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Belmont @ Freemason Progress

okinawatyphoon

By okinawatyphoon
in Norfolk

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rusthebuss Metropolis

rusthebuss

Posted
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If the spaces are private and reserved for residents and guests, why does it matter? The only spaces that count towards deficit/surplus are those that are open to the public. They are not going to count private spaces in residential buildings towards the total figure. The transit line is proposed as a way to bring workers into downtown from what I understand.

I did not say that you were turning this into NJ vs. Norfolk. What I feel you are doing in most of your posts is looking at Norfolk through NJ colored glasses. We are not the same place. What works there for "yous guys" (not "y'all" :-) is not always going to work for us.

The fact of the matter is that this building will be built on a transit line. The developer does not even know if LR will be approved and when it will be built. Under these circumstances, this is the prudent thing to do. It is as TOD as the current situation allows.

I totally agree with this but I don't think lamminus really means anything negative but wants Norfolk to look forward. The only problem that I see is that the density DT has to really grow and be 24/7. Also really for this to be truely TOD we would have to have Vabeach and other cities attached to the line to make it work. With this starter line there is really no way someone could park and then ride into Norfolk. Padman makes a very good point with this. I'm wondering if the planners of the LR are even looking at this. Maybe this is why they choose to end the line at the Vabeach city line????? I'm excited about LR but I'm also skeptical of it too. I think more retail will have to cater to the people living DT and along the lines for it to be used for its intentions. There will have to be some big box retail in walking distance to the line for the DT residents to shop too and be able to bring it home on the LR. Its going to be hard to get people around here to use it. Plus when are they talking about starting the next line and where will they put it and after that. I wonder if they are really thinking ahead on this and not being content with a starter rail. I do think that this is good that its going to be included in the building specs though. It shows that they are starting to thing ahead and show what they want to do with the line. We might start to see more development that includes LR into it.

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Former Resident of HR Hamlet

Former Resident of HR

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I totally agree with this but I don't think lamminus really means anything negative but wants Norfolk to look forward. The only problem that I see is that the density DT has to really grow and be 24/7. Also really for this to be truely TOD we would have to have Vabeach and other cities attached to the line to make it work. With this starter line there is really no way someone could park and then ride into Norfolk. Padman makes a very good point with this. I'm wondering if the planners of the LR are even looking at this. Maybe this is why they choose to end the line at the Vabeach city line????? I'm excited about LR but I'm also skeptical of it too. I think more retail will have to cater to the people living DT and along the lines for it to be used for its intentions. There will have to be some big box retail in walking distance to the line for the DT residents to shop too and be able to bring it home on the LR. Its going to be hard to get people around here to use it. Plus when are they talking about starting the next line and where will they put it and after that. I wonder if they are really thinking ahead on this and not being content with a starter rail. I do think that this is good that its going to be included in the building specs though. It shows that they are starting to thing ahead and show what they want to do with the line. We might start to see more development that includes LR into it.

Well it is all going to take time. And tons of it. So be patient. Once the starter line is in place and has a year or two under its belt, I am sure that we are going to see it expanding to the TC at the very least and hopefully down to the Oceanfront. Like I have said before, it took Portland, Oregon about 15 years to get a full-fledged LR system that goes to the airport. Even Portland's MAX is a continuing work in progress.

I live DT and there is basically no large scale big box retail down here at all. This goes for most of the West Side of Norfolk. Most people who live in DT, Ghent and Larchmont like it that way though. I don't think that I am going to ride a LR train to a big box and bring home a bunch of things that I usually buy there anyway though.

I seriously do not see the need to use it for those of us already living here. I am close enough to walk to all the major attractions and would not ride it to go to Military Circle (ooops, I mean the Gallery at Military Circle) or anywhere else along the line.

If they had some plan to tie in a streetcar to Ghent from downtown, I would be all for that. As it is, I see this more as getting people from the burbs onto the train into DT rather than getting us folks down here out in the burbs. That might be the point of the starter line, I dunno.

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vaceltic Hamlet

vaceltic

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I totally agree with this but I don't think lamminus really means anything negative but wants Norfolk to look forward. The only problem that I see is that the density DT has to really grow and be 24/7. Also really for this to be truely TOD we would have to have Vabeach and other cities attached to the line to make it work. With this starter line there is really no way someone could park and then ride into Norfolk. Padman makes a very good point with this. I'm wondering if the planners of the LR are even looking at this. Maybe this is why they choose to end the line at the Vabeach city line????? I'm excited about LR but I'm also skeptical of it too. I think more retail will have to cater to the people living DT and along the lines for it to be used for its intentions. There will have to be some big box retail in walking distance to the line for the DT residents to shop too and be able to bring it home on the LR. Its going to be hard to get people around here to use it. Plus when are they talking about starting the next line and where will they put it and after that. I wonder if they are really thinking ahead on this and not being content with a starter rail. I do think that this is good that its going to be included in the building specs though. It shows that they are starting to thing ahead and show what they want to do with the line. We might start to see more development that includes LR into it.

While it IS just a starter line. I think the idea is to attract the growing number of suburbanites into downtown for entertainment, dining, and all the booming activities in Norfolk. This is a way to permanently stamp Norfolk as the central hub of the region. The light rail stations are positioned (of course they have to be on the rail line), to gain the maximum amount of value around the train stops. Stops east of downtown will probably see a wave of new development in the next 10 to 20 years that will dramatically change the fortunes of those areas. Its almost as if Norfolk is forcing Virginia Beach's hand as well. Virginia Beach will almost have to follow suit by extending the light rail line to boost its tourism and accessibility to the rest of the region. I-264 is near capacity getting to Independence already. Keep in mind, that cruise ship passengers will most likely love a way to get to the beach without taking a taxi or a rental car. These are high dollar tourists that Virginia Beach can draw from Norfolk. Portsmouth I believe is the next (long range)phase of the line and will most likely extend to churchland where much of Suffolk's booming development is occuring.

