New mall in Walker

[OneSweetWorld]

this is just something i heard...has anyone else heard about it? i go by there once a week, and i know they have bought out all the houses and have already begun tearing them down...

does anyone know anything about this?

walker is a very suburban community-too many farms, WAY too much industrial plants and not enough commercial and residential development,so this addition would be grrrrrrrrrrreat

[torgo]

this is just something i heard...has anyone else heard about it? i go by there once a week, and i know they have bought out all the houses and have already begun tearing them down...

does anyone know anything about this?

walker is a very suburban community-too many farms, WAY too much industrial plants and not enough commercial and residential development,so this addition would be grrrrrrrrrrreat

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'm not wild about a shopping mall...I think that monstrosity at rivertown is all the shopping mall I can handle Some kind of new urbanist developments with mixed uses would be much better on greenfields.

[JimInGR]

That was the original proposed location for Rivertown Crossings, but the city rejected the plan. I don't see a mall ever going in there til the area is built up more. I don't know if the Grand Rapids area could absorb another mall anyways. We'll see what happens.

[GaryP]

I don't know if the Grand Rapids area could absorb another mall anyways. We'll see what happens.

How do mall builders measure feasability? I think Jim is right about this, how many large malls can GR support?

[torgo]

How do mall builders measure feasability?  I think Jim is right about this, how many large malls can GR support?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I don't know how they do that, but I would suspect they also look at long-term growth potential in west michigan, not just GR, since malls are a kind of 'destination' for folks father away, too. Granted, muskegon, holland, etc have malls too, so I don't know if theres a market for it or not.

[snoogit]

A mall isnt going in at that corner, something far more sinister is.

What I was told is that its going to house more Groters White Boxes

[snoogit]

I don't know how they do that, but I would suspect they also look at long-term growth potential in west michigan, not just GR, since malls are a kind of 'destination' for folks father away, too.  Granted, muskegon, holland, etc have malls too, so I don't know if theres a market for it or not.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Malls are on their way out of Grand Rapids, not in

Realistically of the BIg three in GR, one one will survive. I suspect that will be Rivertown, just because its doing the best of all the others. But I don't see Either Woodland or Eastbrook being around much longer. Bring in a church, and ge it over with.

Besides, malls are loosing their popularity with school children anyway, its not as cool a place to hang out as say a park is, or a favorite restaurant. (This is ciming from a teenager I know) instead Malls are seen as places where the too privileged, and too snotty go to feel better of themselves The mall market is dried up here in Grand Rapids, and if another one was to be built, it certainly wouldnt go at that corner.

[torgo]

Well good. thanks for the info snoogit. i have also read a couple articles that say the mall culture in the usa is dying and more people are liking the look of "Main Street USA" again. I sure hope they are right

[GRDadof3]

Malls are on their way out of Grand Rapids, not in

Realistically of the BIg three in GR, one one will survive. I suspect that will be Rivertown, just because its doing the best of all the others. But I don't see Either Woodland or Eastbrook being around much longer. Bring in a church, and ge it over with.

Besides, malls are loosing their popularity with school children anyway, its not as cool a place to hang out as say a park is, or a favorite restaurant. (This is ciming from a teenager I know) instead Malls are seen as places where the too privileged, and too snotty go to feel better of themselves The mall market is dried up here in Grand Rapids, and if another one was to be built, it certainly wouldnt go at that corner.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Several commercial real estate experts in the area have said that Grand Rapids can handle another regional mall, based on marketing/demographics/growth, but would have to offer alternative stores from Woodland/Rivertown. The corner of 4 Mile and Walker was going to be a huge regional mall (don't know what they were going to do with those high-voltage power lines through there ). I think now it is going to be commercial/industrial. And watch out for a HUGE condo complex going in where English Hills Golf Course is now grandraggidy.

Retail vacancy in the burbs is basically nada. Just look at all of the new strip malls going in, at the corner of Lake Eastbrook Drive and Beltline (where Grand Olds was), at the NW corner of Beltline and 28th (by the Radisson), at the SE corner of 28th and Beltline (where Ethan Allen, GR Lighting, and Eastern Floral currently now stand but are proposed to be demolished). The Rivertown retail area will soon envelop the X-Rite plant when they move, plus there is more retail planned for Wilson stretching down to the new South Belt. There are two lifestyle village concepts coming to the East Beltline at 3 Mile and at Knapp, both of which are in the 300 - 400,000 square foot range. It's madness!

