Why People Don't Ride CATS

[Sabaidee]

CATS is better off than most growing cities's transit systems, at least ours offer the bus schedule on the bus stop sign, most people don't seem to know how to follow the schedule on the sign, the time posted isn't the time they bus will arrive at that stop, but the estimated time the bus is coming from the main points along the route. But the majority of the inner city routes that runs in less fortunate parts of town are at the full capacity. Then there are routes that are there for political reasons, I don't see the need for the crosstown route like the 29 Southpark to UNCC, it's always empty when I see it and it runs on a low frequency at once every hour compared to 9 Central Ave, that runs every 5 minutes during rush hour and it always pack. Some express routes need improvements, while they maybe growing in the number of riders, it's not always at capacity.

[monsoon]

good point, and welcome to urban planet.

i think part of the half-cent sales tax was to improve bus routes, frequency, and bus stop amenities, so i think they are already trying to do this... but i am surprised that a transit hot spot such as walmart on eastway doesnt have benches and stuff... they could buy 10 of them at the walmart for a couple hundred bucks and call it a day .

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I would think that if one of the bureaucrats at CATS would ask Walmart to put up a bus shelter for their store they most likely would free of charge to the city. I think the biggest part of this problem is the CATS organization itself in that is it is not run by innovative thinkers. I think Tober needs to be outsted and someone more interested in getting people to ride transit put in his place.

[dubone]

i hope at some point they will actually make more of the system farefree. by operating a bus route is almost entirely fixed cost to the system (the marginal increase in gas when the bus is full is miniscule compared to the value of having those people out of their cars)... by eliminating the fare, ridership can increase dramatically in commuting situations where people are much more likely to scrutinize the cost (as it is a daily expense), and where there is the highest benefit to society, as many more cars can stay out of rush hour traffic.

perhaps a compromise solution would be to have a happy hour... where all busses are free during the rush hour.

[MZT]

Or the opposite.

I noticed that even the measly 45 cent difference between the Express Bus and the regular busses on Central Avenue, brings out a different class of passenger. More office worker types who just want 30 minutes of quiet, to read the paper or nap. The regular bus has a lot more loud and gossipy types on it.

The Express bus also has upholstered seats, and they all face forward. Not everyone wants to face the window (vertigo) or look face to face with strangers.

[f0xym0p]

Or the opposite.

I noticed that even the measly 45 cent difference between the Express Bus and the regular busses on Central Avenue, brings out a different class of passenger. More office worker types who just want 30 minutes of quiet, to read the paper or nap. The regular bus has a lot more loud and gossipy types on it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Don't you think that has more to do with the extra stops than the 45 cents difference? The office workers are taking the express right to work and the other riders are going to different places not served by the express.

[MZT]

It's hard to say for sure. When I missed the express, and took the other bus, there still seemed to be plenty of people on it at the end of the line... Some riders will try to save every penny they can.

It would be interesting to see how a combination of free busses, and more pricey (but more direct and comfortable) busses would work.

I have a feeling the BRT proposals may be leaning towards the latter. If there was a 3 or 4 stop BRT on the way to uptown, I'd probably consider it, and maybe there'd be no real need for light rail.

[skylinedrive]

How can the mayor of Huntersville allow for such wasteful spending?

If they are going to do a Village Rider up there they should at least do it right. It looks like the routing hits all the high points up there: Birkdale, Rosedale, City Hall, Library, CPCC, and the Rec Center. Maybe if they run it at 30 min intervals rather than the current hourly. It is also nice that the routes hook into the very popular Route 77X.

[monsoon]

How can the mayor of Huntersville allow for such wasteful spending?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The mayor has nothing to do with it. The buses are operated by CATS not the city of Huntersville.

[skylinedrive]

I thought that the mayor of Huntersville was a voting member of the CATS Board of Directors.

[monsoon]

No, CATS reports to the Mayor of Charlotte and the Charlotte City Council. The Huntersville Mayor is a voting member of the Metropolitan Transit Commission.

