Retail Trends That May Affect Central Florida

[HankStrong]

I don't actually know anyone who has shopped at a Pier One since about 1988 when my dad bought this giant wicker chair for the back porch.  That's probably why.

[AmIReal]

16 minutes ago, HankStrong said:

I don't actually know anyone who has shopped at a Pier One since about 1988 when my dad bought this giant wicker chair for the back porch.  That's probably why.

Bed, Bath & Beyond are soon to follow them.

[HankStrong]

I don't shop there either, but at least it seems busy when I go by one.  I don't know how that translates to sales.

[spenser1058]

There was a post earlier about the Sanford Macy’s closing and how shoppers would need to go to Altamonte Mall.

I just noticed in the list of closures that the Macy’s in RiverGate (Nashville) Mall is closing. That leaves the entire north side of town (including Goodlettsville, Madison and Hendersonville) without a store. They’ll have to go all the way to the other side of town.

Nashville has already lost all its Sears stores.

Of course, department stores are a dying breed. Nevertheless, that a fast-growing major city like Nashville is  giving up entire chains across wide swaths of town is stunning.

We are definitely paring down locations but they do still exist here. Apparently, other areas are more affected by the Retail Apocalypse than we are.

One irony: Goodlettsville, where RiverGate Mall is located, is the hometown of Dollar General, one of the fastest growing retail chains in the US 

Edited January 9, 2020 by spenser1058

[smileguy]

On 1/9/2020 at 10:17 AM, spenser1058 said:

There was a post earlier about the Sanford Macy’s closing and how shoppers would need to go to Altamonte Mall.

I just noticed in the list of closures that the Macy’s in RiverGate (Nashville) Mall is closing. That leaves the entire north side of town (including Goodlettsville, Madison and Hendersonville) without a store. They’ll have to go all the way to the other side of town.

Nashville has already lost all its Sears stores.

Of course, department stores are a dying breed. Nevertheless, that a fast-growing major city like Nashville is  giving up entire chains across wide swaths of town is stunning.

We are definitely paring down locations but they do still exist here. Apparently, other areas are more affected by the Retail Apocalypse than we are.

One irony: Goodlettsville, where RiverGate Mall is located, is the hometown of Dollar General, one of the fastest growing retail chains in the US 

My understanding is that Macy's is planning to hold onto their store at Fashion Square through the redevelopment of the property, presumably with a major refresh.   We'll see if they stay the course. 

[orlandoguy]

My understanding is that Macy's is planning to hold onto their store at Fashion Square through the redevelopment of the property, presumably with a major refresh.   We'll see if they stay the course. 

Does Macy’s own this building and/or land like Sears did? If not, it actually could be a shrewd move for Macy’s to stay and have an exclusivity clause written into their lease, preventing any other department stores from being in the new lifestyle/power center that gets built. With no other store quite like that in the immediate vicinity, it would have the market for the downtown-ish area to itself.

[spenser1058]

I’m not positive about this but I believe macy’s has a very lucrative lease with a 50-year term (Burdines opened in the space in July, 1973). 

My understanding is the terms are quite reasonable and macy’s Is hoping to extend on lucrative terms.

As @orlandoguy points out, they are pretty much the ballgame in the center of town as the traditional department store so it may work for them, particularly given the older demographics in BP/Glenridge.

Sears was a different kettle of fish because they built their store 10 years before the mall opened. The mall was just attached to the existing building. (The irony was Monkey Ward opened a much nicer flagship store on W. Colonial about the same time but it never caught on. If only @JFW657 had worked there instead of the MW in Brevard)

More on this as I hear additional details.

 

Edited January 14, 2020 by spenser1058

[JFW657]

1 hour ago, spenser1058 said:

I’m not positive about this but I believe macy’s has a very lucrative lease with a 50-year term (Burdines opened in the space in July, 1973). 

My understanding is the terms are quite reasonable and macy’s Is hoping to extend on lucrative terms.

As @orlandoguy points out, they are pretty much the ballgame in the center of town as the traditional department store so it may work for them, particularly given the older demographics in BP/Glenridge.

Sears was a different kettle of fish because they built their store 10 years before the mall opened. The mall was just attached to the existing building. (The irony was Monkey Ward opened a much nicer flagship store on W. Colonial about the same time but it never caught on. If only @JFW657 had worked there instead of the MW in Brevard)

More on this as I hear additional details.

Too far to drive for a 20 hr per week part time job.

My mom worked in the administrative office at the same MW store I did. 

Every once in awhile, she and the other gals back there would have to drive over here to the W. Colonial Store for meetings. 

