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The Pinery vs Russels thing is going to be interesting. They are definitely going for the same clientele and Pinery I think looks better and has way better outside dining options, plus the parking garage. Its actually causing us to re-design our space because what we planned 2 years ago is being copied already too much so we're switching it up.

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Their site was in MU-2 which has a max FAR of  0.35, and is only 94480 sqft.  That means given their initial zoning (prior to applying for PD) they would have only been allowed a 33k sqft building.  T

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On 6/12/2021 at 3:17 PM, popsiclebrandon said:

The Pinery vs Russels thing is going to be interesting. They are definitely going for the same clientele and Pinery I think looks better and has way better outside dining options, plus the parking garage. Its actually causing us to re-design our space because what we planned 2 years ago is being copied already too much so we're switching it up.

I started off high on Russel's but kinda lost that loving feeling. I hope Pinery can be better, but the experience level of the principles concerns me. Your place, on the other hand, I have high expectations for... looking forward to it.

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On 6/12/2021 at 3:17 PM, popsiclebrandon said:

The Pinery vs Russels thing is going to be interesting. They are definitely going for the same clientele and Pinery I think looks better and has way better outside dining options, plus the parking garage. Its actually causing us to re-design our space because what we planned 2 years ago is being copied already too much so we're switching it up.

Agreed, the parking and outdoor dining is likely to be a big deal. 

Isn't Russels parking lot meant to be open to the public for the park? There are signs limiting the parking to 2 hours which s like it's meant for the park and not a valet service. During busy times the valets block the boat ramp and emergency dive parking which I'm sure it's legal. Also in the past week they converted the area occupied by the public sidewalk between the building and the lake to an outdoor dining area including a fence. It just seems like Russels is just an anonymous tip to the city away from some major head aches. 

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On 6/13/2021 at 8:07 PM, AmIReal said:

I started off high on Russel's but kinda lost that loving feeling. I hope Pinery can be better, but the experience level of the principles concerns me. Your place, on the other hand, I have high expectations for... looking forward to it.

 

I had the same experience. I went to Russells once, enjoyed it, but have had zero desire to go back. 

I went to The Pinery last night and thought it was great. I really like that the menu works well no matter how hungry you are, you can stop in for a small bite, medium bite, or big bite and there will be a selection of items to choose from. Drinks are a bit pricey but really good. 

A lot of the recent Russells reviews on Google are not good, seems to be a trend of people receiving overcooked food. 

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On 6/12/2021 at 3:17 PM, popsiclebrandon said:

The Pinery vs Russels thing is going to be interesting. They are definitely going for the same clientele and Pinery I think looks better and has way better outside dining options, plus the parking garage. Its actually causing us to re-design our space because what we planned 2 years ago is being copied already too much so we're switching it up.

What is your place going to be called again? Iirc it’s a wine bar concept right?

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1 hour ago, sethM said:

 

I had the same experience. I went to Russells once, enjoyed it, but have had zero desire to go back. 

I went to The Pinery last night and thought it was great. I really like that the menu works well no matter how hungry you are, you can stop in for a small bite, medium bite, or big bite and there will be a selection of items to choose from. Drinks are a bit pricey but really good. 

A lot of the recent Russells reviews on Google are not good, seems to be a trend of people receiving overcooked food. 

Friend who puts up with just about anything at a restaurant had to send his food back. Think his issue was undercooked though. Guessing they are understaffed and also undertrained there. They have the money to poach talent from all over and they probably should. Not going to check it out for a month or so to see how its going once the opening jitters work out.

 

52 minutes ago, Uncommon said:

What is your place going to be called again? Iirc it’s a wine bar concept right?

Yeah Arden. Hopefully Nov-ish we can open but who knows.

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2 hours ago, popsiclebrandon said:

Friend who puts up with just about anything at a restaurant had to send his food back. Think his issue was undercooked though. Guessing they are understaffed and also undertrained there. They have the money to poach talent from all over and they probably should. Not going to check it out for a month or so to see how its going once the opening jitters work out.

 

Pinery or Russells? 

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Scott J does Russell’s and is quite complimentary. Of course, he had steak tartare, which eliminates any problem with overcooking…

https://www.scottjosephorlando.com/reviews/51-american/5700-russell-s-on-lake-ivanhoe

For some reason, Scott refers to it as a “downtown restaurant “. Really? Scott knows better - I think he’s spending too much time on Restaurant Row lately.

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On 7/1/2021 at 4:01 PM, spenser1058 said:

Scott J does Russell’s and is quite complimentary. Of course, he had steak tartare, which eliminates any problem with overcooking…

https://www.scottjosephorlando.com/reviews/51-american/5700-russell-s-on-lake-ivanhoe

For some reason, Scott refers to it as a “downtown restaurant “. Really? Scott knows better - I think he’s spending too much time on Restaurant Row lately.