Planning has definitely played an enormous part of this project and the feds have continually denied funding to the project because the plans were not sound enough. Now Norfolk can finally move ahead with its forward thinking and hopefully get the rest of the region on board. Only when the entire southside is linked up will light rail truly be useful. I'm not sure if I will be alive to see it cross the peninsula though!

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urbanlife Town

urbanlife

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that would be a great idea having it extend out to churchland because it would limit the amount of traffic crossing the midtown tunnel and make it much more relaxing to get to work each day.

Of course the military needs to be looked at for future expansions because as long as they are there they will always play a large part in the city and region.

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juancapitalcitydc Whistle-Stop

juancapitalcitydc

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Well it is all going to take time. And tons of it. So be patient. Once the starter line is in place and has a year or two under its belt, I am sure that we are going to see it expanding to the TC at the very least and hopefully down to the Oceanfront. Like I have said before, it took Portland, Oregon about 15 years to get a full-fledged LR system that goes to the airport. Even Portland's MAX is a continuing work in progress.

I live DT and there is basically no large scale big box retail down here at all. This goes for most of the West Side of Norfolk. Most people who live in DT, Ghent and Larchmont like it that way though. I don't think that I am going to ride a LR train to a big box and bring home a bunch of things that I usually buy there anyway though.

I seriously do not see the need to use it for those of us already living here. I am close enough to walk to all the major attractions and would not ride it to go to Military Circle (ooops, I mean the Gallery at Military Circle) or anywhere else along the line.

If they had some plan to tie in a streetcar to Ghent from downtown, I would be all for that. As it is, I see this more as getting people from the burbs onto the train into DT rather than getting us folks down here out in the burbs. That might be the point of the starter line, I dunno.

I totally agree with you! If I lived in Ghent, I

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rusthebuss Metropolis

rusthebuss

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It also says on page 50 that this project could be as little as 80 units upwards to 630 units depending on the developer's success in acquiring the adjacent property.

Let's hope they do acquire that piece of land then. I thought all of this was already taken care of.

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vdogg Megalopolis

vdogg

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It also says on page 50 that this project could be as little as 80 units upwards to 630 units depending on the developer's success in acquiring the adjacent property.

80 units would be a substantial waste of that lot. I have a feeling that the legalese is just that, legalese. The amount of units is probably still around 250. I highly doubt that it will be reduced to 80 just as I highly doubt it will be increased to 630 (that would just be excessive :shok: ).

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rusthebuss Metropolis

rusthebuss

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80 units would be a substantial waste of that lot. I have a feeling that the legalese is just that, legalese. The amount of units is probably still around 250. I highly doubt that it will be reduced to 80 just as I highly doubt it will be increased to 630 (that would just be excessive :shok: ).

I would love it to increase to 630 units! How would that be excessive in that location?

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vdogg Megalopolis

vdogg

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I would love it to increase to 630 units! How would that be excessive in that location?

Not excessive for the location, just excessive overall considering how many units we have coming online and the fact that we're already noticing a cool down.

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Chesapeake Pirate Hamlet

Chesapeake Pirate

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Not excessive for the location, just excessive overall considering how many units we have coming online and the fact that we're already noticing a cool down.

Aren't most of the new units going to be condo style? If these are to be rental units, perhaps there is enough demand to build that many for that segement. It does sounds like a lot though.

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vdogg Megalopolis

vdogg

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Aren't most of the new units going to be condo style? If these are to be rental units, perhaps there is enough demand to build that many for that segement. It does sounds like a lot though.

Perhaps you're right and I was thinking along the same lanes for the Hoffler Tower as well, since that too will be rental units. Most of the real estate reports are only about the condo market, I haven't seen any real in depth reporting about the rental market. It would be interesting to see how much demand there is for rental housing in the downtown area.

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br0guy Whistle-Stop

br0guy

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Does this project still have the townhome component to it? If I can recall correctly, the original plans had 2 towers connecting to several townhomes in an adjacent lot. Maybe the "80 unit" thing has something to do w/ this if they can't secure the lot ???

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ace707 Hamlet

ace707

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Posted

12166_1_big.jpg

Project Details:

> 20, 4, and 3-story buildings with both podium and attached parking

> 250 units

Developer:

Kotarides Builders

It looks nice if not a little out of the place if you ask me. It looks too "resort-ish" for a downtown building. Honestly it's a little disappointing to see this from Humphrey's after they showed us what they could do with their design of Granby Tower. It's not a bad looking building, but they hit a little below what I would expect from them.

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ace707 Hamlet

ace707

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I'm not feeling the Hampton Roads Convention Center sails though, what the hell is that all about?

Knowing that practically every downtown high-rise has color and/or detail, this one might unfortunately stand out as an outcast for it's suburban/hotel look and design since it seems to rely heavily on the overly-used white pre-cast concrete look.

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Padman Hamlet

Padman

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It does look like resort architecture, but maybe that's the light and airy look they wanted. I really liked the neo-traditional brick version, but this will blend well with the skyline, at least the "upper" part. It plays off of NS, 150 Main and Granby Tower nicely, although it sure doesn't transition so well from Ghent and Freemason. I like the glass, and I hope the surfaces have some curvature and some color. I'd like to see the backside.

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