Lake Eola Park

[JFW657]

10 hours ago, codypet said:

Nah I was born in the 80's so I can't retire until 2070 at the earliest. 

Not sure whether to envy your youth or pity your having to work another 50  years....     

[nite owℓ]

On 1/27/2022 at 1:09 PM, JFW657 said:

The thing about Lakes Davis and Cherokee are the surrounding neighborhoods. 

They have both kept that "old Orlando" feel.

Another nice thing is that all three are in the same vicinity with each other.

Davis and Cherokee are literally right next to each other and Greenwood is a fairly short walk up Mills Avenue north towards the 408 aka the East West Expressway. 

You can park your car in one place and do everything on foot.

Nice little place to rest and eat on Mills right next to Lake Davis.

I still own a lil place in that area... closer to Lake Davis but nothing fancy, it was my starter home.

Some residents wanted to convert Lake Davis-Geenwood (it's all one neighborhood not two BTW) into a historic district, but there was fierce pushback against it. Some residents are upset because smaller homes have been destroyed to build bigger homes that don't really fit into the character of the neighborhood. Of course the people with larger, newer homes appreciate the "diversity of architecture" and freedom to build whatever they want.

The whole plan was to protect historic "contributing" homes and trees and ensure newer builds blend in with the aesthetic. But nope, the plan got shut down due to illogical boogeyman arguments. Other historic downtown neighborhoods like Lake Cherokee, Copeland, Lawsona, Eola Heights are doing just fine so I don't get what the big fuss was about.

https://www.clickorlando.com/news/local/2021/02/03/residents-in-orlandos-lake-davis-greenwood-community-dont-want-historic-neighborhood-designation/

https://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/orange-county/os-ne-prem-orlando-lake-davis-historic-20210210-4qlmlkmtefe4zg7p4wtbmmfvxi-story.html

[jack]

1 hour ago, nite owℓ said:

I still own a lil place in that area... closer to Lake Davis but nothing fancy, it was my starter home.

Some residents wanted to convert Lake Davis-Geenwood (it's all one neighborhood not two BTW) into a historic district, but there was fierce pushback against it. Some residents are upset because smaller homes have been destroyed to build bigger homes that don't really fit into the character of the neighborhood. Of course the people with larger, newer homes appreciate the "diversity of architecture" and freedom to build whatever they want.

The whole plan was to protect historic "contributing" homes and trees and ensure newer builds blend in with the aesthetic. But nope, the plan got shut down due to illogical boogeyman arguments. Other historic downtown neighborhoods like Lake Cherokee, Copeland, Lawsona, Eola Heights are doing just fine so I don't get what the big fuss was about.

https://www.clickorlando.com/news/local/2021/02/03/residents-in-orlandos-lake-davis-greenwood-community-dont-want-historic-neighborhood-designation/

https://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/orange-county/os-ne-prem-orlando-lake-davis-historic-20210210-4qlmlkmtefe4zg7p4wtbmmfvxi-story.html

Primarily, the people that live in the historic districts bought when the districts were already designated. Living in a neighborhood that gets designated is a different beast. 

[nite owℓ]

24 minutes ago, jack said:

Primarily, the people that live in the historic districts bought when the districts were already designated. Living in a neighborhood that gets designated is a different beast. 

Point taken, but it's not like historic districts are born out of thin air though. Neighbors band together and designate them so at some point in time people living in a regular neighborhood will be subject to the conversion. BTW, I think the rules for Lake Davis were going to be even less restrictive than some of the other historic districts. Personally, Lake Davis was not where I wanted to be in my 20's, but I slowly warmed up to the area so I might see things a little differently. I really wanted to be in a historic district or Thornton Park, but could not compete in the housing market at the time.

Lake Cherokee, Copeland Eola Heights became historic districts in the 80's and Lawsona in the 90's. Homeowners saw the value in historic preservation and had the foresight to protect what makes each neighborhood special. Lake Davis should do the same.

[codypet]

Funny because with the number of homes in the neighborhood east of Greenwood being torn down and rebuilt, some of the old timers have broached designating that neighborhood as a historic district, but it gets shut down pretty quick.   The first I started hearing about it was when Lake Como School was knocked down.  

