Fayetteville, Arkansas

[Mith242]

Yeah I do think there will be another one at some point. They still haven't decided whether they're going to put the 9th grade with the rest of the high school or not.

[itk]

Since it's a state highway the city won't be resurfacing that one. Until the Ren Tower is finished and a definite plan for beautification along the sides is in place I imagine it will be rough.

Guys, think of it this way-- if it WAS a City Street, it would cost the City so much money, that it would likely be in a much worse shape.

That's why the State takes on many major city streets that have a lot of traffic and/or truck traffic (mostly it's a political deal)-- the City can't afford to maintain it. So the State maintains it.

(Or in other cases, the State will take on a city street just because the City wants it widened-- after it gets widened, the City takes it back (political deal).)

[zman9810]

Guys, think of it this way-- if it WAS a City Street, it would cost the City so much money, that it would likely be in a much worse shape.

That's why the State takes on many major city streets that have a lot of traffic and/or truck traffic (mostly it's a political deal)-- the City can't afford to maintain it. So the State maintains it.

(Or in other cases, the State will take on a city street just because the City wants it widened-- after it gets widened, the City takes it back (political deal).)

After rereading my post I can see it might be taken as a dig at AHTD although it wasn't meant to be. It just seems the State usually waits until the City is sure about what they want to do, like the 265 widening project a few years ago. I remember until the city decided if they wanted a boulevard or 5 lanes the state held off on the work.

To follow up on the College issue, the state would never agree to the road being narrowed to 3 lanes would it, itk? I picture a major traffic nightmare if that were to happen. Unless drivers have a better alternative they will continue to use it regardless of the bottleneck it would be.

Edited February 24, 2007 by zman9810

[Mith242]

After rereading my post I can see it might be taken as a dig at AHTD although it wasn't meant to be. It just seems the State usually waits until the City is sure about what they want to do, like the 265 widening project a few years ago. I remember until the city decided if they wanted a boulevard or 5 lanes the state held off on the work.

To follow up on the College issue, the state would never agree to the road being narrowed to 3 lanes would it, itk? I picture a major traffic nightmare if that were to happen. Unless drivers have a better alternative they will continue to use it regardless of the bottleneck it would be.

I just think it's probably better to wait. With all the construction vehicles that will be going by it's probably just better to wait till the Renaissance is complete to repave that area.

On your other point Fayetteville had ideas of changing Fulbright Expressway as well. Fayetteville has had some interesting ideas but I'm not sure if they can follow up on some of these because the AHTD is going to have a say in it as well. The divided boulevard into three sections presented by the Dover Kohl group was interesting but I really don't know if the AHTD would ever agree to anything that 'ambitious'. Of course there's also the fact that something like that would cost a lot of money. I still think it's good for Fayetteville to think outside the box and such. But I'm just not sure how far they'll be able to actually go.

[Mith242]

Looks like Fayetteville will be keeping the AMP for at least another year. It will be going back to the NWA Mall. Guess they had some sort of problem with a permanent location in Rogers. Not sure if this means Fayetteville still has a shot of keeping it or not.

[masons_dad1]

Looks like Fayetteville will be keeping the AMP for at least another year. It will be going back to the NWA Mall. Guess they had some sort of problem with a permanent location in Rogers. Not sure if this means Fayetteville still has a shot of keeping it or not.

Well that's good news for Fay'ville! I think Rogers is starting to run into some road blocks on some of the major developments. Maybe there will be more of a shift in Fay'ville's favor in the coming years. That's not to say Rogers won't get some more retailers, but some of the large-scale developments may have to wait.

[itk]

After rereading my post I can see it might be taken as a dig at AHTD although it wasn't meant to be. It just seems the State usually waits until the City is sure about what they want to do, like the 265 widening project a few years ago. I remember until the city decided if they wanted a boulevard or 5 lanes the state held off on the work.

To follow up on the College issue, the state would never agree to the road being narrowed to 3 lanes would it, itk? I picture a major traffic nightmare if that were to happen. Unless drivers have a better alternative they will continue to use it regardless of the bottleneck it would be.

No... unless Fayetteville took it, in which case, as you know, they could do whatever they like.

However, as far as I know, Fayetteville admin has given up on that idea. They know they could even take College Ave from AHTD, but they don't want to.

