Richmond Resort & Casino

[wrldcoupe4]

You can't change your mind about the location once you submit in a procurement situation like that.  I could see you arguing the merits of a process which first selected an operator and then selecting a site thereafter. 

[Icetera]

36 minutes ago, wrldcoupe4 said:

No operator offered downtown or Manchester though...

Wind Creek did, but that proposal was never going to happen.

[CitiWalker]

I still say it is a  win win for the City.  The biggest thing  being traffic flow and accessibility. You have several  hotels in the vicinity.  Coming down 95 going north seeing a nice sized hotel is going set the stage  as   you enter the city limits.  It will also be a catalyst for other developments that hope to benefit  from  the casino clients . Plus they are going to have a studio and entertainment venue.  It is a great way to infill unused land . Most of all the citizens who it would affect the most in terms of placement welcome them there.  That area of the  city can use something to draw extra business and development.  I said it in  a previous post Richmond Hwy is not  going to look the same10 years from now.  We have already seen to beginning of the conversion of The Model Tobacco Company Apartments start to take shape at one end. Having a casino at the other end  will only promote development between the two along that valuable stretch of road. IMHO I am happy with the choice. 

[Icetera]

1 hour ago, CitiWalker said:

The biggest thing  being traffic flow and accessibility. You have several  hotels in the vicinity.  Coming down 95 going north seeing a nice sized hotel is going set the stage  as   you enter the city limits.  It will also be a catalyst for other developments that hope to benefit  from  the casino clients . Plus they are going to have a studio and entertainment venue.  It is a great way to infill unused land . Most of all the citizens who it would affect the most in terms of placement welcome them there.  That area of the  city can use something to draw extra business and development.  I said it in  a previous post Richmond Hwy is not  going to look the same10 years from now.  We have already seen to beginning of the conversion of The Model Tobacco Company Apartments start to take shape at one end. Having a casino at the other end  will only promote development between the two along that valuable stretch of road. IMHO I am happy with the choice. 

Unfortunately, I cannot share your enthusiasm here.   While the hotel will have some visual impact (assuming that it does not get downgraded back to original proposal), it will still be surrounded by smoke stacks.  Unlike Manchester or Scott's Addition, this area is remaining as active, heavy industry and that will not change any time in the near future.  The Port of Richmond has expanded, spec warehouses were just built in the past few years and Philip Morris, DuPont and the coal power station are certainly not going to relocate.  If anything, this location actually eliminates the last parcel that could have attracted another major manufacturer, which would also have been a potential job creator and economic generator, but with more longevity.  While that industry may not be pretty, it is a great gateway in its own way as it highlights Richmond as being a city with a diverse economy. 

There is three miles of industry, trailer parks, and suburban decay between this proposal and the Southern tip of the Manchester renaissance (Model Tobacco).  That is a large gap to overcome.  Traffic is not going to generate much business on Richmond Hwy as patrons will simple enter from I-95 and then leave from I-95.  There is zero walkability and connectivity to the area, therefore, no foot traffic.  Even their own park requires a long hike across surface parking.  The few developable parcels nearby are not attractive to residential and air quality is not going to be viable for restaurants that are likely going to want outdoor seating post-COVID.   The few hotels at the Bells interchange will certainly benefit but any new ones would likely be built one exit down at the Bellwood interchange in Chesterfield.  Being on the Chesterfield border means most new businesses will choose the cheaper county tax rates over the city.  The new businesses Richmond will see on Richmond Hwy: strip clubs and fast food. 

While the studio is cool, it is essentially a stand alone industry rather than a amenity and could have been built without eating up the single casino license.  The entertainment space is a lesser version of what would have been built with Live!, and also with no public transport.  While the project in Scott's Addition would likely have attracted patrons from the wealthier Western sections of the  metro, this instead will primarily pull from the poorer Southern end while doing little to invigorate it.  Many of those patrons are likely already going to Rosie's, so rather than having two different facilities at varying ends of the scale, this will simply shuffle some existing revenue around leading to less gains than envisioned.

At this point I feel the best thing is to vote NO on the referendum and then situate ourselves to encourage new industry on this property.


* oops, only one "L"

 

[wrldcoupe4]

That map only shows the back portion of their site. 