[pb4uxplode]

I hate to disagree with everyone, but I am a firm believer that CATS is a good system (for my personal use at least [and this refers to express bus only]). I live in Gaston county and the CATS bus from there is far more convenient than driving. It takes about the same time to get to work whether I drive or ride the bus, with a monthly or 10 ride pass its cheaper than driving (taking gas and mileage into consideration) and its a lot more convenient to not have to drive. I don't ride the other busses, but the express busses are A+ compared to several other cities transit systems.

[f0xym0p]

I hate to disagree with everyone, but I am a firm believer that CATS is a good system (for my personal use at least [and this refers to express bus only]). I live in Gaston county and the CATS bus from there is far more convenient than driving. It takes about the same time to get to work whether I drive or ride the bus, with a monthly or 10 ride pass its cheaper than driving (taking gas and mileage into consideration) and its a lot more convenient to not have to drive. I don't ride the other busses, but the express busses are A+ compared to several other cities transit systems.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I think the general consensus is that CATS is doing well overall, but there are still improvements to be made and it certainly doesn't work for everyone and never will. Some people will never ride the light rail, much less a bus, regardless of what CATS does.

[reverbandwhiskey]

I am a huge fan of mass transit, but I will nto ride the bus.

EVERY time I have ridden the bus I have had to deal with overcrowded bussses, long waits to get on the bus, as well as incredibly loud/rude/smelly people.

CATS should install cellphone jammers on the busses. That would make the ride MUCH more enjoyable. Having to listen to ghetto trash screaming into phones for 45 minutes each way is simply too much to deal with.

I wish they gave the drivers more power to eject loud passengers from the busses.

[Seabreeze]

If the buses are overcrowded, then I don't see where there is a problem with ridership. I think the people that ride the bus in Charlotte are the people that need to. If you don't, then chances are you won't. There are times when I have needed to ride the bus. And then there are times when I have had a car, and see no point. The bus I see is an automobile, and people that have one typically don't ride it (except for express routes, which typically get you through traffic quicker)

I think when light rail is incorporated, people will view this as more of a luxury the city has to offer, and then people with vehicles may not be so aprehensive about riding it. Especially because it has a dedicated artery that wont become congested with traffic. Just my two cents.

[skylinedrive]

I did some research into this and found out a few things.

Huntersville has a rep on the Transit Services Advisory Committee (TSAC). They review all new routes as well as route changes in the CATS system. TSAC reports to the Metropolitan Transit Commision whose Vice Chair is the Mayor of Huntersville. So the powers that be in Huntersville were well aware of the Village Riders up there as well as their ridership. I sent an e-mail to the Huntersville rep on the TSAC to see if she could join us here on Urban Planet and better explain the Village Riders and what future service in Huntersville they are looking at.

Hopefully this will clear up some of the misinformation posted earlier in this thread.

[MZT]

Decided to voluntarily take the bus this morning.... and had some Jeohovah's witnesses pull over and want to give me "Watchtower" pamphlets.

Ugggghhh! Build that doggone light rail already... Standing on the street curb waiting for the bus makes you a "target" in so many ways. :-(

[dxartist]

Decided to voluntarily take the bus this morning.... and had some Jeohovah's witnesses pull over and want to give me "Watchtower" pamphlets.

Ugggghhh! Build that doggone light rail already... Standing on the street curb waiting for the bus makes you a "target" in so many ways. :-(

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

they also hang around the Overstreet mall in Charlotte Plaza and between BB&T and BOA Plaza.

[dubone]

Decided to voluntarily take the bus this morning.... and had some Jeohovah's witnesses pull over and want to give me "Watchtower" pamphlets.

Ugggghhh! Build that doggone light rail already... Standing on the street curb waiting for the bus makes you a "target" in so many ways. :-(

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

great, another tower? there MUST be a bubble

[peaceloveunderstanding]

lol, that is so like them. They probably found that the bus stop gives them some statistical advantage or something. I have relatives that are involved in that and they are little off.

[krazeeboi]

Decided to voluntarily take the bus this morning.... and had some Jeohovah's witnesses pull over and want to give me "Watchtower" pamphlets.

