New Roanoke fire/EMS headquarters

[weill]

Oh ok, I dont know much about Roanoke government, so thanks for explaining to me.

A museum will fit great in there.

[bmedguy]

It's a reflection of the chauvanist nature of Roanoke. Most of the big descision making is made by middle-aged men who've been with the city forever, but since Darlen Burcham is the City Manager and a strong woman, she gets blamed for anything people don't like.

Fact is, however historic, Fire Station #1 is outmoded. The city decided to modernize its fire stations, and there's not a good way to modernize Fire Station #1, so the city decided to close it and move to the Franklin Rd. site.

That building downtown would make a great fire and rescue museum or meeting space, but it's been caught up in the same web of nostalgia which has left Victory Stadium in limbo. To do everything that needs to be done to upgrade it would cost a fortune, but the public thinks that a couple coats of paint will do, which leads to the standoff.

I agree with this completely. You hear a lot of anger directed at Burcham. The reason is because she fights back and pushes forward against the resistance to change around here. The fact that she is a woman unfortunately probably plays a role in that anger around here as well. I think she is doing a great job and downtown has only benefited in the last few years.

Well said about fire station #1. The old building is great and should definitely be preserved and maintain it's character. However, it can no longer adequately serve the function it was originally designed for and so giving firefighters a facility that will allow them to serve us more effectively is no crime. No one is talking about tearing it down but that is how the "please don't change anything" segment reacts around here. Fortunately I have noticed that in the last five years, they are losing those battles. It makes me hopeful. The old station will remain open, but the new one was not prevented.

[FireFleitz]

It's a reflection of the chauvanist nature of Roanoke. Most of the big descision making is made by middle-aged men who've been with the city forever, but since Darlen Burcham is the City Manager and a strong woman, she gets blamed for anything people don't like.

Fact is, however historic, Fire Station #1 is outmoded. The city decided to modernize its fire stations, and there's not a good way to modernize Fire Station #1, so the city decided to close it and move to the Franklin Rd. site.

That building downtown would make a great fire and rescue museum or meeting space, but it's been caught up in the same web of nostalgia which has left Victory Stadium in limbo. To do everything that needs to be done to upgrade it would cost a fortune, but the public thinks that a couple coats of paint will do, which leads to the standoff.

What Museum would go there, are there any plans for a Museum? Didn't think so. "To the Rescue" planned to move in there, but they can't afford it.

What modernization are you talking about. What needs to be done that can't. What. I hear this all the time. The fact of the matter is that the firefighters are happy there, the downtown businesses, or a majority of them are happy with them there, and a Museum would never flourish there. That station is one of the best built ones we have. It serves the purpose, and the money being spent is much needed elsewhere in the fire service, i.e. Apparatus, pay, benefits, insurance, gear, equipment.

It is interesting at how many people in the private sector know what we need, without asking us. Nobody ever asks the firefighters what is really needed.

The new site of the Station at Elm and Franklin, is a perfect site for an administration building and a training room.

But hey, that is just the thought of a stupid fireman. I don't expect someone behind a desk to understand.

[RoanokeFound]

As for the chauvisinistic "Free (us from) Darlene" thing, I personally think it has little to do with her being a woman, and more to do with her lack of skills in setting the course for the counsel and allowing it to get mired in Victory Stadium and the like.

Quite frankly, I have no use for her - but then again, I do not understand the need for a City Manager. I kinda thought thats what the Mayor was there for. I guess Roanoke has yet to figure that part out. What Darlene represents is everything that Roanoke has done wrong, and it's mainly not her fault. I mean -8 years is a short time to effectively change the course of a city. But a long time to ineffectively change it. Damage can be done quicker than repair can, thats a given.

Again, it all comes back to the lack of forward thinking leaders, strong leaders, stable leaders in our government. It's not just Darlene, its the ignorance that allows a city manager to effectively lead the city, while the mayor stands by powerless.

The government of Roanoke, the way its set up, will never reach the 21st century until it changes the entire way business is done.

[weill]

Fire, the museum was just an idea. calm down.

[StevenRocks]

What Museum would go there, are there any plans for a Museum? Didn't think so. "To the Rescue" planned to move in there, but they can't afford it.