[Mith242]

On a totally different subject it sounds like Fayetteville could possibly lose KHOG. They've outgrown their office/studio and have looked for another location without any luck. Now it sounds like they'll be moving quite a bit of their offices/studios to Rogers. I'm guessing they'll keep some things here in Fayetteville. But I'm not sure how much. I got the impression they could be moving quite a bit and could end up listing themselves as Ft Smith/Rogers. The really weird part will be the fact it's KHOG and it won't even be in university's city. But as Benton County continues to outgrow Fayetteville and Washington County we might see more emphasis on Benton County in some aspects of the media.

[strmchsr77]

There appears to be many new subdivisions coming to Fayetteville over the next few months. As well as more office space. According to the NWA Business Journal there are another 4 or 5 subdivisions in the construction phase all over Fayetteville.

Here is the link to the Journal: Real Deals

[Thia]

To follow up on the College issue, the state would never agree to the road being narrowed to 3 lanes would it, itk? I picture a major traffic nightmare if that were to happen. Unless drivers have a better alternative they will continue to use it regardless of the bottleneck it would be.

When Dover Kohl did the Downtown Master Plan, narrowing College to three lanes with medians and turn lanes in the center was prescribed. The traffic consultant compared traffic counts for the stretch of 71B from 6th Street to Maple and compared it to the throughput numbers of a pedestrian friendly three-lane and the three lane actually won because turning traffic was better controlled.

BUT... there was a lot of doubt by locals if the concept could be sold to the State no matter what the numbers said. There are conflicting high-level priorities. The city's goal is safety for pedestrians and sense of place; the state's goal move more autos faster.

starting about page 6...

http://www.accessfayetteville.org/pdfs/dow...5&revision=

[mzweig]

When Dover Kohl did the Downtown Master Plan, narrowing College to three lanes with medians and turn lanes in the center was prescribed. The traffic consultant compared traffic counts for the stretch of 71B from 6th Street to Maple and compared it to the throughput numbers of a pedestrian friendly three-lane and the three lane actually won because turning traffic was better controlled.

BUT... there was a lot of doubt by locals if the concept could be sold to the State no matter what the numbers said. There are conflicting high-level priorities. The city's goal is safety for pedestrians and sense of place; the state's goal move more autos faster.

starting about page 6...

http://www.accessfayetteville.org/pdfs/dow...5&revision=

The three lane plan would be the greatest, the best possible thing that could happen on College. I will PRAY that this is a reality some day.

Mark

[itk]

When Dover Kohl did the Downtown Master Plan, narrowing College to three lanes with medians and turn lanes in the center was prescribed. The traffic consultant compared traffic counts for the stretch of 71B from 6th Street to Maple and compared it to the throughput numbers of a pedestrian friendly three-lane and the three lane actually won because turning traffic was better controlled.

BUT... there was a lot of doubt by locals if the concept could be sold to the State no matter what the numbers said. There are conflicting high-level priorities. The city's goal is safety for pedestrians and sense of place; the state's goal move more autos faster.

starting about page 6...

http://www.accessfayetteville.org/pdfs/dow...5&revision=

I have seen that. It is not a traffic engineering analysis. It would not be, and frankly was not, accepted by engineering professionals.

The way I understand it, the staff convinced the mayor that it wasn't a hot idea, and it was subsequently abandoned.

Also, the state's goal, as you put it, is a bit misleading. Again, Fay could take responsibility for College Ave-- then they could do almost whatever they wanted. BUT, if they did that, and they "shrank" College, and it was a disaster, guess who gets the heat and risks not getting re-elected? BUT, if the City wanted to do that NOW, they could tell people, or let people think, that it was the big, bad State that wouldn't allow them to do that. Make them the bad guys. That's called smart politics.

But here's whats misleading-- there are plenty of examples of state/US highways in Arkansas that were made more ped friendly in a downtown area-- for example, US Hwy 64 in downtown Fort Smith-- several years ago, they re-did the on-street parking, added landscaping, sidewalks, crosswalks, bulb-outs, new curb line, etc. And that's in AHTD District 4, the same as Fay. West Memphis did the same not too long ago too (US Hwy 70). Hwy 7 in Hot Springs is ped friendly with a sense of place. There are other examples too, mostly in smaller towns...

