Atlanta Peak Population?

[Newnan_Eric]

Here is an interesting comparison for y'all:

The population fugures are about a year old, but you get the picture.

This is pretty frightening to me living in Newnan - I do NOT want COWETA to become another Gwinnett.

[Newnan]

Don't worry, it won't be. Henry and Cherokee counties are the ones that need to be worrying; they're growing at a faster rate. In Coweta the growth is half as high (10,000 a year vs. 5,000 a year) so wehave more time to think about what kind of development we really want. And at least Newnan has a a good bit of walkable pre WWII development. Plus, Gwinnett is closer to Atlanta than Coweta. But sometimes I do get worried about what kind of development our county will have in the future. Hopefully it will be sustainable.

Could someone on this forum who is Anti-Gwinnett please tell me in detail what is so horribly bad about Gwinnett and why their sprawl is so much worse than Cobb's or Fulton's?

[Scraper Enthusiast]

Don't worry, it won't be. Henry and Cherokee counties are the ones that need to be worrying; they're growing at a faster rate. In Coweta the growth is half as high (10,000 a year vs. 5,000 a year) so wehave more time to think about what kind of development we really want. And at least Newnan has a a good bit of walkable pre WWII development. Plus, Gwinnett is closer to Atlanta than Coweta. But sometimes I do get worried about what kind of development our county will have in the future. Hopefully it will be sustainable.

Could someone on this forum who is Anti-Gwinnett please tell me in detail what is so horribly bad about Gwinnett and why their sprawl is so much worse than Cobb's or Fulton's?

There are parts of Gwinnett that have attractive sprawl. Areas around the Ronald Reagan Parkway, as well as areas around Peachtree Parkway (Industrial Blvd?) come to mind. Places around Suwanee and Duluth in that sector. However, much of the sprawl in Gwinnett is on the tacky side, complete with big box stores in too close a proximity to apartment homes, even subdivisions. Gwinnett also seems to have poor landscaping and buffers from the streets, compared to Cobb. For example, take I-75 in Cobb. The whole stretch, with the exception of the area just north of the North 120 Loop to Canton Road, is aesthetically pleasing, in my opinion. Lots of trees, even a grassy/bushy median below Delk Road. Furthermore, the development is set-back from the road, moreso, than in Gwinnett, where development seems to come right up to I-85's backside (eg: Garden Ridge, Car Max, Car dealerships near Gwinnett Place, office park buildings just north of Old Peachtree Road, etc.). Even getting off I-85, U.S. 78 is very tacky-looking. Miles and miles of development, much of it starting to deteriorate, as it was 70s and 80s commercial development. Sure, Cobb has Cobb Parkway and South Cobb Drive, but Cobb doesn't look as bad, as the buildings are in better condition (well, S. Cobb Drive around Windy Hill Road looks crappy), and Cobb's terain is more hilly than Gwinnett. Cobb has some of the highest elevations in Metro Atlanta, some upwards of 1200 ft, while Gwinnett is moreso in the 800-900 ft range.

[bfermanich]

True, and Cobb is actively encouraging developers to redevelop old commercial strip centers -- something vital to the county's future. They have a shining example of this off Whitlock Ave. The county itself redeveloped an old abandoned A&P supermarket into the new tax accessor's office. They added lots of tree islands in the parking lot, redid the whole front facade of the building and reconstructed all of the interior. And it still cost much less than building from scratch. It looks awesome. Hopefully this will catch on with the private development community.

[Newnan]

Well, Gwinnett had better start doing what Cobb's doing; if they don't, 20 years into the future, most of Gwinnett will be an eyesore

[sanka]

As a native to Gwinnett I feel comfortable saying it IS an eyesore.

except Norcross is nice...and a great new development is coming!

Lawrenceville has the framework to be nice...I think they are working on it too.

its all the crap inbetween that is an eyesore.

[Newnan]

do you think it will ever get better?

-Oh, by the way, I saw your thread you started on the Charlotte forum. You seemd to be very exasperated with Metro Atlanta, being from Gwinnett I guess I can see why. Anyway, I'm glad we have a Gwinnett county forumer now. There's a lot of Gwinnett bashing on this forum so hopefully you can put it all in perspective for us.