Somewhat related, the Dover Shores East neighborhood complained in a public meeting that they didn't want a K-8 because the look of the new Lake Como School had "ruined the entire neighborhood around it"   I don't know how.

 

[dwSouthEola]

I was part of a 'community leader' training series at city hall and one week the topic was development and the future of Orlando.  I expressed excitement over our neighborhood transforming from empty grass lots in the 90s to everything we see today, and that South Eola continues to be developed and grow.  At this point someone from Eola Heights mentioned historic designation.  They turned to me and said "No offense but we fought for our historic designation, we've been a historic district since the 80s and on the national register since the 90s - if we hadn't we'd probably be the same as South Eola".

Ouch?  Idk.  I love our neighborhood and wonder would Eola heights really have seen such huge development without historic status?  It wasn't empty land.  Certainly if anyone in South Eola had protested to the church being torn down where Sanctuary is today, it would have preserved history but stunted growth.  Which can be a hard thing to work through when you care about either or both.  The mix of the old and the new definitely gives downtown Orlando a lot character.  In the end it's up to whoever lives in any of these neighborhoods when the proposal is made.  Eola Heights had enough of those people at the time.  In 10-20yrs a yes could turn to a no (and vice versa) with a complete turnover in residents either from moving, passing away, changing their mind, who knows.

[codypet]

I doubt you would have unless Eola Heights was also filled with dilapidated homes like South Eola did.  I wouldn't be surprised if the people wouldn't have been priced out of the neighborhood or not, but I think you might here and there have a couple of lots pulled together for small apartments, but nothing at the scale of South Eola.  Personally I think the designation prevented Eola Heights to be dotted with these, like what you see in the Davis and Colonialtown Neighborhoods.

[popsiclebrandon]

As someone who lived in Eola Heights for like 6-7 years I would never buy a home there.

[jack]

22 hours ago, dwSouthEola said:

I was part of a 'community leader' training series at city hall and one week the topic was development and the future of Orlando.  I expressed excitement over our neighborhood transforming from empty grass lots in the 90s to everything we see today, and that South Eola continues to be developed and grow.  At this point someone from Eola Heights mentioned historic designation.  They turned to me and said "No offense but we fought for our historic designation, we've been a historic district since the 80s and on the national register since the 90s - if we hadn't we'd probably be the same as South Eola".

Ouch?  Idk.  I love our neighborhood and wonder would Eola heights really have seen such huge development without historic status?  It wasn't empty land.  Certainly if anyone in South Eola had protested to the church being torn down where Sanctuary is today, it would have preserved history but stunted growth.  Which can be a hard thing to work through when you care about either or both.  The mix of the old and the new definitely gives downtown Orlando a lot character.  In the end it's up to whoever lives in any of these neighborhoods when the proposal is made.  Eola Heights had enough of those people at the time.  In 10-20yrs a yes could turn to a no (and vice versa) with a complete turnover in residents either from moving, passing away, changing their mind, who knows.

From what I recall from the old timers, the real pressure was from multiplexes, etc. They used the high rise rhetoric as a warning of what could come. But the immediate threat were the homes being demolished for generic boxes and the larger homes chopped up for flop houses. And of course, the drugs.

[nite owℓ]

On 2/3/2022 at 2:38 PM, popsiclebrandon said:

As someone who lived in Eola Heights for like 6-7 years I would never buy a home there.

What didn't you like about LEH? Or are you over downtown in general now??

[popsiclebrandon]

15 hours ago, nite owℓ said:

What didn't you like about LEH? Or are you over downtown in general now??

Some of the bigger issues are more of the issue of ownership than renting. The requirements imposed because of the historic designation require lengthier and more expensive repairs and updates. The rules on windows and the like making energy efficiency harder to achieve. The roads are absolutely horrible and not maintained. There are constant posts about people breaking in or attempting to break into houses. In general I am over downtown and don't find many parts of it appealing at all. Moved to College Park, and outside the lack of diversity, its a really great place to live. Never worry about people harassing me or my car or home being broken into. The streets aren't full of 3 foot holes that take 2-3 years to get filled then immediately sink again. If I was going to spend high 6/ low 7 figures on a home LEH is absolutely bottom of the list. Delaney or CP seem like much better options.