What modernization are you talking about. What needs to be done that can't. What. I hear this all the time. The fact of the matter is that the firefighters are happy there, the downtown businesses, or a majority of them are happy with them there, and a Museum would never flourish there. That station is one of the best built ones we have. It serves the purpose, and the money being spent is much needed elsewhere in the fire service, i.e. Apparatus, pay, benefits, insurance, gear, equipment.

It is interesting at how many people in the private sector know what we need, without asking us. Nobody ever asks the firefighters what is really needed.

The new site of the Station at Elm and Franklin, is a perfect site for an administration building and a training room.

But hey, that is just the thought of a stupid fireman. I don't expect someone behind a desk to understand.

I'll take your kneejerk reaction to my opinion as frustration. I know you have a hard job. I have a hard job too, even though obviously since there's a desk involved, you don't appreciate it. I get that all the time.

I'm glad that you are happy in that fire station, and God bless you for putting up with inadequacies in the system and still having pride in your job. That is rare in this day and age.

With that said, though you know a lot about fighting fires, you don't know everything about fire station planning. The consultants' study was fair and tried to take into account the reuse of existing facilites as much as possible. On our end, we were not instructed to pull solutions out of a hat, or put usuable buildings out of commission.

We were instructed to come up with an appropriate solution for fighting fires for the next 50 to 100 years, and unfortunately Fire Station #1 was not going to work out long term.

The building will eventually need some major renovations due to its age and the costs will exceed the construction costs for a new station with no real benefit. The site is inadequatrely sized for modern fire equipment. End of story.

The thing I resent in your argument is that you think by calling yourself a "stupid fireman" that's supposed to break me down and make me listen to you. I really don't care about your self-image and easly bruised ego. I'm just trying to explain why we did what we did. If you think our actions are stupid, that's fine. If you want to rally for your side, by all means do it. But do not come up on this board and act like we're idiots for doing what the city paid us to do.

[StevenRocks]

As for the chauvisinistic "Free (us from) Darlene" thing, I personally think it has little to do with her being a woman, and more to do with her lack of skills in setting the course for the counsel and allowing it to get mired in Victory Stadium and the like.

If you want to offer direct blame for the Victory Stadium debacle, it doesn't fall on Ms. Burcham. It's really the whole City Council that caused it, and specifically people like Brian Wishneff and Sherman Lea who don't care any more about Roanoke that the other council members, but rode the stadium issue into Council for their own oppurtunistic reasons. they have no point of being on council without the issue, so the fan the fires of it every time they need an issue to be seen in the media.

[FireFleitz]

The thing I resent in your argument is that you think by calling yourself a "stupid fireman" that's supposed to break me down and make me listen to you. I really don't care about your self-image and easly bruised ego. I'm just trying to explain why we did what we did. If you think our actions are stupid, that's fine. If you want to rally for your side, by all means do it. But do not come up on this board and act like we're idiots for doing what the city paid us to do.

No I do not have a poor self-image or bruised ego. I said that for effect. I knew you would read and comment, so I was not doing anything for effect. I was not attacking your job, or where you do it. I was merely bringing up the point that nobody still to this day has asked us what we need the most. Your comments about how you are so proud for bringing some of the ideas of the new station to Roanoke grated on my nerve. While I am sure you are proud of doing whatever you did, I would rather you have said you designed a new budget so that we can get what we actually need, or you found affordable health insurance.

[RoanokeFound]

If you want to offer direct blame for the Victory Stadium debacle, it doesn't fall on Ms. Burcham. It's really the whole City Council that caused it, and specifically people like Brian Wishneff and Sherman Lea who don't care any more about Roanoke that the other council members, but rode the stadium issue into Council for their own oppurtunistic reasons. they have no point of being on council without the issue, so the fan the fires of it every time they need an issue to be seen in the media.

Well, thats true if you wish to look only at the past few years worth of VS nonsense, but overall - Darlene is there to set the tone for the city, and for the city council. So while, yes - the entire city council is at fault (a fact no one will deny), Darlene should have used the rules of order to keep the sessions moving forward, rather than stagnate the entire procedure. And Darlene has the power to cease the media frenzy of Victory Stadium and its 2 supporters, should she want. She has the authority, and if need be so does the Mayor, to order a moratorium on councilmembers talking to the media about it. What should be done is to issue the minutes of each meeting to the press (along with the current cable viewing) and allow them to run the parts about Victory Stadium, thus informing the public - without the spin by the councilmembers.