[sanka]

When I was born in the mid 70's I grew up around horse farms and country.

My "hometown" is the intersection of Spalding and Holcomb bridge...A Big Star and car wash...woo hoo!

no sidewalks

no streetlife

no "community" outside of the pool and immediate neighbors.

no freedom till I turned 16 and could drive

some pluses

great woods to play in when I was a kid. even though I grew up in the burbs i still feel like as a young child I grew up in a rural environment hikeing to the hooch and stuff. I hate to make it all negative.

I do think Atlanta will get better...but the burbs may get worse. espesially where I grew up.

[teshadoh]

I lived up the road from you in the early 90's - remember the cd store in the Big Star shopping center? I used to go there every week.

[sanka]

yeah...i think it was a Turtles...remember the Turtles coins?

(that big star was the horse farm)

[Newnan]

I believe that Atlanta tries to make itself more walkable and pedestrian friendly, the suburbs will follow suit. it'll be like a ripple effect. it may take a while for teh wave to reahc Gwinnett but I think it will in the next couple of decades. It has to, or else Gwinnett will not be able to sustain itself. I'm remaining optimistic and I think I have a reason to be. I'm seeing a lot of new urbanisn. Sanka, is there any new urbanism or revitalization efforts going on in Gwinnett?

[krazeeboi]

I look forward to taking a nice stroll down Buford Highway some day.

[sanka]

THe only thing I am aware of is the Norcross downtown development and I think there was a study for Lawrenceville which has a great underutilized downtown. Norcross to me is the most exciting (as well as beaver ruin area), if it gets done...Im not sure what will happen.

thats all I know.

I look forward to taking a nice stroll down Buford Highway some day.

Buford Highway rocks!!!

[krazeeboi]

^It rocks alright.

I've heard that Lawrenceville's downtown was rather quaint. Next time I'm down that way, I'll have to go check it out.

[ironchapman]

I'm starting to wonder what will happen to my own Douglas County.

Anybody want to guess while I get my thoughts on the subject together?

[krazeeboi]

^Six Flags will annex Douglas County for expansion.

[Lady Celeste]

I'm starting to wonder what will happen to my own Douglas County.

Anybody want to guess while I get my thoughts on the subject together?

This may be silly but I remember once hearing a developer say that the far westside (Dougals and Carroll) will never develop like the northside has because of sunshine slowdown. The sun blinds workers going into the city to work in the morning and it blinds them as the sun set on their way home. While this may be simple in it's explaination on his part, I can see how he came up with that.

I have always wondered why Douglas has not taken off like Cobb. Paulding Cty is growing by leaps and bounds yet it has worse interstate access. As a matter of fact it has not interstate access. I would have thought that by now Douglasville (Chapel Hill area) would have had at least one major employment center node. If I was a commissioner for Douglas Cty, I would be trying to woo a developer to make some massive mixed use development a la Peachtree City.

[ironchapman]

This may be silly but I remember once hearing a developer say that the far westside (Dougals and Carroll) will never develop like the northside has because of sunshine slowdown. The sun blinds workers going into the city to work in the morning and it blinds them as the sun set on their way home. While this may be simple in it's explaination on his part, I can see how he came up with that.

I have always wondered why Douglas has not taken off like Cobb. Paulding Cty is growing by leaps and bounds yet it has worse interstate access. As a matter of fact it has not interstate access. I would have thought that by now Douglasville (Chapel Hill area) would have had at least one major employment center node. If I was a commissioner for Douglas Cty, I would be trying to woo a developer to make some massive mixed use development a la Peachtree City.

Well, Chapel Hill has become more of a residential area now. I think Douglas County as a whole is meant to be more a residential County as opposed to counties like Cobb that mix both residential and commercial.

It seems to me that Douglas County has become more of a suburb itself to places like Atlanta and Cobb County because most people I know work there.

Sometimes I enjoy the fact that development here has been a lot quieter and more low-key than some of the other counties in the metro.

[Lady Celeste]

This will never bode well for extending public transportation into Douglas. The densities will never justify such an endeavor. What may happen is one of two scenarios...Carroll will take over prominence from Douglas or Carroll will continue to be suburban in nature as well and traffic along I-20 will be so unbearable that Pauding County will be a much better choice.

