Bay Tower (Under Construction)

[BFG]

According to WAVY, the tallest WC building is 14 stories, so what exactly would eight fewer floors do? You'd still have a tall building potentially blocking the views.

More importantly - and I know I ask this question anytime a VB resident goes Full NIMBY - how many of these people lived on Shore Dr. prior to Westminster Canterbury being a thing?

Edited September 19, 2020 by BFG

[baobabs727]

Probably none. 

[vdogg]

6 hours ago, BFG said:

According to WAVY, the tallest WC building is 14 stories, so what exactly would eight fewer floors do? You'd still have a tall building potentially blocking the views.

More importantly - and I know I ask this question anytime a VB resident goes Full NIMBY - how many of these people lived on Shore Dr. prior to Westminster Canterbury being a thing?

A shorter, wider, building will block their view much more than a taller, skinnier, one. These folks make no sense.

[baobabs727]

17 hours ago, vdogg said:

A shorter, wider, building will block their view much more than a taller, skinnier, one. These folks make no sense.

Clearly, it’s all emotion over logic. And boredom for some I’m sure. 

[baobabs727]

John Moss says he agrees with me that is not his job to protect residents’ views.  There’s no legal document guaranteeing said views either.

He does not respond to my assertion that a shorter, fatter building would block additional views anyway  

He said it is his job to apply the comprehensive plan and to protect public access easements. 

He says it is not his job to “enable” developers.  

He argues that if this were a by-right  development, he would not have to weigh in. However,  since he does have to weigh in, he will vote “no” based on his land use principles. 
 

 

[vdogg]

https://www.pilotonline.com/business/vp-nw-westminster-canterbury-0921-20200922-mtesbufhdfecdcp656qmwuoy3q-story.html

"At 92, Heidi Kunsch enjoys living in a condo on the bay.

She moved to Virginia Beach a few years ago to be closer to family. Her partner recently died from cancer, which was really difficult for her — especially during the pandemic. She said she has focused on appreciating the little joys in life.

But that could all change if the city council on Tuesday signs off on a nearby retirement community building a 22-story glass tower and a seven-story memory center with assisted living.

The new additions to Westminster-Canterbury On The Bay would be about 60 feet from her condo and would block her view, she said. Kunsch said she can’t cope with listening to construction over the next five years."

"Westminster-Canterbury on Chesapeake Bay has been around since 1977 and grown substantially over the years. In 1998, the city allowed the company to construct a 14-story building with 146 independent living units. If this expansion is approved, the campus would feature a total of 905 units and 1,096 parking spaces."

They were here first, full stop. Just because you failed to do your due diligence should have no bearing on what they can or cannot build.

[vdogg]

"Todd Solomon, president of Shore Drive Community Coalition, a group that represents civic leagues and condo organizations in the Shore Drive area, said the group opposes the 22-story building because his members don’t think it fits with the residential neighborhood. He fears if the council allows it, it will pave the way for more high rises in the area. He also said the city did not facilitate enough civic dialogue and council members have not been responsive to their concerns."

This may actually go through, we'll see. Lots of headwinds. It'll be important to see what the city attorney says about the height restrictions. I plan to watch the hearing live tonight if I have time.

[BFG]

31 minutes ago, vdogg said:

https://www.pilotonline.com/business/vp-nw-westminster-canterbury-0921-20200922-mtesbufhdfecdcp656qmwuoy3q-story.html

"At 92, Heidi Kunsch enjoys living in a condo on the bay.

She moved to Virginia Beach a few years ago to be closer to family. Her partner recently died from cancer, which was really difficult for her — especially during the pandemic. She said she has focused on appreciating the little joys in life.

But that could all change if the city council on Tuesday signs off on a nearby retirement community building a 22-story glass tower and a seven-story memory center with assisted living.

The new additions to Westminster-Canterbury On The Bay would be about 60 feet from her condo and would block her view, she said. Kunsch said she can’t cope with listening to construction over the next five years."

"Westminster-Canterbury on Chesapeake Bay has been around since 1977 and grown substantially over the years. In 1998, the city allowed the company to construct a 14-story building with 146 independent living units. If this expansion is approved, the campus would feature a total of 905 units and 1,096 parking spaces."

They were here first, full stop. Just because you failed to do your due diligence should have no bearing on what they can or cannot build.

They did the same thing in the mid-2000s when BRAC considered closing Oceana. People who moved next to the base a few years prior complained about jet noise coming from a base that existed before they were even born. 