And part of it must fall on the non-voting public, which allows these sham canidates to be elected. Demand more from your leaders, and fire them if they do not meet those standards.

[StevenRocks]

No I do not have a poor self-image or bruised ego. I said that for effect. I knew you would read and comment, so I was not doing anything for effect. I was not attacking your job, or where you do it. I was merely bringing up the point that nobody still to this day has asked us what we need the most. Your comments about how you are so proud for bringing some of the ideas of the new station to Roanoke grated on my nerve. While I am sure you are proud of doing whatever you did, I would rather you have said you designed a new budget so that we can get what we actually need, or you found affordable health insurance.

You should come up with a less maudlin way of getting my attention.

I'm sorry nobody has saked you or your co-workers what you need to do your job better, but that's not my job and none of my business. That's something you need to talk about with your employer. Also, it's not like anybody else gets asked what they really need for their jobs either. I have plenty of things that I feel my employer should do better. I voice those concerns, and they do what they want with my opinion. That's just how jobs work.

I'm an architect. I don't work in the insurance industry, I don't know the ins and outs of your budget, and I don't work for the city unless they pay me to. If I knew how to get you better health care and a bigger budget, I would. But from my perspective, I can only design and consult on your department's physical plant. And I have a right to be proud of what I've done.

[StevenRocks]

Well, thats true if you wish to look only at the past few years worth of VS nonsense, but overall - Darlene is there to set the tone for the city, and for the city council. So while, yes - the entire city council is at fault (a fact no one will deny), Darlene should have used the rules of order to keep the sessions moving forward, rather than stagnate the entire procedure. And Darlene has the power to cease the media frenzy of Victory Stadium and its 2 supporters, should she want. She has the authority, and if need be so does the Mayor, to order a moratorium on councilmembers talking to the media about it. What should be done is to issue the minutes of each meeting to the press (along with the current cable viewing) and allow them to run the parts about Victory Stadium, thus informing the public - without the spin by the councilmembers.

And part of it must fall on the non-voting public, which allows these sham canidates to be elected. Demand more from your leaders, and fire them if they do not meet those standards.

Darlene does not have the right to single-handedly censure city council, if that's what you're thinking. She holds a certain amount of power, but Nelson Harris does too.

This fight over the stadium will not be won on facts, because facts make too much sense. People have reduced this to a referendum on "us and them" and no amount of media shielding at this point will solve anything. The descision, whatever it is, must be made by council and stuck with, regardless of whether we can reach consensus on it as an electorate.

[weill]

Well look what i just read on the Sunday paper, that Carilion wanted Victory Stadium the whole time. I knew it all along. I always (still do) think that Roanoke will give the land to Carilion for an extremly lowered price, and they build something on it.

Also did i read that some Republicans want a college sized stadium for VT-VPI games again? Oh lord, this isnt good.

[StevenRocks]

Well look what i just read on the Sunday paper, that Carilion wanted Victory Stadium the whole time. I knew it all along. I always (still do) think that Roanoke will give the land to Carilion for an extremly lowered price, and they build something on it.

That's a safe bet. Carilion is this generation's Norfolk Southern: whatever they want, they get.

Also did i read that some Republicans want a college sized stadium for VT-VPI games again? Oh lord, this isnt good.

I hope you're wrong. That would become the pork-barrel project of the decade if it goes through

[RoanokeFound]

you know theres a whole world of information thats not printed in the Times. Once you get down to street level, you find that the story has changed from the printed version...

In other words - don't think Carilion wants anything to do with the Victory Stadium land - considering the land-use issues that come with it. It was something that they had (naturally) thought of in part of the dream-planning phase - never intended for actual use. Just an extention of the concept.

Weill - The word Republican has little to do with holding VPI-VMI games and such - it was a use for a potentially renovated stadium, which would absolutely bring in revenue. Which is what the whole debate was once about - how best to bring revenue to Roanoke.. But whatever.

Unfortunately for some, nostalga has overtaken the need for revenue - even though nostalgia is one of the biggest sources of revenue for an aging population.

