2004 Municipal Population Figures for SC

[teshadoh]

I'm a cheating homer, but I just can't let this rest without fixing this list 

UA's that include portions in SC

1. Charleston

2. Columbia

3. Aiken/N. Augusta (Augusta)

4. Greenville

5. Spartanburg

Sorry, I tried to just let it rest, but I couldn't not point it out 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well - if it's my turn to be a stickler... then this would be the list of UA's that exist in SC:

1. Fort Mill (Charlotte)

2. Charleston

3. Columbia

4. Aiken / N Augusta (Augusta)

5. Greenville

[motonenterprises]

Augusta definetly doesn't feel larger than Greenville. Greenville seems to have a good bit more available.

[Topher1]

Augusta definetly doesn't feel larger than Greenville. Greenville seems to have a good bit more available.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I complety agree, and I don't want to start that thread again. That's why I think the UA numbers are surprising. Greenville is much larger, and as more infill occurs, the UA stats will reflect that.

And I forgot that Fort Mill was included in Charlotte's UA. I knew Rock Hill was it's own, but northern York Co. escaped my mind.

[UrbanSoutherner]

I'd be willing to bet that G-ville's UA stat will see a large jump sooner or later when enough development happens in the right spots to connect it to other dense pockets, similar to the Aiken pocket in Augusta's UA.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I agree with you. If you go to the Census Bureau's map area and look at the urbanized area and urban cluster maps, the really interesting thing is that you have five areas that are close to touching. Greenville and Simpsonville-Mauldin are separated by a small distance along the I-85 corridor. Greenville and Spartanburg are close to touching. The Clemson urban cluster (which includes Seneca) is actually not so far away from the western reaches of the Greenville urbanized area around Easley. And then the Clemson urban cluster actually comes down into Pendleton and comes close to the Anderson urbanized area. I could see all of this touching and becoming one urbanized area one day. It would probably be the most oddly configured urbanized area boundary in the US. It would be a most bizarre stringing together of different main blobs connected by strings of little towns. But that really does reflect the historic urbanization pattern in the upstate with the mills towns, etc. If you add the 2000 populations of those five areas, you would get a combined population of 637,583 total.

[krazeeboi]

Well - if it's my turn to be a stickler... then this would be the list of UA's that exist in SC:

1.  Fort Mill (Charlotte)

2.  Charleston

3.  Columbia

4.  Aiken / N Augusta (Augusta)

5.  Greenville

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You beat me to it. Actually, that's why I asked how much of the Augusta UA population was in SC.

[krazeeboi]

I know we like to talk about how NC's annexation laws allow their cities to be more accurately represented according to size than SC's laws, but that isn't exactly the case in NC. The five largest cities according to municipal population in NC, according to the 2000 census, are Charlotte, Raleigh, Greensboro, Durham, and Winston-Salem. However, according to UA, the list would be Charlotte, Raleigh, Winston-Salem, Durham, and Greensboro (this may have since changed, since in 2000 Durham had less than 2,000 more people within their municipal limits than Winston-Salem, but as of the latest estimates, they have about 10,000 more people). My point is that even though in SC the differences are WAY more pronounced, they do happen in at least one other state, one which has very liberal annexation laws at that.

[Spartan]

Then if we are going by urban area then:

Charleston

Columbia

Greenville

Spartanburg

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You are right. I was close though I didn't have time to get to my data on SC's urban areas at that time

I tend to think that in order to be called a "city" in any meaningful way, an area really needs to be an UA of at least 100,000. So in my mind, the five real cities in SC are Charleston, Columbia, Greenville, Spartanburg, and Myrtle Beach. The other UAs like Florence and Sumter are big towns, but not cities in my mind.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I think that is a fair statement, but that may need to be altered. I consider Florence to be an important city to the Pee Dee region, but Sumter is less important in a regional sense.

I agree with you. If you go to the Census Bureau's map area and look at the urbanized area and urban cluster maps, the really interesting thing is that you have five areas that are close to touching. Greenville and Simpsonville-Mauldin are separated by a small distance along the I-85 corridor. Greenville and Spartanburg are close to touching. The Clemson urban cluster (which includes Seneca) is actually not so far away from the western reaches of the Greenville urbanized area around Easley. And then the Clemson urban cluster actually comes down into Pendleton and comes close to the Anderson urbanized area. I could see all of this touching and becoming one urbanized area one day. It would probably be the most oddly configured urbanized area boundary in the US. It would be a most bizarre stringing together of different main blobs connected by strings of little towns. But that really does reflect the historic urbanization pattern in the upstate with the mills towns, etc. If you add the 2000 populations of those five areas, you would get a combined population of 637,583 total.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Map time!

The Urban Areas of the Upstate

[GMoxley]

You are right. I was close though I didn't have time to get to my data on SC's urban areas at that time 

I think that is a fair statement, but that may need to be altered. I consider Florence to be an important city to the Pee Dee region, but Sumter is less important in a regional sense.

Map time!

The Urban Areas of the Upstate

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You've got a labeling mistake. Fountain Inn is that small urban at the south of Greenville county and between it and Mauldin should be Simpsonville. You've got Laurens labeled as Simpsonville currently.