Read glowing review on Scott J website... check

Verify that the place being reviewed is also an advertiser on the Scott J website... check

Nod knowingly and file away with the reviews of Delaney's and Tornatore's... check

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Neither here nor there, but I take back the criticism of LakeHouse I made a couple weeks back.  I was being overly critical b/c it wasn't 20+ stories.  I drove by there again and yes, they did a good job at the sidewalk level, and I knew that prior.  And the U shape of the building- an overly simplistic criticism I know.  They did do a good job and getting people in there at the eatery (eateries)  is huge for the area.

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On 6/30/2021 at 11:34 AM, popsiclebrandon said:

Yeah Arden. Hopefully Nov-ish we can open but who knows.

Your spot is located across the way from the food hall in its own space, correct? If you don’t mind me asking, what is the cause  of uncertainty with opening timeline? The building is completed externally, but no signs of an interior build-out. It has been sitting for months.
 

The food hall and dog daycare have been making strides with their build-outs.  They are both aiming for a late summer opening I believe, which obviously could change.

 

I know the pandemic set everyone back a lot but it seems like even aside from that, this retail portion of the yard has been struggling. The foxtail space has been completed for weeks now, even with signage, espresso machines on the counters and it still hasn’t opened or at least committed to an opening date. There is plenty of pedestrian traffic from yard residents and surrounding neighborhood to support the foxtail.

 

I know it is probably out of your control, but it must be frustrating for both the business owners like you and people who have already lived at the yard for over a year now, whose main draw to the building was this on site retail “front yard” yet still not one active retail space. 

Edited by Gtothree2748
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33 minutes ago, Gtothree2748 said:

Your spot is located across the way from the food hall in its own space, correct? If you don’t mind me asking, what is the cause  of uncertainty with opening timeline? The building is completed externally, but no signs of an interior build-out. It has been sitting for months.

 

I’m curious too, feels like it’s nearing two years late. It’s crazy that all of the apartments might be finished before the food hall opens. 

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1 hour ago, Gtothree2748 said:

Your spot is located across the way from the food hall in its own space, correct? If you don’t mind me asking, what is the cause  of uncertainty with opening timeline? The building is completed externally, but no signs of an interior build-out. It has been sitting for months.
 

The food hall and dog daycare have been making strides with their build-outs.  They are both aiming for a late summer opening I believe, which obviously could change.

 

I know the pandemic set everyone back a lot but it seems like even aside from that, this retail portion of the yard has been struggling. The foxtail space has been completed for weeks now, even with signage, espresso machines on the counters and it still hasn’t opened or at least committed to an opening date. There is plenty of pedestrian traffic from yard residents and surrounding neighborhood to support the foxtail.

 

I know it is probably out of your control, but it must be frustrating for both the business owners like you and people who have already lived at the yard for over a year now, whose main draw to the building was this on site retail “front yard” yet still not one active retail space. 

Yes we're in the center building.

Quick timeline

June 2019 - We begin lease discussions

Feb 2020 - Lease signed (Great timing!)

March 2021 - Space is turned over to us, still not complete

 

I've done this enough to know you just don't know when you will open. The city has a notoriously bad and slow permitting office so to make any plans to open before you are into full on construction is crazy. You will miss that deadline 100%. Ideally this puts us around Nov/Dec but permits/hurricanes/labor issues all factor into this and its just not possible to know at this point. Its why the food hall saying they are 2 weeks out is insane because they are very clearly not.  Foxtail told the landlord they won't open before the food hall so that will sit completely ready til then. I still think we're much closer to Labor Day weekend than July for that to be ready.

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On 7/7/2021 at 12:30 PM, popsiclebrandon said:

I've done this enough to know you just don't know when you will open. The city has a notoriously bad and slow permitting office so to make any plans to open before you are into full on construction is crazy. You will miss that deadline 100%. Ideally this puts us around Nov/Dec but permits/hurricanes/labor issues all factor into this and its just not possible to know at this point. Its why the food hall saying they are 2 weeks out is insane because they are very clearly not.  Foxtail told the landlord they won't open before the food hall so that will sit completely ready til then. I still think we're much closer to Labor Day weekend than July for that to be ready.

 

Crazy to think that Foxtail and the landlord are at a standoff. They could easily open and serve quite a few of the residents and other folks in the neighborhood, not as many as when the food hall opens but still a decent amount. Then on the other side the landlord is effectively getting nothing while they wait. 

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3 minutes ago, jrs2 said:

if true that's happened to a lot of companies...

The Times had a great piece this week reviewing the horrible working conditions of many restaurants/bars in the US (and it reminded me of my foray during college as a waiter - it’s the only place I’ve ever worked where I would have voted for unionization, it was so awful; it was owned by a large corporation). 

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20 hours ago, spenser1058 said:

The Times had a great piece this week reviewing the horrible working conditions of many restaurants/bars in the US (and it reminded me of my foray during college as a waiter - it’s the only place I’ve ever worked where I would have voted for unionization, it was so awful; it was owned by a large corporation). 

SO, why exactly is The Pinery closed?  Did they get cited by The City for something?

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