[mclawsdrive]

If you want to offer direct blame for the Victory Stadium debacle, it doesn't fall on Ms. Burcham. It's really the whole City Council that caused it, and specifically people like Brian Wishneff and Sherman Lea who don't care any more about Roanoke that the other council members, but rode the stadium issue into Council for their own oppurtunistic reasons. they have no point of being on council without the issue, so the fan the fires of it every time they need an issue to be seen in the media.

In all fairness, Brian Wishneff has been involved with most of the great projects in recent Roanoke history, such as Hotel Roanoke/conference center, jefferson center, higher education building etc. He helped coordinate the use of federal funds for historic buildings and other sources. I think he saw the mad rush to 2 small high school stadiums as a waste of money that would still leave us without a good venue for large events (think dave matthews in 98 - 35000+people). Maybe I don't have all the facts, but it seems like the majority of council wouldn't rebut anything mr. Wishneff said. I saw that council meeting on TV and the rest of council had nothing intelligent to say to question his valid arguments. It was as if they knew something but couldn't share their reasons with the general public. I still think there are some secret alternative plans for the victory stadium site that aren't being shared with the public. It could be the most amazing plan ever that will be great for the city, but right now the plan seems to be to eventually spend millions of dollars to tear a very solid structure to leave as a vacant lot. I understand people are frustrated with the stadium but there is no proposal for any viable substitute for its large capacity. The latest engineering study determined that :

1: the overall structure is solid and in good shape

2: the current river flood project will drastically reduce the likelyhood of flooding and flood damage (a hundred year flood would put a few feet of water on the field)

3: Renovating the stadium would cost about the same as building two small high school stadiums and tearing down victory stadium.

Also, with two new high school stadiums, no large revenue producing events could take place in the city and according to proponents of the new stadiums they would only be used for a few homegames a year (and sit unused most of the time).

[StevenRocks]

What's happening is that Council is trying to satisfy two opposing opinions at once; why I will never know. If the facts suggest new construction, stand up for it. If the facts support renovation, stand up for it.

To his credit, Mr. Wishneff is at least standing up for something, but he's turned from a good city planner to an oppurtunist. If he really felt that strongly about Victory Stadium's future and what is right for the city, he wouldn't use every oppurtunity to disrupt city business that suggests something other than his opinion, much to the detriment of the public's confidence in City Council to do its job.

I think he's helping destroy City Council by halfhartedly triyng to save a stadium and bringing additional critisicm to the council.

[mclawsdrive]

What's happening is that Council is trying to satisfy two opposing opinions at once; why I will never know. If the facts suggest new construction, stand up for it. If the facts support renovation, stand up for it.

To his credit, Mr. Wishneff is at least standing up for something, but he's turned from a good city planner to an oppurtunist. If he really felt that strongly about Victory Stadium's future and what is right for the city, he wouldn't use every oppurtunity to disrupt city business that suggests something other than his opinion, much to the detriment of the public's confidence in City Council to do its job.

I think he's helping destroy City Council by halfhartedly triyng to save a stadium and bringing additional critisicm to the council.

That makes sense to me. It is destructive to disrupt city business. I just agreed with many of his points. My main concern is that Roanoke not lose a venue for big events. It would add to the perception that not much goes on. A large venue will help when young people think about moving to Roanoke or decide whether to stay.

[bmedguy]

Would anyone like to see new pictures of this place? It is coming along well. Wouldn't be too hard for me to go out and snap a couple. By the way, StevenRocks I think it is very cool that you had a hand in this. I think it is a pretty cool building. In my next life I'd like to be an architect or perhaps a city planner!

[rusthebuss]

Would anyone like to see new pictures of this place? It is coming along well. Wouldn't be too hard for me to go out and snap a couple. By the way, StevenRocks I think it is very cool that you had a hand in this. I think it is a pretty cool building. In my next life I'd like to be an architect or perhaps a city planner!

Sure take some pics and post them!

[StevenRocks]

By the way, StevenRocks I think it is very cool that you had a hand in this. I think it is a pretty cool building. In my next life I'd like to be an architect or perhaps a city planner!

Thanks. Design is a very fun job.

[weill]

Ill be downtow on saturday, maybe Ill stop by there.