[mzweig]

I have seen that. It is not a traffic engineering analysis. It would not be, and frankly was not, accepted by engineering professionals.

The way I understand it, the staff convinced the mayor that it wasn't a hot idea, and it was subsequently abandoned.

Also, the state's goal, as you put it, is a bit misleading. Again, Fay could take responsibility for College Ave-- then they could do almost whatever they wanted. BUT, if they did that, and they "shrank" College, and it was a disaster, guess who gets the heat and risks not getting re-elected? BUT, if the City wanted to do that NOW, they could tell people, or let people think, that it was the big, bad State that wouldn't allow them to do that. Make them the bad guys. That's called smart politics.

But here's whats misleading-- there are plenty of examples of state/US highways in Arkansas that were made more ped friendly in a downtown area-- for example, US Hwy 64 in downtown Fort Smith-- several years ago, they re-did the on-street parking, added landscaping, sidewalks, crosswalks, bulb-outs, new curb line, etc. And that's in AHTD District 4, the same as Fay. West Memphis did the same not too long ago too (US Hwy 70). Hwy 7 in Hot Springs is ped friendly with a sense of place. There are other examples too, mostly in smaller towns...

I didn't know downtown Ft. Smith still had people living in it. The last time I was there it looked pretty well abandoned!

[Mith242]

I didn't know downtown Ft. Smith still had people living in it. The last time I was there it looked pretty well abandoned!

Yeah I was there last year and took some pics and posted them in a topic in the main Arkansas forum. I think they're trying to revive interest in that area. But back on College Ave, I wonder how expensive it would be to change it to a divided boulevard. I would think that's also going to be a problem. It seems to me that it's going to cost quite a bit and I'm not sure if anyone would find much funding for something like that.

[cocothief]

But back on College Ave

I think it would be ok to change College to a three lane road from North Street to 6th street.

Traffic could be diverted at each point, particularly if the city retook the street and enforced no through trucks in that area. I don't find traffic to be terribly heavy between these two streets, and the traffic calming has worked well on Dickson Street.

It would take some adjustment by the residents taking that route, and lower speed limits but I think the benefits would be incredible as far as allowing the area to redevelop into more dense, more ped-friendly neighborhood.

As for boulevarding the remainder of College Ave, I think that is feasible from North to Milsap, and that there is room for some side frontage roads at least along some portions.

If only the city had the benefactors that line up to donate $ to UA athletics...

Then of course we'd have to rename it Walton Avenue.

[strmchsr77]

Anyone know what all of the smoke is from in Fayetteville? It was just across the south half of the city, but now it has covered most of the town and south Springdale.

[Mith242]

Anyone know what all of the smoke is from in Fayetteville? It was just across the south half of the city, but now it has covered most of the town and south Springdale.

Yeah I just noticed it myself. Last week they mentioned something about doing some controlled burning in the Natl Forest. But last week I never saw any sign of smoke. I'm guessing the wind is blowing from the right direction. This is the same problem they had a year or two ago. It just seems that we aren't given much notice. You know this is got to be hard on people with asthma or respiratory problems. You'd think they could give a little more warning. Seems like we mainly have to find out after the fact.

[Mith242]

Yeah controlled burn in the Natl Forest. It's actually from the section down around Mt Magazine. Although the last time I looked outside it looked like it was clearing up. Sounds like we could get some more smoke tomorrow though.

[cocothief]

Excellent sunsets, though. Both today and last Friday.

[cocothief]

I headed south today for some business and I saw the progress on Lindsey's new Southern View mixed use apartments on the northbound frontage road at 6th and I-540.

I must say I am surprised by this development. It is larger than I thought and has a neat look to it.

Will be interesting to see how it all works out. Given that there is no other real "urban fabric" nearby, this project might be too small to have to stand alone unless there is room to expand it to the north at some point.

I'd love to see something like this tried in more areas of town that are closer in to other residential and a real street grid.

I hope this project is successful and will inspire more projects of this type in and around Fayetteville, and hopefully by Lindsey.

[das450]

Barber Development:

On the Northwest corner of Leverett and North Street, Barber Development owns a condo project. They have also purchased several properities just west of this location. The properties they have purchased all fall within the following boundaries.