[vdogg]

Westminster brought a lot of people. They’re bringing out the big guns too.

[vdogg]

Every speaker so far has been in support. I think they brought the whole retirement community with them to the meeting. 

[vdogg]

1 hour in, still no opposing speakers. They’re flooding the zone.

[vdogg]

First opposition is now up to the podium, speaking on behalf of Ocean Shores.

[vdogg]

Whew, this is a marathon. I may have to bow out. 

[vdogg]

Vote is about to called and Henley is speaking.... In favor of the project.  It’s going to pass. There was no second on Moss’s motion to deny. 

[vdogg]

Rouse...is a no. 

Vote passed 5-2. Abbott was absent. I did not have Rouse and Henley switching positions on my 2020 bingo card. 

[baobabs727]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.pilotonline.com/government/local/vp-nw-westminster-canterbury-0924-20200923-smymzhfe4vgpndmhcblvnsi7ta-story.html%3foutputType=amp
 

And boom appproved ! But lawsuit coming....

Edited September 23, 2020 by baobabs727

[BFG]

It's like your favorite team just scored a game-winning TD in the Super Bowl, BUT there's a flag on the play. Sigh.

Interesting that Rouse of all councilmembers was a No.

[baobabs727]

15 hours ago, BFG said:

It's like your favorite team just scored a game-winning TD in the Super Bowl, BUT there's a flag on the play. Sigh.

Interesting that Rouse of all councilmembers was a No.

Agreed. Does anyone know if he explained his vote? Vdogg?  Could it have anything to do with his wanting to run for mayor (again-ish)? 

[baobabs727]

Just watched his remarks, and Rouse said the building was too tall and would stick out like a “sore thumb.” That was his objection.

[baobabs727]

Go Fund Me-backed Lawsuit filed....

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.13newsnow.com/amp/article/news/local/mycity/virginia-beach/condominiums-residents-sue-virginia-beach-over-westminster-canterburys-building-expansion/291-26a0b7a6-4363-4ea8-bde8-f94780d83050

Approaching $17,000 raised. And 
some large contributions, too. We seem to have rich people fighting other rich people. Lol. 

https://www.gofundme.com/f/legal-fees-to-stop-westminster-canterbury

Edited October 26, 2020 by baobabs727

[vdogg]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.wavy.com/news/local-news/virginia-beach/condo-associations-sue-vb-over-approval-of-22-floor-expansion-for-upscale-retirement-community/amp/

According to this article on the lawsuit the building will be 270 ft in height. That's on par with River Tower and will definitely have a presence. It will seem quite tall in that area, but I still don't think it's so far out of character with what already exists nearby.

[vdogg]

The memory care expansion unit, which is the 7-story building that will be across the street, is now working this way through the planning process. The final arguments in the lawsuit were heard this month, though no decision has been made as of yet. This seems to be an indication, however, of the developer’s  confidence that they will prevail.

[vdogg]

Application to begin site work for the Memory Care Unit has been submitted to planning. Not sure the status of the lawsuit, but they appear to be moving forward. I feel that if the judge thought that the lawsuit itself was likely to succeed, they would’ve issued an injunction against for the work. It appears that this has not occurred.

[baobabs727]

On 8/17/2021 at 11:17 AM, vdogg said:

Application to begin site work for the Memory Care Unit has been submitted to planning. Not sure the status of the lawsuit, but they appear to be moving forward. I feel that if the judge thought that the lawsuit itself was likely to succeed, they would’ve issued an injunction against for the work. It appears that this has not occurred.

The judge crushed  the NIMBYs… For now. Possibility of an amended complaint....

https://www.wavy.com/news/local-news/virginia-beach/judge-partially-rejects-neighbors-attempts-to-stop-construction-of-virginia-beachs-3rd-tallest-building/

[vdogg]

10 minutes ago, baobabs727 said:

The judge crushed  the NIMBYs… For now. Possibility of an amended complaint....

https://www.wavy.com/news/local-news/virginia-beach/judge-partially-rejects-neighbors-attempts-to-stop-construction-of-virginia-beachs-3rd-tallest-building/

It appears that said amendment would be related to issues unrelated to height and that the height issue, at least as far as the judge is concerned, is DOA (if I'm reading correctly). It took almost a year for this lawsuit to be settled. If it takes another year for the amendment, the building may be well under construction by the time there's a decision for that. I think that the odds of this building rising as originally intended have risen significantly, I'm giving it 70/30 now.