I would like to believe that teens these days think malls are too materialistic, but I doubt it

[snoogit]

I would like to believe that teens these days think malls are too materialistic, but I doubt it 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Hey, maybe its just the kid I know, who knows? thats just the impression I got

and that Huge Condo Development in English Hil;ls made my father upset, cause he liked golfing there

[MJLO]

correction on information, in 97' there were two proposed regoinal malls, both going before city councils on the same day, One in Walker at 4mile and walker, and one in Grandville, (Rivertown Crossings) Voters in walker voted down the mall, that would have had upscale stores like Saks, and Lord N Taylor. Voters in Grandville obviously approved. 4mile and Walker, was not however the original choice for the rivertown location.

I do believe there needs to be some sort of indoor shopping center on the north end of the Metro area, Green Ridge Square, on Alpine, however thriving it may be. Sucks.

[snoogit]

correction on information,  in 97' there were two proposed regoinal malls, both going before city councils on the same day,  One in Walker at 4mile and walker, and one in Grandville, (Rivertown Crossings)  Voters in walker voted down the mall, that would have had upscale stores like Saks, and Lord N Taylor.  Voters in Grandville obviously approved.  4mile and Walker, was not however the original choice for the rivertown location. 

I do believe there needs to be some sort of indoor shopping center on the north end of the Metro area,  Green Ridge Square,  on Alpine, however thriving it may be.  Sucks.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Where was it proposed then? AFAIK it was on the "Happy Apple" Orchard, awfully close to 4-mile and Walker.

But on that note, a decent sized development could be placed on the south end of Alpine, once the fisher plant is closed, which I hear is sooner then we might think, sadly.

[GRDadof3]

correction on information,  in 97' there were two proposed regoinal malls, both going before city councils on the same day,  One in Walker at 4mile and walker, and one in Grandville, (Rivertown Crossings)  Voters in walker voted down the mall, that would have had upscale stores like Saks, and Lord N Taylor.  Voters in Grandville obviously approved.  4mile and Walker, was not however the original choice for the rivertown location. 

I do believe there needs to be some sort of indoor shopping center on the north end of the Metro area,  Green Ridge Square,  on Alpine, however thriving it may be.  Sucks.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Sorry, I did not mean to imply that 4 Mile and Walker was the original Rivertown site. In fact, I think the guy was a local developer, whereas Rivertown was developed by General Growth. He also looked at building near 32nd and Quincy in Hudsonville area (Jamestown Twp) as well. That seems so long ago now

[hood]

How many major malls does GR currently have? Lansing ony has two, and the Eastwood Towne Center, but since it isn't indoors I don't consider it a mall.

[snoogit]

How many major malls does GR currently have? Lansing ony has two, and the Eastwood Towne Center, but since it isn't indoors I don't consider it a mall.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Technically GR(metro) has two, and im not including Centerpointe since it doesnt do much business anymore other then klingmans, and old navy keeping it afloat, if your talking about GR City then its zero since I believe both Woodland, and Eastbrook malls are in Kentwood and Rivertown is in Grandville.

[superNOVA]

The developers were also not willing to do the needed street upgrades for the mall. It was a good decision, but it was just a matter of time before something came down the pipes on that land.

And yes, Grand Rapids could easily support another mall between say the size of Woodland and Rivertown. Not much of a problem there.

[joeDowntown]

No way, no how. Woodland is actually a much more profitable mall per sq. foot than Rivertown, and still has better demographics than Rivertown. Have you been to Rivertown lately? Many empty stores.

I think both will survive. Rivertown is a mall-rat mall, Woodland is a shoppers mall. That might change with the new Movie theatre but I think Woodland will be here for a while still.

Malls are on their way out of Grand Rapids, not in

Realistically of the BIg three in GR, one one will survive. I suspect that will be Rivertown, just because its doing the best of all the others. But I don't see Either Woodland or Eastbrook being around much longer. Bring in a church, and ge it over with.

