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24-Story Tower Proposed for Fulton and Ottawa

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On 1/18/2020 at 3:13 PM, Khorasaurus1 said:

Why does the lot have Ottawa address? It abuts Fulton and Ionia, not Ottawa.

Fulton Street itself will need some improved streetscape/trees/median etc with this and the Hinman project. Not a road diet necessarily, but something to make it feel like less of a concrete jungle. 

The vacant land is part of the parcel with the parking ramp. I'm assuming (and I know what assuming can be LOL) that the building will get a Fulton address, maybe  Ionia.

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I'm happy to see such an ambitious project for this site, and that the Wheeler's are using someone other than Concept Design/Ghafari to design the project.   My biggest concern, and it's too early to tell, is how the screening will look for the parking garage.  Wheeler projects have a bad reputation of doing a sub par job of covering parking.  

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My gut tells me that this already been vetted enough that tonight's meeting is a formality and it will be approved.  Interesting that MLive discusses a 1 year option and this is essentially one step of many before shovels actually hit the ground. Fox 17 this morning had a clip that would lead one to infer if approved, this project is moving forward this fall. 

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The designers of this project have a challenge in front of them, because this project will have a big impact on both the corner of Fulton and Ionia and on the skyline. 

So the first floor needs to be designed effectively. Presumably they will retain the entrance to the Fulton-Ottawa garage, but doing that, and access to their own parking garage, and retail storefronts that will survive, will be tricky. There are no retail storefronts on that side of Fulton downtown - at all (kinda-sorta the one at the base of Plaza Towers I guess). They're probably looking at one restaurant/bar because of the proximity to the arena...but is that market saturated? And it will end up being an oddly shaped space because of the parking access. 

And at the top of the building, it's going to be extremely visible in the skyline from the south and east, but it will kind of hide behind Plaza Towers from the west. Not sure about the north. So the south and east sides of the portions of the building above 12-ish stories (LOL) need to be treated with care. It actually seems to me that they should consider reducing the width of the tallest part of the building. Start with 8-10 stories of retail/parking/office that fill the entire footprint, then have a skinnier tower that rises right alongside where the Fulton-Ottawa garage and the CWD building meet. That way the tallest portion won't be oppressive at street level, the overall height of the building could be taller, and it could have some sort of crown feature that would enhance the skyline.

 

Edited by Khorasaurus1
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What I don't see, is a Sky bridge to the Van......Trying to go through there on game day? or a big concert? The cops block the traffic for all the parkers  that want to cross the street there....A covered Sky bridge would help with the swarm....

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3 hours ago, mpchicago said:

I'm happy to see such an ambitious project for this site, and that the Wheeler's are using someone other than Concept Design/Ghafari to design the project.   My biggest concern, and it's too early to tell, is how the screening will look for the parking garage.  Wheeler projects have a bad reputation of doing a sub par job of covering parking.  

Preach!  

Who are they using? I missed it. 

 

1 hour ago, Khorasaurus1 said:

The designers of this project have a challenge in front of them, because this project will have a big impact on both the corner of Fulton and Ionia and on the skyline. 

So the first floor needs to be designed effectively. Presumably they will retain the entrance to the Fulton-Ottawa garage, but doing that, and access to their own parking garage, and retail storefronts that will survive, will be tricky. There are no retail storefronts on that side of Fulton downtown - at all (kinda-sorta the one at the base of Plaza Towers I guess). They're probably looking at one restaurant/bar because of the proximity to the arena...but is that market saturated? And it will end up being an oddly shaped space because of the parking access. 

And at the top of the building, it's going to be extremely visible in the skyline from the south and east, but it will kind of hide behind Plaza Towers from the west. Not sure about the north. So the south and east sides of the portions of the building above 12-ish stories (LOL) need to be treated with care. It actually seems to me that they should consider reducing the width of the tallest part of the building. Start with 8-10 stories of retail/parking/office that fill the entire footprint, then have a skinnier tower that rises right alongside where the Fulton-Ottawa garage and the CWD building meet. That way the tallest portion won't be oppressive at street level, the overall height of the building could be taller, and it could have some sort of crown feature that would enhance the skyline.

 

Preach! 

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6 hours ago, Morris said:

What I don't see, is a Sky bridge to the Van......Trying to go through there on game day? or a big concert? The cops block the traffic for all the parkers  that want to cross the street there....A covered Sky bridge would help with the swarm....