[wrldcoupe4]

I the area labeled coal power station - it’s owned by DuPont. Is it generation for their facility?  Doesn’t kinder Morgan own the back portion of it? Sorry not to nit, just seemed off so I referred to the GIS. 

[wrldcoupe4]

Also your prediction of the future is pretty depressing but also highly speculative. How does that jive with the thoughts of residents in South Richmond? 

[Icetera]

7 minutes ago, wrldcoupe4 said:

That map only shows the back portion of their site. 

Yup, I missed the front giant surface lot and gave them more wetland when going off the render.

2 minutes ago, wrldcoupe4 said:

I the area labeled coal power station - it’s owned by DuPont. Is it generation for their facility?  Doesn’t kinder Morgan own the back portion of it? Sorry not to nit, just seemed off so I referred to the GIS. 

I thought it was a separate company but apparently it is not according to GIS.  I know its coal/gas from my past digs into area power stations (one of my weird interests).

[skinsfan]

34 minutes ago, Icetera said:

Yup, I missed the front giant surface lot and gave them more wetland when going off the render.

I thought it was a separate company but apparently it is not according to GIS.  I know its coal/gas from my past digs into area power stations (one of my weird interests).

Cogentrix is the power supplier I believe.   What an absolute dumpster fire the city has turned this into. Their ineptitude is beyond belief. I’m sure the “ best “ proposal did not get the nod but the black owned casino weighed heavy on the decision. 

[Hike]

$600 million investment, who would have guessed Scott's addition became what it did, railroad tracks, power lines,  old warehouses, who knows. 

Philip Morris is iconic architecture, some parts of heavy industry are interesting, cranes at the port, I95 bustling, the power plant just past Chippenham is huge,  when driving north it's the first large scale structure and then not much almost until your first view of the city at P.M., this could be something, thinking positive.

Edited May 20, 2021 by Hike

[Icetera]

24 minutes ago, wrldcoupe4 said:

Also your prediction of the future is pretty depressing but also highly speculative. How does that jive with the thoughts of residents in South Richmond? 

Definitely speculative as I cannot find any examples of successful resort-style casinos in heavy industrial areas.  The closest is the new Encore in Boston but that has only been completed recently with the nearby region already in transition.  They certainly did not try to capitalize on outdoor amenities.

As far as the neighborhood, nearly every corner of Richmond is seeing new housing going up, except for this stretch of Richmond Hwy.  This corridor is also the only one bordering heavy industry.  While of course there are other factors, you cannot deny that heavy industrial is a very unattractive neighbor to have.  Other than jobs (half of the other proposal), I am not seeing what ONE Casino is providing that will improve the quality of life in the area.   Even the park requires cutting down existing trees that would mitigate noise and pollution.   Realistically, how do you foresee this being a catalyst to transform this area?

[Brent114]

I wouldn’t call this area heavy industry.

 
Let’s not pretend that Richmond is some huge geographic area.  In a real city this location would still be considered downtown.   It is about as far from downtown as the arenas in Philadelphia are from downtown there... JFK to downtown Washington. 
 

The  Scott’s Addition location was pure trash.  It was small in thinking, provincial and ugly.  Putting all of your assets in a small area is goofy and is what small cities do when they have nothing else going on.  Expanding Richmond development by  dropping a southern anchor is smart.  It will be no more or less successful as any other location (Fan residents were never going to go to Live and everyone else in the metro would be driving anyway so it didn’t  matter where it landed).  If successful it will hasten the filling in between Chippenham and Manchester. 
If it fails, so what. 
 

[Icetera]

42 minutes ago, Hike said:

Philip Morris is iconic architecture, some parts of heavy industry are interesting, cranes at the port, I95 bustling, the power plant just past Chippenham is huge,  when driving north it's the first large scale structure and then not much almost until your first view of the city at P.M.

Yes, and I absolutely love that approach because of it, but that does not mean I would actually want to live or dine next to it.  Not every neighborhood needs to contain housing and restaurants.  It would have been great if we had actually encouraged the industries leaving Manchester and Scott's Addition to relocate to this stretch rather than to the surrounding counties.

[wrldcoupe4]

1 hour ago, skinsfan said:

Cogentrix is the power supplier I believe.   What an absolute dumpster fire the city has turned this into. Their ineptitude is beyond belief. I’m sure the “ best “ proposal did not get the nod but the black owned casino weighed heavy on the decision. 