[Spartan]

You were correct about Laurens. Thanks for pointing that out. I had several labels on other places and I moved them around. I guess that one got through the renaming process. I did not label every area though. Fountain Inn is too small in my opinion. I just tried to get the larger ones.

[Topher1]

Wow... even closer than I thought... I like the urbanized ring forming between Clemson, Anderson, and Greenville.... That'll be interesting if that connects...

Cool map. Is that map something that is readily available online, or did you have to use special software/skills to generate that? I'd love to see similar ones for other cities.

[UrbanSoutherner]

Thanks for the map Spartan!

[teshadoh]

You would be amazed at what lengths the Census Bureau will try to 'connect' patterns or in a sense 'tamper' data to prove a pattern they view that is in existance or not existance. But certainly - in 2010, Greenville's UA will combine with Spartanburg & include Mauldin & Clemson's urban cluster.

But SC will lose one urban area - Rock Hill will likely be absorbed into Charlotte's.

[krazeeboi]

You were correct about Laurens. Thanks for pointing that out. I had several labels on other places and I moved them around. I guess that one got through the renaming process. I did not label every area though. Fountain Inn is too small in my opinion. I just tried to get the larger ones.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

What about Greenwood?

[krazeeboi]

You would be amazed at what lengths the Census Bureau will try to 'connect' patterns or in a sense 'tamper' data to prove a pattern they view that is in existance or not existance.  But certainly - in 2010, Greenville's UA will combine with Spartanburg & include Mauldin & Clemson's urban cluster.

But SC will lose one urban area - Rock Hill will likely be absorbed into Charlotte's.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

*hands over ears* "La La La La La, I can't hear you......"

[teshadoh]

What about Greenwood?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Greenwood would be the county southeast of Anderson.

And yeah, I feel bummed about the idea of Rock Hill's UA being absorbed into Charlotte.

[Spartan]

I updated the map to show Greenwood and Abbeville

[krazeeboi]

Greenwood would be the county southeast of Anderson.

And yeah, I feel bummed about the idea of Rock Hill's UA being absorbed into Charlotte.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I just hope it will happen later rather than sooner. That will be a scary day. I'm pretty sure it will happen to Gastonia and Concord around the same time as it does Rock Hill. By that time, Charlotte's UA will easily be over 1 million.

[krazeeboi]

Thanks for the update, Spartan.

[GvilleSC]

There was a comment on one of the previous pages about Greenville not being above 6 by the next census. I have to disagree. I think through all of the development in the downtown area, revitilization of neighborhoods in-town, verdae, and numerous other projects on previously undeveloped land--that Greenville will regain a spot in the top 5. All of these projects are taking place currently as well as others and therefore I think that Greenville will move back up. You can't look at numbers and the past trends to determine what will take place before 2010.

[UrbanSoutherner]

There was a comment on one of the previous pages about Greenville not being above 6

[GvilleSC]

I understand what you are saying and agree... - I thought I remember hearing 10,000 new residents for the Verdae development? (maybe i'm wrong, who knows- things change), but anyways I was wondering, is Greenville not close enought to Taylors (in that 5 mile range) that it cannot be incorporated. Like mentioned in other threads, I don't even really know where Greenville/Taylors/Greer all stop and start. But anyways, i'm thinking about the deal that Charleston is having with is it Daniel Island? being too close and they continue to sue everytime they try to become their own city... I don't even know what this has to do with this thread but I read an article about their problems down there and was wondering about Taylors, and I don't fully understand the situation, so maybe yall can explain...

[UrbanSoutherner]

I understand what you are saying and agree...  - I thought I remember hearing 10,000 new residents for the Verdae development? (maybe i'm wrong, who knows- things change), but anyways I was wondering, is Greenville not close enought to Taylors (in that 5 mile range) that it cannot be incorporated. Like mentioned in other threads, I don't even really know where Greenville/Taylors/Greer all stop and start. But anyways, i'm thinking about the deal that Charleston is having with is it Daniel Island? being too close and they continue to sue everytime they try to become their own city... I don't even know what this has to do with this thread but I read an article about their problems down there and was wondering about Taylors, and I don't fully understand the situation, so maybe yall can explain...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I do not know the details, but from some other posts, I think state law allows an area adjacent to a city to incorporate as long as it has a certain population (I think 7,000 or so). And Taylors is big enough. I think some of the Charleston threads have the details.

[GvilleSC]

I do not know the details, but from some other posts, I think state law allows an area adjacent to a city to incorporate as long as it has a certain population (I think 7,000 or so). And Taylors is big enough. I think some of the Charleston threads have the details.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

THANKS

[GvilleSC]

I thought that these numbers were interesting and also show how badly Greenville's city population is skewed:

*Within 3 Miles of Downtown: Population was 74,563 in 2003. Est. in 2008: 78,631

*Within a 10 minute driving time of Downtown: 158,668 (in 2003)

*Within a 15 minute driving time of Downtown: 245,934 (in 2003)

[Spartan]

^ Where did you get those numbers?

Greenville does annex from time to time, but it is never anything major.