saw the lobby.   They obviously put some money into it.

[gman]

On 9/13/2022 at 12:36 AM, StrangeCock said:

This isn't about anyone being offended. Who cares if someone is offended? It's simply about whether or not it is right to have a street named after Wade Hampton. And it just isn't. He was not a great human. Not garbage level like Ben Tillman. But surely not good.

(I went to Wade Hampton High, by the way. They should change that, too.)

The students don’t refer to their school being called Wade Hampton. They say, “The Wade.” 

[vicupstate]

Last Monday's City Council Work Session:

[btoy]

I hope that is the new entrance to Timmons park that they talked about a few years ago.  I think they were going to buy the parcel with the shed dealership on it.

[NewlyUpstate]

https://www.greenvillesc.gov/2136/Wade-Hampton-Boulevard-Corridor-improvem

 

Quote

The Wade Hampton Boulevard Corridor Improvement Project proposes:

• Creating a roundabout at North Church Street and Wade Hampton Boulevard
• Realigning White Oak Road and Bradley Boulevard
• Improving intersections and access management
• Creating a shared-use path with a landscaped buffer from travel lanes, and
• Evaluating creating a "gateway" approach near the project's east end at Bob Jones University

 

I really love these plans.  The roundabout at Church St plus a Superstreet with a shared-use median would be a very attractive solution.  If they really don't need significant right-of-use acquisitions, the city should be able to pull this off pretty quickly.  Only thing I wonder about is where the controlled left turns will be placed.

Edited June 15, 2023 by NewlyUpstate

[GMoxley]

40 minutes ago, NewlyUpstate said:

https://www.greenvillesc.gov/2136/Wade-Hampton-Boulevard-Corridor-improvem

 

I really love these plans.  The roundabout at Church St plus a Superstreet with a shared-use median would be a very attractive solution.  If they really don't need significant right-of-use acquisitions, the city should be able to pull this off pretty quickly.  Only thing I wonder about is where the controlled left turns will be placed.

Definitely some exciting stuff. I’m skeptical of the median multiuse path though. Just seems difficult for pedestrians and cyclists to actually access it.

[GvilleSC]

Just now, GMoxley said:

Definitely some exciting stuff. I’m skeptical of the median multiuse path though. Just seems difficult for pedestrians and cyclists to actually access it.

Agreed. I appreciate how nice it could look, but seems very impractical for this particular corridor. 

[NewlyUpstate]

My thoughts are they are trying to make Wade Hampton not some impenetrable wall, by encouraging pedestrian and bike use through the middle it makes it less imposing.

I do agree about access along with conflicts where there are left turns. Hopefully they show some more details about how these two things will look practically.

[distortedlogic]

Option 3  looks the most logical to me; how many people are really going to use a middle lane like in option 1?  And it would eliminate a lane of traffic each way. We've done a lot of road diets, but we can't keep down sizing all our roadways in a fast growing metro, it's just going to cause more headache and backup elsewhere.

 

 

[GMoxley]

2 hours ago, distortedlogic said:

Option 3  looks the most logical to me; how many people are really going to use a middle lane like in option 1?  And it would eliminate a lane of traffic each way. We've done a lot of road diets, but we can't keep down sizing all our roadways in a fast growing metro, it's just going to cause more headache and backup elsewhere.

 

 

I prefer option two with the physically separated bike paths. It does cut down one travel lane but WH isn’t busy enough to really justify having 3 lanes in each direction.

[PuppiesandKittens]

Once Knox White retires in, say 2040, this street should be named Knox White Boulevard.

[apaladin]

Wade Hampton does not need to go to 2 lanes each way, period end of paragraph.