It’s also possible they perceived the black owned casino to be the best, not just because it was black owned…………

[Hike]

21 minutes ago, Icetera said:

Yes, and I absolutely love that approach because of it, but that does not mean I would actually want to live or dine next to it.  Not every neighborhood needs to contain housing and restaurants.  It would have been great if we had actually encouraged the industries leaving Manchester and Scott's Addition to relocate to this stretch rather than to the surrounding counties.

Agree, I'm not moving there either at this point in my life.  Pittsburgh, where I spent considerable time,  from steel and heavy industry to what it is now, the transformation all started somewhere. 

[CitiWalker]

There seems to be a lot of opinions which is a good thing for  productive healthy debate.  If Richmond is to morph into a complete city (meaning having various options throughout the city) we cannot afford to have all of our eggs in one basket and rely on one area of the city to provide everything.  I was not totally against the Cordish  proposal but the Urban  One makes more  sense. It is speculation to say that  the development in no way would have an effect on future development and optimism for the area. As far as other casinos go Richmond has a chance to be a forerunner  instead of an also ran. VISION.  It has been what citizens have been lacking. If you go after nothing then you get nothing. The citizens in Scotts Edition did not want the casino there and they were heard. NO GUARANTEES. In life as we all know you cant guarantee  a thing. Southside is on fire right now and it makes sense to capitalize on momentum and stop the knuckle dragging and second guessing that has shackled Richmond's development for decades. There is a huge assumption that the Richmond Hwy corridor is  just going to stay the same.  I see prime real estate with a built in connector linking Manchester to northern Chesterfield.  Before I95 was built that route was a major artery through the city. It now has  a shot at a second life and  a new purpose. Does anyone really think that in  10 years that major connector would not be utilized  and repurposed  by development? As developers start to look outside the periphery of the Manchester  Area  they are going to look to engage in new opportunities  to expand and grow  from the successes we are now seeing. It is more than exciting to understand the  potential  of expansion and development of  The Richmond Hwy Corridor. No one ever talks about  this major connector. There was once a major grocery store along this route.  I can see that coming back. I  can see newer retail and dinning locations popping up. Yes  the Radio one is situated in an industrial area but it will be surrounded by existing hotels and could be a beacon for more hotel development seeking to seize the revenue of those who come from the outside to visit the casino, take advantage of the shows. and production facilities.  Everyone is not just going  want to eat at the casino. There is room for more dinning options and shopping options. The potential for residual income  is there for the taking.  

Edited May 21, 2021 by CitiWalker

[Icetera]

1 hour ago, CitiWalker said:

The citizens in Scotts Edition did not want the casino there and they were heard.

This is another thing that bugs me.  I have seen complaints from Ginter Park and the West Grace Street Association, but not from actual Scott's Addition residents.  There were concerns from Scott's Addition businesses but not the represented majority, hence their official position being no opposition.  Scott's Addition residents are almost entirely renters drawn to the area for the entertainment options so it would not be logical for them to be against more options.

1 hour ago, CitiWalker said:

Everyone is not just going  want to eat at the casino. There is room for more dinning options and shopping options. The potential for residual income  is there for the taking.  

The biggest argument in support of ONE versus Live! was that casinos keep patrons in the complex to spend money, therefore, draw away from area businesses.  Since ONE was isolated it would not negatively impact area businesses.  Under that logic, it should also not create any new businesses, especially since it is connected directly to the interstate. 

Had we encouraged better connectivity over the rail-line to Richmond Hwy, and a walkable experience between them, then I could see the potential for spurring development in the few blocks nearby that are actually in Richmond.  Without that, there is no encouragement for patrons to drive up Bells Road when they can just hop on the highway to Chesterfield.  As another poster pointed out, Richmond is geographically small making it is easy to drop your money in the county, especially if you are already in the car.  Dale Ave. potentially exists as an unmaintained crossing, but I have not seen any indication of ONE using and improving it.  We could have leveraged extending Walmsley across for ideal connectivity but instead we have a disconnected park.  There is potential for the site itself but the current proposal fails to leverage it and the operator is questionable.

[Icetera]

13 hours ago, Hike said:

Agree, I'm not moving there either at this point in my life.  Pittsburgh, where I spent considerable time,  from steel and heavy industry to what it is now, the transformation all started somewhere. 