[codypet]

21 hours ago, popsiclebrandon said:

Some of the bigger issues are more of the issue of ownership than renting. The requirements imposed because of the historic designation require lengthier and more expensive repairs and updates. The rules on windows and the like making energy efficiency harder to achieve. The roads are absolutely horrible and not maintained. There are constant posts about people breaking in or attempting to break into houses. In general I am over downtown and don't find many parts of it appealing at all. Moved to College Park, and outside the lack of diversity, its a really great place to live. Never worry about people harassing me or my car or home being broken into. The streets aren't full of 3 foot holes that take 2-3 years to get filled then immediately sink again. If I was going to spend high 6/ low 7 figures on a home LEH is absolutely bottom of the list. Delaney or CP seem like much better options.

No arguments here.

[dwSouthEola]

On 2/6/2022 at 2:05 PM, popsiclebrandon said:

lengthier and more expensive repairs and updates

I lived in Eola Heights for 10yrs, at one point termite damage caused a window frame to completely disintegrate. They were 'french windows' that opened outward from the center and because they had to be repaired in line with whatever the historic review board dictated property management simply came and nailed a board across, causing the windows not to open. It was left that way for the entire time I lived there.

I've heard landlords say things like they're letting their rental property in historic districts fall into such disrepair so that eventually they can be deemed a 'non contributing structure' and torn down to build something else. Idk if this is a real thing though, didn't a really run down house on Cathcart go on the market last year as a tear down and the community fought it so it sold with the understanding it would have to be repaired?

Edited February 8, 2022 by dwSouthEola

[nite owℓ]

On 2/6/2022 at 2:05 PM, popsiclebrandon said:

Some of the bigger issues are more of the issue of ownership than renting. The requirements imposed because of the historic designation require lengthier and more expensive repairs and updates. The rules on windows and the like making energy efficiency harder to achieve. The roads are absolutely horrible and not maintained. There are constant posts about people breaking in or attempting to break into houses. In general I am over downtown and don't find many parts of it appealing at all. Moved to College Park, and outside the lack of diversity, its a really great place to live. Never worry about people harassing me or my car or home being broken into. The streets aren't full of 3 foot holes that take 2-3 years to get filled then immediately sink again. If I was going to spend high 6/ low 7 figures on a home LEH is absolutely bottom of the list. Delaney or CP seem like much better options.

Traitor!

There are ways to achieve energy efficiency by using clear ceramic window films, weatherproofing and even installing "Indow" window inserts. Or spend the money to install architectural windows when possible. Better windows with muntins rather than cheap vinyl windows shoehorned onto a bungalow. Plus there are tax exemptions for restoring historic homes.

I grew up in CP. It was nice (albeit not diverse back then either) but as far as I know they still have problems with break-ins except they're not in the thick of it compared to downtown. Back in the 90s my neighbors in CP were mostly old people... some were original residents so I had a few grandma's to feed me lol. I guess CP is a turn off for me because it's missing an edge. It's become kind of an annoying modern "white picket fence/instagram/young family" area which is not my cup of tea.

IMO, Winter Park is where it's at... except for that pesky million dollar price tag. I used to think WP was too sterile, but the money keeps the riff raff away which is what ruins downtown Orlando for me.

8 hours ago, dwSouthEola said:

I lived in Eola Heights for 10yrs, at one point termite damage caused a window frame to completely disintegrate. They were 'french windows' that opened outward from the center and because they had to be repaired in line with whatever the historic review board dictated property management simply came and nailed a board across, causing the windows not to open. It was left that way for the entire time I lived there.

I've heard landlords say things like they're letting their rental property in historic districts fall into such disrepair so that eventually they can be deemed a 'non contributing structure' and torn down to build something else. Idk if this is a real thing though, didn't a really run down house on Cathcart go on the market last year as a tear down and the community fought it so it sold with the understanding it would have to be repaired?