[bqknight]

On 1/14/2020 at 6:07 PM, spenser1058 said:

I’m not positive about this but I believe macy’s has a very lucrative lease with a 50-year term (Burdines opened in the space in July, 1973). 

My understanding is the terms are quite reasonable and macy’s Is hoping to extend on lucrative terms.

As @orlandoguy points out, they are pretty much the ballgame in the center of town as the traditional department store so it may work for them, particularly given the older demographics in BP/Glenridge.

Sears was a different kettle of fish because they built their store 10 years before the mall opened. The mall was just attached to the existing building. (The irony was Monkey Ward opened a much nicer flagship store on W. Colonial about the same time but it never caught on. If only @JFW657 had worked there instead of the MW in Brevard)

More on this as I hear additional details.

 

To be honest - they should probably convert it to one of the Macy's Backstage concepts. Marshall's, Ross, Burlington are all nearby on Colonial and do quite well. Macy's really should put more emphasis on that brand. The one on Altamonte looks like it was just thrown together. If they actually built out the store as it's own fully realized concept - tied together with the Macy's brand - I think they could succeed. 

[spenser1058]

American Eagle is on the way out at Sanford Town Center. The closest location is Altamonte Mall.

I haven’t been to the Sanford mall in years - are the recent closings going to leave it as a viable retail center or should we look for repurposing to be announced?

https://www.orlandosentinel.com/business/os-cfb-american-eagle-sanford-closes-20200116-gc22mkabvbbpzlbleatx2qdqnm-story.html

From the Sentinel 

Edited January 17, 2020 by spenser1058

[JFW657]

On 1/14/2020 at 12:24 PM, smileguy said:

My understanding is that Macy's is planning to hold onto their store at Fashion Square through the redevelopment of the property, presumably with a major refresh.   We'll see if they stay the course. 

The Macy's at Oviedo Mall is being turned into a 55+ apartments and a hotel.

https://www.orlandoweekly.com/Blogs/archives/2020/01/09/oviedo-mall-will-be-renovated-into-a-hotel-and-apartments

[spenser1058]

3 minutes ago, JFW657 said:

The Macy's at Oviedo Mall is being turned into a 55+ apartments and a hotel.

https://www.orlandoweekly.com/Blogs/archives/2020/01/09/oviedo-mall-will-be-renovated-into-a-hotel-and-apartments

It’s the latest Vertical Medical City!

[spenser1058]

Why dollar stores aren’t the bargain you might think, particularly if there is a traditional alternative nearby:

https://youtu.be/qUknQ06CvqU

From mashed 

[spenser1058]

If this is true (and I’ve seen other reports like it as millennials get older and discover grocery stores and as boomers age), does downtown need more grocery stores and fewer restaurants?

https://twitter.com/mint/status/1207002565553999872?s=21

 

[spenser1058]

With Kroger floundering a bit and Target surging (assuming their meh Christmas this year was just a blip), is it time to rethink a Kroger-Target merger?

Target, although improving is still weak on food (Florida has a lot of SuperTargets but we’re the exception and their market share isn’t terrific)

OTOH, Target would get Kroger into Florida, where it keeps failing.Target also has a stronger presence in states like CA, TX, NY and MN that are weak for Kroger.

Is 2020 the year this match finally makes sense?

https://www.scrapehero.com/kroger-store-locations/

Edited January 23, 2020 by spenser1058

[bqknight]

1 hour ago, spenser1058 said:

With Kroger floundering a bit and Target surging (assuming their meh Christmas this year was just a blip), is it time to rethink a Kroger-Target merger?

Target, although improving is still weak on food (Florida has a lot of SuperTargets but we’re the exception and their market share isn’t terrific)

OTOH, Target would get Kroger into Florida, where it keeps failing.Target also has a stronger presence in states like CA, TX, NY and MN that are weak for Kroger.

Is 2020 this match finally makes sense?

https://www.scrapehero.com/kroger-store-locations/

I quite like Target for their groceries. They’ve improved 100x over just a few years ago. 
 

They recently did a rebrand of their in-house brand - and one thing Target definitely does right is branding their in-house brands. Market Pantry is now Good and Gather. It’s a good mix of everyday staples and premium products. 
 

Target Circle has made it even more enticing to me as well. 
 

Publix and Target are my two grocery stores of choice. 

[HankStrong]

Only if they rebrand like Truist as:

 

Targor, which is light years ahead of Kroget.  Mostly because it reminds me of Trogdor the Burninator.