That transformation started with those industries failing.  That is not something we should be encouraging, and thankfully, that does not appear to be the case here.  While Pittsburgh is one of my favorite U.S. cities, it sadly is still hemorrhaging residents (though the rate has significantly dropped).  While it is great that Reynolds leaving Richmond opened up some centrally connected properties, it still hurts that we lost them as as an employer and tax base.

[Hike]

2 minutes ago, Icetera said:

That transformation started with those industries failing.  That is not something we should be encouraging, and thankfully, that does not appear to be the case here.  While Pittsburgh is one of my favorite U.S. cities, it sadly is still hemorrhaging residents (though the rate has significantly dropped).  While it is great that Reynolds leaving Richmond opened up some centrally connected properties, it still hurts that we lost them as as an employer and tax base.

Agree, people were leaving Pitt at a higher rate than they are today, an aging population, kids leaving, not coming back or not enticed enough to live there, which was me.  I'm sure there are some that miss the old days, which was soot and smoke filled skies, slag dumps along the railroad tracks, but today it's a cleaner city, a higher educated city, proud of it's past and what it once was but doubt the city would trade where they are now for the old days again.  

[I miss RVA]

2 hours ago, Icetera said:

This is another thing that bugs me.  I have seen complaints from Ginter Park and the West Grace Street Association, but not from actual Scott's Addition residents.  There were concerns from Scott's Addition businesses but not the represented majority, hence their official position being no opposition.  Scott's Addition residents are almost entirely renters drawn to the area for the entertainment options so it would not be logical for them to be against more options.

This is a very strong point, Icetera. Another facet about the residential breakout -- and the relative strength of opposition -- is the fact that likely most of the new residents of Scott's Addition also happen to be new residents to RVA, having come here from other cities/localities around the country. The residents of W. Grace Street & almost assuredly Ginter Park are in all likelihood in great numbers "old school" Richmond. That said, any surprise that there was little residential opposition voiced by Scott's Addition residents - but complaints loud and long from Ginter Park and W. Grace Street?

Totally different mindsets altogether.

[DalWill]

2 hours ago, I miss RVA said:

This is a very strong point, Icetera. Another facet about the residential breakout -- and the relative strength of opposition -- is the fact that likely most of the new residents of Scott's Addition also happen to be new residents to RVA, having come here from other cities/localities around the country. The residents of W. Grace Street & almost assuredly Ginter Park are in all likelihood in great numbers "old school" Richmond. That said, any surprise that there was little residential opposition voiced by Scott's Addition residents - but complaints loud and long from Ginter Park and W. Grace Street?

Totally different mindsets altogether.

BINGO!! While I'm all for ONE , I've recognized this tactic that was similarly used to cannibalize Navy Hill (I'm still quite sour about that, even though I'm not far away from Green City). That's a problem that needs to be addressed, because  communities and councilors will NOT have a sound discussion on how to revamp areas and what could be the best usage for the redeveloped land that's accessible to ALL and not just a SELECTED group of people. The real estate around Bowtie is prime and fertile; Cordish is NOT dropping their interest so easily.  Hell, anywhere in Richmond.  I suggest Cordish work on 6th Street Marketplace and Blues Armory and initaited that aspect of what Navy Hill tried to accomplish.

Anywhoo, one districts loss is another's gain.  The more I look at the area where ONE will be,  A. LOT. of zoning policies surrounding ONE will have to change once the casino comes into play. That's the biggest benefactor out of this redevelopment. As well as a possible widening of Commerce Rd and a new bus route. I wouldn't surprise if  a satellite city-residential neighborhood (correction: edge city) will be born soon from this (well, one can dream and hope).

Edited May 21, 2021 by DalWill

[CitiWalker]

4 hours ago, DalWill said:

BINGO!! While I'm all for ONE , I've recognized this tactic that was similarly used to cannibalize Navy Hill (I'm still quite sour about that, even though I'm not far away from Green City). That's a problem that needs to be addressed, because  communities and councilors will NOT have a sound discussion on how to revamp areas and what could be the best usage for the redeveloped land that's accessible to ALL and not just a SELECTED group of people. The real estate around Bowtie is prime and fertile; Cordish is NOT dropping their interest so easily.  Hell, anywhere in Richmond.  I suggest Cordish work on 6th Street Marketplace and Blues Armory and initaited that aspect of what Navy Hill tried to accomplish.