I think however that Carroll County is actively seeking major employment centers in Villa Rica and Carrollton. Douglas will ultimately become a bedroom community for Carroll Cty and Atlanta. Coming from tax purpose point of view, you would want a nice healthy dose of commercial and industrial.

[Scraper Enthusiast]

I'm starting to wonder what will happen to my own Douglas County.

Anybody want to guess while I get my thoughts on the subject together?

The moderate, not heavy growth of Douglas County is mostly due to the slow-growth policies of the Douglas County Planning Commission. I had the opportunity to work under Dan Reuter, now head of the ARC, in the late 90s when he was head of the Douglas County Planning Department. He informed me that Douglas County has made a strong effort to attract only quality growth, and that it's not a "growth-for-growth sakes" county. He indicated that it's a county whose primary interest is a good quality of life, while helping the county grow moderately, not explode. This view has contributed greatly to declined subdivisions at developers' requests, as well as the barely moderate growth.

The "Sun in the eyes" theory sounds good, but it has little to do with reality.

[ironchapman]

This will never bode well for extending public transportation into Douglas. The densities will never justify such an endeavor. What may happen is one of two scenarios...Carroll will take over prominence from Douglas or Carroll will continue to be suburban in nature as well and traffic along I-20 will be so unbearable that Pauding County will be a much better choice.

I think however that Carroll County is actively seeking major employment centers in Villa Rica and Carrollton. Douglas will ultimately become a bedroom community for Carroll Cty and Atlanta. Coming from tax purpose point of view, you would want a nice healthy dose of commercial and industrial.

Actually, I would think that it would be more of a bedroom community to Cobb than to Carroll.

But I have to wonder how much it will take for traffic along I-20 to be unbearable. The highway seems pretty clear most days.

[Lady Celeste]

Actually, I would think that it would be more of a bedroom community to Cobb than to Carroll.

Well I said divided between Carroll and Atlanta (meaning the metro area) because as Carroll grows it's employments centers, some people will travel west to work in Carroll.

But I have to wonder how much it will take for traffic along I-20 to be unbearable. The highway seems pretty clear most days.

Okay, when are you looking at the traffic reports on the morning news. It is clear on some days...not most. I-20 gets bad when you get to Lee Rd all the way till you get to I-285.

[teshadoh]

I'll agree that though there will be some limitation to how expansive the metro can be - additional edge cities will develop. I think the obvious ones will be the existing sattelite cities on the metro's peripherary: Carrollton, Cartersville, Griffin, Covington, Monroe and of course Gainesville. But an emerging edgeless city will develop along University Pkwy towards Athens.

A likely reason for those cities to develop is because the current exurban counties like Paulding & Henry are afraid to develop like Cobb or Gwinnett. So their land use plans are heavily in favor of developing nearly strictly residential. Not likely the best plan of action, but that appears to be the consensus with most of the exurban counties for now.

[bfermanich]

A likely reason for those cities to develop is because the current exurban counties like Paulding & Henry are afraid to develop like Cobb or Gwinnett. So their land use plans are heavily in favor of developing nearly strictly residential. Not likely the best plan of action, but that appears to be the consensus with most of the exurban counties for now.

Your assessment of Paulding is wrong. I've lived in Paulding for 8 years before moving back into Cobb and I can tell you that Paulding desperately wants to expand its tax base. Just residential isn't cutting it and they know that. They would love to get more commercial developments, especially business parks because they pump up the tax base much more than residential. However, there are no interstates in the county and they haven't had much luck with this -- business parks like close proximity to highway infrastructure.

On a side note, Cobb County gets something like 25-30% of its tax revenue just from the Cumberland/Galleria area. Its a huge revenue generator. I can tell you Paulding would love to have something like that working for them.

[teshadoh]

^ Then I mispoke, thanks for the correction. Otherwise, a majority of future land use plans indicate mostly single family housing, for exurban counties. Office parks are at times scare residents, because they have the conception that they generate more traffic.

Regarding tax base, Marietta is a great example of a city that nearly exclusively annexes commercial parcels. The city has a huge tax base while only responsible for less than 60,000 people.