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Headwaters Resort & Casino (Proposed)


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HeyI don’t know, KC LIVE sure does look more elaborate. Including two sleek new apt. towers,

 

https://cordish.com/portfolio/power-and-light-district

https://cordish.com/portfolio/kansas-city-live
 

https://cordish.com/portfolio/one-light-luxury-apartments

https://cordish.com/portfolio/two-light-luxury-apartments

 

And even “little“  Louisville has a more elaborate set up than we do. 
 

https://cordish.com/portfolio/fourth-street-live

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On 10/7/2020 at 6:21 PM, zeppelin14 said:

It's all B.S. Why didn't Norfolk let Cordish do what they wanted to do in the first place?

Not only did they not let them do what they wanted to do in the first place, they made them close early under this concept. That place closes down so early it’s ridiculous. I think Norfolk leaders were petrified that we would have another waterside incident on our hands where somebody is dragged under a truck or shot. 

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Several people suggested a Farmer's/Seafood Market, which would've been awesome. It honestly surprises me they didn't go with that option, given how downtown still doesn't have a grocery store. Farm Fresh left Boush St. nearly a decade ago!

You close at midnight at the latest anyway. At least you would've had consistent customers and a residential base with a market.

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On 10/7/2020 at 5:35 PM, BFG said:

Part of me wishes Cordish had waited a couple years instead of trying to force a glorified food court. Louise Lucas has been trying for a casino for years; eventually something would've worked in her favor, but I also get not sitting on a vacant building for three or four years.

Like you, I don't know all the details, but the city put out a survey close to 10 years ago, and got about 3,000 responses. IIRC, an overwhelming majority said do something different with Waterside. And yet, here we are. Anyone know if any of the other Cordish "Live!" properties in KC or B-More are like Norfolk's, or do they offer more?

They definitely offer more than waterside. The setup is totally different. I would say overall, waterside generally has all the elements, it just setup definitely. its definitely not a food court vibe at all. more so a collection of businesses in the same area.

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On 10/8/2020 at 6:44 PM, baobabs727 said:

Not only did they not let them do what they wanted to do in the first place, they made them close early under this concept. That place closes down so early it’s ridiculous. I think Norfolk leaders were petrified that we would have another waterside incident on our hands where somebody is dragged under a truck or shot. 

I've always questioned that thought process. From what I remember, DT was the safest place in the city. We heard about a hand full of incidents in DT over "years" but they always seem to blow up like someone dropped a bomb in the city. I never understood it, its almost like someone has it out for DT Norfolk. The older I get the more I believe what people use to tell me about norfolk not wanting to be a big city. The council always seems to be inept when it comes to growing the city. it seems like over the years we all felt like we could do a better job and that is saying a lot about the quality of the council IMO.

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It’s really frustrating how this area operates and refuses to grow. I don’t wanna leave, but the lack of vision and cooperation is tiring.

And yet, the city leaders continue telling themselves that the regional title is the problem, and not well-paying private sector jobs. 

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https://www.virginiabusiness.com/article/baskervill-hks-to-lead-norfolk-casino-design-architecture/

"The Pamunkey Indian Tribe issued conceptual renderings for the Norfolk casino more than a year ago, but those will change with the new architectural team in place, says Jay Smith, spokesman for the Pamunkey Indian Tribe. 

HKS is a global firm with 1,350 employees and 23 locations. Some of their notable projects include AT&T Stadium (home to the Dallas Cowboys) and SoFi Stadium in Los Angeles (home to the NFL Rams and Chargers), in addition to other resorts and casinos. HKS was the lead architect on the MGM National Harbor Casino, located just outside Washington, D.C., in Maryland. "

Hmm....

If this thing turns into an overgrown Walmart I'm gonna flip.

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I believe HKS was once known as Populous. They’ve come up with some pretty iconic designs, and I think they also designed Harbor Park. I’d be okay with their design here, although I do love the original renderings. 

ETA: Correction. Populous was once known as HOK. However, HKS also designed the Venetian in Vegas. 

Edited by BFG
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  • 2 weeks later...

I was in upstate NY last week for work, and tried to go to one of their Native American casinos. I found two, both kinda tucked away in the middle of a country town. I doubt they have crime issues there. Unfortunately, VA is still on NY's Covid list, so they wouldn't allow me access.

Spoke to some friends in PA and Illinois. The one in PA said crime hasn't been an issue, but economic benefits are temporary, so that's a little concerning. 

All that being said, with this being through the Pamunkey tribe, a No vote isn't a dealbreaker here, is it?

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Yeah, this might be one of the highest turnout elections in history, and if it's anything worse than a razor thin margin in favor of 'no', it'd seem super undemocratic to try and push it through. Might try and have it come up to vote again, but I'm not sure what that process would be, and I would have to guess it'd be fairly laborious. 

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18 hours ago, BFG said:

I was in upstate NY last week for work, and tried to go to one of their Native American casinos. I found two, both kinda tucked away in the middle of a country town. I doubt they have crime issues there. Unfortunately, VA is still on NY's Covid list, so they wouldn't allow me access.

Spoke to some friends in PA and Illinois. The one in PA said crime hasn't been an issue, but economic benefits are temporary, so that's a little concerning. 

All that being said, with this being through the Pamunkey tribe, a No vote isn't a dealbreaker here, is it?

I am sure this varies from casino to casino.  Having grown up in Northeastern Connecticut, seeing the transformation since the casinos opened in the mid 90s is still impressive.  The economic benefits there have certainly not been temporary and the resorts continue to expand.

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3 hours ago, Icetera said:

I am sure this varies from casino to casino.  Having grown up in Northeastern Connecticut, seeing the transformation since the casinos opened in the mid 90s is still impressive.  The economic benefits there have certainly not been temporary and the resorts continue to expand.

I should ask what he meant, but once I told him money would go towards schools, he got a better understanding. But I could only imagine this being a benefit, esp. once Norfolk starts building the waterfront more.

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At this point it would just be stupid not to do this. You have casinos all around the state, holding on to this "no casino" vibe is just stupid in 2020.  So this is a win at least right now. I would be more concerned how the city handles the construction of this and how they will leverage this for the city/region. Would the construction of this possible casino instantly change their thoughts on SPQ??? ( I know that will not happen) Just sayin.... A casino that close to what they proposed is kind offfffff.................... lets just say it lacks flow!

 

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19 minutes ago, brikkman said:

At this point it would just be stupid not to do this. You have casinos all around the state, holding on to this "no casino" vibe is just stupid in 2020.  So this is a win at least right now. I would be more concerned how the city handles the construction of this and how they will leverage this for the city/region. Would the construction of this possible casino instantly change their thoughts on SPQ??? ( I know that will not happen) Just sayin.... A casino that close to what they proposed is kind offfffff.................... lets just say it lacks flow!

 

How would it change their thoughts on SPQ? They're two different projects with two different goals and incentives around them. The lack of flow might also be due to the fact that there's an interstate and sea of parking between the two.

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