Anywhoo, one districts loss is another's gain.  The more I look at the area where ONE will be,  A. LOT. of zoning policies surrounding ONE will have to change once the casino comes into play. That's the biggest benefactor out of this redevelopment. As well as a possible widening of Commerce Rd and a new bus route. I wouldn't surprise if  a satellite city-residential neighborhood will be born soon from this (well, one can dream and hope is would.

This is exactly the point I wanted to make. There is a chance to use One a a fuse to ignite the entire area.  Commerce Rd directly branches into Richmond Hwy which in itself can be a whole other topic.  Even if One wanted to keep everything on site, people by our curious nature will venture out to see what else they can discover.  We can have multiple districts with their own distinct identity. Richmond already has a variety of neighborhoods. Why not have multiple districts  showing different levels of inclusion and diversity. SATELLITE-CITY... I can see that and I would love that. Fuse that with a downtown near  Innsbrook and we can have urban areas within urban areas, cities within counties and a much broader urban landscape in The Greater Richmond Region. Isn't it fun to be able to even be on this forum talking about such things. Richmond has a bright future.

Edited May 21, 2021 by CitiWalker

[Icetera]

To get an idea of what projects may come directly out of this, I took a look at their list of investors.  Most are athletes, entertainers, doctors, lawyers and marketing agents, so they are simply just looking for a return.  Quite a few are execs from Dominion Energy (including new President), Altria, and Astyra Corporation.  Obviously Altria is selling the land and Astyra is likely seeking the massive staffing contract.  The names that are interesting:

Neil Amin - CEO of Shamin Hotels
Will Shamin be involved in ONE's hotel, build another nearby, or is he simply betting on increased traffic down to his collection of hotels at Rt. 10?

Chris Tsui - President of EAT Restaurant Partners (Boulevard Burgers & Brew, Fat Dragon, etc)
It has  been known that EAT would be one of the vendors in ONE.

Lester Johnson - Owner of Mama J's / Vagabond
Lester is the other known local restauranteur opening in ONE.  Just reading this has me craving some tasty catfish.

Devon Henry - CEO & President of Team Henry Enterprises LLC
This is the man that headed up taking down the statues last summer.  Regardless of how people feel about the statues or the current investigations surrounding their removal, this man does deserve mad respect for putting himself at risk to do the job.  I would be curious to see if his company will be involved in this project.

Michelle Mosby - Former Richmond City Council President and former Consultant for Navy Hill District Corp.
Ahhh, now there is someone that knows how to play the game in Richmond.  I wonder how many "protesters" she paid this time.

 

[I miss RVA]

From the Richmond Times-Dispatch: City and Developer aiming for a 2023 opening for the Urban One.

A little disconcerting: The Times-Dispatch is reporting that the hotel will be "at least 12 stories". Was that ever determined in the final presentation to the city? I'd hate to see the hotel getting scaled back. Also the RTD is saying 250 rooms. Wasn't that number beefed up considerably?

https://richmond.com/news/city-officials-developer-targeting-2023-opening-date-for-560m-urban-one-casino-in-south-richmond/article_94d183bf-26e8-50e8-90cf-3b265e0997a5.html#tracking-source=home-trending

Edited May 27, 2021 by I miss RVA

[Icetera]

19 hours ago, I miss RVA said:

From the Richmond Times-Dispatch: City and Developer aiming for a 2023 opening for the Urban One.

A little disconcerting: The Times-Dispatch is reporting that the hotel will be "at least 12 stories". Was that ever determined in the final presentation to the city? I'd hate to see the hotel getting scaled back. Also the RTD is saying 250 rooms. Wasn't that number beefed up considerably?

https://richmond.com/news/city-officials-developer-targeting-2023-opening-date-for-560m-urban-one-casino-in-south-richmond/article_94d183bf-26e8-50e8-90cf-3b265e0997a5.html#tracking-source=home-trending

250 rooms was the beefed up number which placed them on par with Bally's and only 50 less than Live!.  Their original proposal was only 150 total rooms and they also had increased floors in their rendering from 14 to 20.  Given that their stated investment appears to have dropped $40 million since being selected (according to the article), I would not be surprised if they scaled back the tower some.  It is not like they do not have plenty of land to spread it across so less floors would be better cost-wise.