That's sad. Why own/buy a home in a historic area if not an enthusiast? It's like buying a luxury vehicle and complaining about having to pay for premium gas & expensive maintenance... it's not for everyone. Some people just don't value historic things and only care about collecting rent. I know a lady who owns a rental in one of the historic districts but it was kind of run down until necessary repairs came up. Meanwhile she lives in a nice home WP and would never tolerate what she allows her rental property to look like.

[codypet]

9 hours ago, nite owℓ said:

That's sad. Why own/buy a home in a historic area if not an enthusiast? It's like buying a luxury vehicle and complaining about having to pay for premium gas & expensive maintenance... it's not for everyone. Some people just don't value historic things and only care about collecting rent. I know a lady who owns a rental in one of the historic districts but it was kind of run down until necessary repairs came up. Meanwhile she lives in a nice home WP and would never tolerate what she allows her rental property to look like.

I see that a lot!

[orange87]

I'm probably way late on this, but I just realized the dumpy 7-Eleven building got demolished. Here's a pic from Google Maps.

[spenser1058]

17 minutes ago, orange87 said:

I'm probably way late on this, but I just realized the dumpy 7-Eleven building got demolished. Here's a pic from Google Maps.

Yep, it has been a very, ummmm, popular topic around here. /s

If you have been reading in another thread about Cameron Kuhn, the building in the pic is one he refurbed.

[orange87]

Orlando begins expansion of signature Lake Eola Park, with overhaul to come

Article: https://www.orlandosentinel.com/2023/08/04/orlando-begins-expansion-of-signature-lake-eola-park-with-overhaul-to-come/?fbclid=IwAR2ceLhmjuuhrQeneCQilGWpG8vjZYRt4Hdeg3u_ESqKEaoFWC-QR1Tv9r4

[orlandocity87]

14 hours ago, orange87 said:

City: "Here's your $49 crepe myrtle from Home Depot and some rocks, enjoy! ✌"

Edited August 9, 2023 by orlandocity87

[JFW657]

1 hour ago, orlandocity87 said:

City: "Here's your $49 crepe myrtle from Home Depot and some rocks, enjoy! ✌"

Looking at some of the questionable designs that get approved around here, one really has to wonder if there are any basic qualifications whatsoever for being allowed to call oneself an architect.  

No seating underneath the one crappy little "shade" tree, all the other "seating", which appears to be very uncomfortable looking big rocks, is out in the hot sun. 

I'm guessing the designers of this joke are probably from out of state and have likely never even visited Florida.

At least not in the summer. 

[jack]

On 8/9/2023 at 12:20 PM, JFW657 said:

Looking at some of the questionable designs that get approved around here, one really has to wonder if there are any basic qualifications whatsoever for being allowed to call oneself an architect.  

No seating underneath the one crappy little "shade" tree, all the other "seating", which appears to be very uncomfortable looking big rocks, is out in the hot sun. 

I'm guessing the designers of this joke are probably from out of state and have likely never even visited Florida.

At least not in the summer. 

More likely the City was like "give us a turnkey design that cost $3k total including your design fee" 

[dcluley98]

"Turnkey" or "Turkey"? 

[JFW657]

18 hours ago, jack said:

More likely the City was like "give us a turnkey design that cost $3k total including your design fee" 

 

18 hours ago, jack said:

More likely the City was like "give us a turnkey design that cost $3k total including your design fee" 

Too often around here, I see examples of appearance being the main focus while functionality is ignored. 

Design firms seem to have a vision of what they want things to look like while ignoring practical, every day use issues.

Like they can't walk and chew gum at the same time.  

 

[dcluley98]

Part of the reason for the Rocks is "function" actually. They don't want shade trees and park benches because that would become a bunk for unsheltered. Thus no shade and round rocks that are not easy to lay on.  You will notice a lot of the park benches have a center "arm rest separator" in the middle of them in parks. There is a functional reason for that. 

[codypet]

They already know this isn't going to be a fun place to congregate for the average person.   No until the other buildings go and they connect it to the park.   I personally chuckled to myself last night at the thought of the old Kuhn building getting 7-11 as a tenant.