Southern Boundary : North Street

Eastern Boundary: Levertt

Western Boundary: Oakland Avenue

Northern Boundary: Hazel Street

There is only one propertie within this area that Barber does not own. The owner is holding out.

Barber also owns the complex at 884 Holly Street (which sits directly north of Storer Avenue. The complex was called Holly Street Apartments. Barber is not renewing leases and about 2 weeks ago they only had 3 tenants in the complex. It appears that something is in the works. The complex needs some redevelopment and it appears that Barber is trying to buy up anything in this area.

Also, it appears that Law Quad Apartments at 701 W. Sycamore Street have been renamed, this is probably due to the muder in 2006 involving a young female. I don't recall the new name.

[cocothief]

Barber Development:

On the Northwest corner of Leverett and North Street, Barber Development owns a condo project. They have also purchased several properities just west of this location. The properties they have purchased all fall within the following boundaries.

Southern Boundary : North Street

Eastern Boundary: Levertt

Western Boundary: Oakland Avenue

Northern Boundary: Hazel Street

There is only one propertie within this area that Barber does not own. The owner is holding out.

Barber also owns the complex at 884 Holly Street (which sits directly north of Storer Avenue. The complex was called Holly Street Apartments. Barber is not renewing leases and about 2 weeks ago they only had 3 tenants in the complex. It appears that something is in the works. The complex needs some redevelopment and it appears that Barber is trying to buy up anything in this area.

Also, it appears that Law Quad Apartments at 701 W. Sycamore Street have been renamed, this is probably due to the muder in 2006 involving a young female. I don't recall the new name.

That area has a lot of potential. A lot of the rentals in that neighborhood have been seriously upgraded in the past couple of years.

To add to that, I do know for a fact that the North Street Church of Christ property across the street is also on the market, however it is priced including the building, and much of the land falls into the Scull Creek Floodway and Floodplain. Combined with the building "value" and the obvious expenses required to bring a lot of the land up a few feet due to its proximity to Scull Creek, its obvious why this property hasn't moved yet.

Perhaps with the market correction we are due for in NWA, the price will come down.

That entire area could become a nice little off campus neighborhood eventually with some neighborhood retail and nicer housing. The extension of the Scull Creek Trail will make the area even more attractive in the next couple of years.

[Mith242]

Now that you mention it I think I've seen some houses in that area get demolished. I just assumed another small apartment complex was going in and didn't think about how close it was to those condos. It would be nice to see this area getting redeveloped. There's been talk of a loft development not too far away over on Garland. I wonder if this little area could become a hot spot.

[strmchsr77]

It seems that there has been alot of talk of redevelopment in this area. With the Gateway development on Garland, Wedington Circle behind Harps, and then whatever Barber is planning off of North. The Dover-Kohl planners had renderings of what the corner of North and Leverett could look like. It was much more urban than it is today.

[Arkansas Student]

On a totally different subject it sounds like Fayetteville could possibly lose KHOG. They've outgrown their office/studio and have looked for another location without any luck. Now it sounds like they'll be moving quite a bit of their offices/studios to Rogers. I'm guessing they'll keep some things here in Fayetteville. But I'm not sure how much. I got the impression they could be moving quite a bit and could end up listing themselves as Ft Smith/Rogers. The really weird part will be the fact it's KHOG and it won't even be in university's city. But as Benton County continues to outgrow Fayetteville and Washington County we might see more emphasis on Benton County in some aspects of the media.

What you say is true. KHOG (or 40/29, or Hearst-Argyle) went before the Rogers Planning Comission on February 20th to request a Conditional Use Permit to install a broadcast tower at The Peaks in Rogers (the Peaks is best identified by the black-glass, darth-vaderish looking building just of 540 before the New Hope exit; it encompasses the commerical building and residential area behind it). The CUP was approved, and the tower is being relocated from Fayetteville, as well as the studios. The Planning Office was told that KHOG plans to start a joint program with JBU in communications, I suppose allowing internship opportunities in the studio for students.

Seems like the TV stations are moving north for some reason. First KNWA opens a brach studio, and now KHOG. But I believe KFSM will stay in Fayetteville, since they are the only station in the market w/ a studio in Ft. Smith.