I don’t see the need for a skywalk from a residential building to the arena. The developer certainly won’t pay for it.

Edited by GrSportsGuy
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20 hours ago, GVSUChris said:

I think I read Integrated. 

Interesting! I don't think Integrated has done a lot of high-rises but I like most of their low rise mixed use work (Bridge St Market/Hendrik being one).

17 hours ago, mpchicago said:

The city commission has approved the option for Wheeler Development to purchase the Fulton/Ionia property.   If project moves forward at currently proposed - 24 story - 280 foot height, it would stand slightly taller than the Bridgewater Place office building, making the 4 tallest building in GR.  Bridgewater Place stands at 272 feet tall. 

https://www.mlive.com/news/grand-rapids/2020/01/proposed-24-story-building-in-downtown-grand-rapids-gets-first-approval.html

Exciting! 

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52 minutes ago, WMrapids said:

Just a rough model to give an idea.

A87E5F1B-779F-4416-8272-F0D10CE3EF60.thumb.jpeg.c1a259f23488c791cca999b8c2657817.jpegF506114A-E873-4604-8987-820F75CC0CBF.thumb.jpeg.a17201c20acafb336ee813f94f43a08d.jpeg8949E3BE-5221-44BE-BF9B-319222B553C7.thumb.jpeg.1df06b137aa6f0f460b0bfbfe8e80183.jpegAB2053D5-CBF0-410E-81D9-6E9779913D1C.thumb.jpeg.88e9ce31c7004243ee9903b47641c5e0.jpeg


And the last one is for those of us who still dream...

 

B628AB9A-2819-4F74-9D9C-2BB8236D4C66.thumb.jpeg.86c37c5b84b65a23f18fe8123603fa1a.jpeg

Just imagine that S-Curve view if that last picture came to fruition....

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The funny thing about that report is that he said "we are running out of land to develop". Well there is still that massive lot on Market and Fulton, and the parking lot across the street from that, and the parking lot for Charlie's Crab still sitting empty.

 

That's why I'm a little shocked that this was the property that was sought for this project.

Edited by GR_Urbanist

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8 minutes ago, GR_Urbanist said:

The funny thing about that report is that he said "we are running out of land to develop". Well there is still that massive lot on Market and Fulton, and the parking lot across the street from that, and the parking lot for Charlie's Crab still sitting empty.

 

That's why I'm a little shocked that this was the property that was sought for this project.

Market and Fulton is owned by Amway. And that's going to be developed. It's just a matter of when. 

And yes, I know something. It's just the devil is in the details.

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2 minutes ago, ironyisadeadscene said:

Market and Fulton is owned by Amway. And that's going to be developed. It's just a matter of when. 

And yes, I know something. It's just the devil is in the details.

:stop: Hold up. Let's hear it. ;)

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1 hour ago, GR_Urbanist said:

The funny thing about that report is that he said "we are running out of land to develop". Well there is still that massive lot on Market and Fulton, and the parking lot across the street from that, and the parking lot for Charlie's Crab still sitting empty.

 

My thought was, why did you scale back your other projects like Venue Tower, and why didn't you include more square feet  in your Warner Tower project if land is so scarce?  

Edited by mpchicago
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1 hour ago, GR_Urbanist said:

The funny thing about that report is that he said "we are running out of land to develop". Well there is still that massive lot on Market and Fulton, and the parking lot across the street from that, and the parking lot for Charlie's Crab still sitting empty.

 

That's why I'm a little shocked that this was the property that was sought for this project.

Remember that the city was specifically seeking development partners for this piece of land. Most of the other parcels are already spoken for by other developers, Amway, or Ellis Parking. 

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12 minutes ago, GRDadof3 said:

Remember that the city was specifically seeking development partners for this piece of land. Most of the other parcels are already spoken for by other developers, Amway, or Ellis Parking. 

Yeah, this is City-owned land. Having 20 parking spaces on it makes little to no sense when they could have it on the tax rolls AND have 200 parking spaces (or whatever). 

I suspect Ellis and Charley's Crab are waiting until Amway announces something to do anything with their land. Charley's Crab is a weird throwback to the Grand Rapids of 25 years ago...

 

Edited by Khorasaurus1

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