[spenser1058]

While Seminole Town Center shrinks, downtown Sanford is thriving just five miles away:

https://www.orlandosentinel.com/business/os-bz-sanford-downtown-mall-20200121-2yp6com2sbg4fg6zr3437x2uyq-story.html

Amazing how folks prefer classic old buildings to cold and sterile, isn’t it?

From the Sentinel 

[AmIReal]

58 minutes ago, spenser1058 said:

Amazing how folks prefer classic old buildings to cold and sterile, isn’t it?

Or they like cheap rent and property owners that offer them a free year and build out to entice a particular restaurant/ chef they want.

[spenser1058]

2 hours ago, AmIReal said:

Or they like cheap rent and property owners that offer them a free year and build out to entice a particular restaurant/ chef they want.

And Simon wouldn’t offer incentives at Seminole Town Center right now?

It interests me that, yes, there are lots of folks out there that like sterile suburbs and sterile malls and Stepford environments. I’m happy that they can get everything they need out there. 

That’s what I was raised with and hated every minute of it.

Thankfully, starting in the ‘80’s (because of tax credits by the Reagan folks, oddly enough, for restoration, bless their hearts), we had the opportunity for the rest of us to get away from all that.

It’s why my favorite restaurants are places like Maxine’s, Dexter’s TP and Kres instead of those God awful square boxes on S. Eola. Even  if the Mule does a great job, it just doesn’t attract me.

And that’s fine. You can be blissfully bland in the ‘burbs and build as many of those cookie-cutter places as you want. I embrace all of it for you.

When you tear down one of the classic old places, though, that’s it. We can’t get it back. It’s done for good.

It should be so easy to accept - places for you and places for us.Why do you have to keep taking our places away when there’s endless acres  to sanitize with sameness?

Is it just the money? Is that all that matters?

The Eagles got it right in “The Last Resort”:

https://youtu.be/BgNcv9ODzVY

 

Edited January 24, 2020 by spenser1058

[AmIReal]

10 minutes ago, spenser1058 said:

And Simon wouldn’t offer incentives at Seminole Town Center right now?

They should. Its odd, I keep reading articles about how mall owners refuse to lower rent even though they are losing tenants at a crazy pace.

But to your original point, yes I certainly prefer to stroll Park Ave, 1st St, Plant St or 4th Ave over any of the malls or Disney properties.

[aent]

13 hours ago, AmIReal said:

They should. Its odd, I keep reading articles about how mall owners refuse to lower rent even though they are losing tenants at a crazy pace.

But to your original point, yes I certainly prefer to stroll Park Ave, 1st St, Plant St or 4th Ave over any of the malls or Disney properties.

My understanding is its a few issues:

1) They'd be forced to lower the rent for all the remaining tenants since they'd take those deals and move elsewhere. If they take those deals, they could end up needing 2 or 3 tenants to replace them, so they'd be cannibalizing themselves even further

2) The business model of the malls is really tough right now, and incentivizing someone to start who is going to fail when the incentives are up isn't going to improve the situation

3) Indoor malls have a lot of overhead and operating costs so it doesn't make a whole lot of sense to give such great rates vs being empty. They also need to stay "updated" a whole lot more then other types of retail locations, so more capital costs as well.

They need to reduce supply and figure out a real solution to the problem because its pretty obvious that subsidizing it will just push it down the line a very short amount of time. They need to reinvent themselves like Best Buy did. Change their entire business model. Or at the very least outlast some of the competition so there is a reduction in supply.

[smileguy]

“Instagram museums” are giving way to “shoppable experiences,” and experiential shopping destinations like Area 15 in Las Vegas opening around the country. Memorable in-store experiences were the big buzz at the NRF's annual conference.

https://www.adweek.com/retail/experiences-future-retail-las-vegas-complex-area15-test/?mc_cid=b969a54c8d&mc_eid=b1cc06ece9

 

[AmIReal]

WSJ notes grocery stores are closing their pharmacy counters mainly because they are "too small to wrest competitive reimbursement rates on drugs, they aren’t connected to big medical networks or insurers, and they generally lack walk-in clinics and other health services that draw many customers to CVS and Walgreens locations." The article also points to 90 day supplies that can be provided by mail order.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/the-pharmacist-is-out-supermarkets-close-pharmacy-counters-11580034600

 

[AmIReal]

Another day another grocery store to close. Earth Fare will close 50 stores including 3 in Orlando area.

https://www.bizjournals.com/orlando/news/2020/02/03/earth-fare-to-close-orlando-stores.html?iana=hpmvp_orl_news_headline