Ugggghhh! Build that doggone light rail already... Standing on the street curb waiting for the bus makes you a "target" in so many ways. :-(

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

But it is imperative that you be prepared for Jehovah's return; Armageddon is imminent!

[monsoon]

I did some research into this and found out a few things.

Huntersville has a rep on the Transit Services Advisory Committee (TSAC). They review all new routes as well as route changes in the CATS system. TSAC reports to the Metropolitan Transit Commision whose Vice Chair is the Mayor of Huntersville. So the powers that be in Huntersville were well aware of the Village Riders up there as well as their ridership. I sent an e-mail to the Huntersville rep on the TSAC to see if she could join us here on Urban Planet and better explain the Village Riders and what future service in Huntersville they are looking at.

Hopefully this will clear up some of the misinformation posted earlier in this thread.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Did you get a response? Exactly what misinformation are you referring to?

[Miesian Corners]

Did you get a response?  Exactly what misinformation are you referring to?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I think Skylinedrive is referring to the fact that CATS has been blamed for the poor choices for routes, when the Town of Huntersville actually authorized them.

[monsoon]

I think Skylinedrive is referring to the fact that CATS has been blamed for the poor choices for routes, when the Town of Huntersville actually authorized them.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Ahh. We don't know if that is the case or not.

[skylinedrive]

I have not gotten a response from her yet. I will leave it up to her to set the record straight.

I did learn that Huntersville will be getting additional bus service in October. It will be a route connecting the town to Northlake Mall.

[lupitachica]

I recently relocated to Charlotte from NYC for a job - my fiance & I purchased a home and take the 64x to work everyday. For some background info, I'm black, born & raised in Brooklyn and have lived a ghetto project, a gentrified brooklyn brownstone, and a upperclass suburb of NY (my educational experience has been as varied as well). I've experienced all aspects of city life.

I give all this information to say that I find Charlotte's CATS system lacking in many ways and it doesn't seem to serve the city well. Charlotte transportation system, imo, lacks forethought and planning. It seems geared to remain a "only if you have too" mode of transportation. It is inconvenient and very suburban minded - i.e lots of park & rides lots. Of course I don't expect it to compare to NY but Charlotte's bus service leaves a lot to be desired. And a city full of suburban drivers does not, imo, bode well for the development of Charlotte as a thriving city. It seems to be a glorified rural suburb.

First, the mentality of the people seems to suggest that they are very suburban minded as opposed to city minded. City minded people learn to live to those who are different and, imo, choose convenience over elitism when it comes to transportation. In NY, even the richest people take the subway and the buses (ie I've seen Matthew Broderick on the train right next to the homeless man snoring & farting). The average worker takes public transportation even when they have cars.

Here it seems as if everyone is compelled to drive. In many cases, you can't walk, even if you wanted to, the city is not planned that way unless you're uptown. The bus stops lack shelter and more importantly are often placed in high grass and close to the side of the road in a way that is unappealing. Not to mention that I've noticed (on Monroe for example) that the stops are too close together. There is no discernable logic to their placement.

I am well off and I take the express bus because I think its sort of silly for people to drive everywhere in their individual cars. Its bad for the environment and its gluttonous with gas (and we all see where that's gotten us as a society). I owned a car in NY for trips to LI, Jersey, days when I had too many groceries, etc. But I used public transportation to shop in Manhattan or even go out for drinks, etc. I would like to do the same here but cannot. I must drive to the bus, park & then ride.

Coming back from Uptown it is absurd. At the height of rush hour, the buses are infrequent. Additionally, after about 6, its a wrap for quick transportation and using the local bus, its takes an hour for what essentially should be a 20 minute trip (even though a portion is on the highway). Coming down Independence, the Express bus pass each other in a dangerously close manner. The bus itself is comfortable but I noticed it wouldn't be easy for people to stand if they needed to.

Frankly, I just hate it and it makes me mad each day that its not a better system. Its almost like the city doesn't want people to ride.