Besides, malls are loosing their popularity with school children anyway, its not as cool a place to hang out as say a park is, or a favorite restaurant. (This is ciming from a teenager I know) instead Malls are seen as places where the too privileged, and too snotty go to feel better of themselves The mall market is dried up here in Grand Rapids, and if another one was to be built, it certainly wouldnt go at that corner.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

[Budgie Frisket]

No way, no how. Woodland is actually a much more profitable mall per sq. foot than Rivertown, and still has better demographics than Rivertown. Have you been to Rivertown lately? Many empty stores.

I think both will survive. Rivertown is a mall-rat mall, Woodland is a shoppers mall. That might change with the new Movie theatre but I think Woodland will be here for a while still.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Personally, I much prefer Woodland now that all the river rats go out to Rivertown. Think it's dangerous to walk on the streets of GR with inattentive drivers? I can't tell you how many times people have bumped into me (and my poor mother!) at Rivertown because they weren't paying attention.

Moo.

That's why I do 99% of my shopping online. I only go to the mall if I have to return something. Saves on gas, too.

[snoogit]

No way, no how. Woodland is actually a much more profitable mall per sq. foot than Rivertown, and still has better demographics than Rivertown. Have you been to Rivertown lately? Many empty stores.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Actually I havent been to a mall since Rivertown opened, went into rivrtown once, and havent been to a mall since.

Honestly, everything I could possible need can be found elsewhere closer to me on Alpine.

Its got all the same shopping locales that 28th and Rivertown have, minus a few of the chain restaurants.

Granted, I based my ENTIIRE opinion of the current mall situation on the hearsay of a 15 yr old kid who isnt exactly a mainstream youth

[MJLO]

You have to consider the owners of the Malls too,

Woodland is owned by Taubman & Associates, Which behind Simon Properties, is the largest indoor shopping center Developer, it is also the most upscale shopping center company. Given that it's headquartered in Suburban Detroit, would explain why Detroit has some of the most upscale indoor shopping in the country. But back to the original point at hand, General Growth Properties, caters the malls they build to the more trendy "A&F" crowd if you will.

Taubman caters thier centers to the more affluent people with actual money. Given Woodlands close proximity to GR's more affluent Suburbs, that makes sense. Rivertown is a regional attraction to the Brittany's and Hillary's of todays youth. But given it's close proximity in Grandville, and Ottawa County (or as we coyly refer to around my house as the "Holy Land"), It is all style over substance, and that's consequently the reason it has been somewhat of a let down to the Malls Developers.

[GRCentro]

If Grand Rapids can truly support another mall, please don't let it be another glowy sprawl-incentive on the suburban fringe. Give me a real retail center, i.e. Water Tower, 900 North Michigan, Chicago Place, etc.

[snoogit]

If Grand Rapids can truly support another mall, please don't let it be another glowy sprawl-incentive on the suburban fringe.  Give me a real retail center, i.e.  Water Tower, 900 North Michigan, Chicago Place, etc.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

something that looks similar to chicago place would fit in with the GR architecture fairly well...

I would think if we truly need such a place should go up near the new convention center right on the city hall plot.

[jschutMTU]

back to how many malls GR has... there are 4 of them

Rivertown

Woodland

Centerpointe (up to around 90% occupancy last time a checked)

Breton Village

The last few times I have been in Centerpointe it was actually fairly busy, certainly not like most people may remember it 3 years ago.

As for Breton Village im sure some of you saw the article on Friday for the Omlette shop in the GR Press. I think its going where Village Seafood use to be. Looks like there is a lot of work being done to that mall and i hear the new Leigh's Clothing store is opening sometime early next month

[Prankster]

back to how many malls GR has... there are 4 of them

Rivertown

Woodland

Centerpointe (up to around 90% occupancy last time a checked)

Breton Village

The last few times I have been in Centerpointe it was actually fairly busy, certainly not like most people may remember it 3 years ago.

As for Breton Village im sure some of you saw the article on Friday for the Omlette shop in the GR Press.  I think its going where Village Seafood use to be.  Looks like there is a lot of work being done to that mall and i hear the new Leigh's Clothing store is opening sometime early next month

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

To take this topic in another direction, why can't we attract these kind of retailers to downtown? I'm not advocating building an enclosed mall, but you would think that we could siphone off a few of these guys into the downtown area. We are reaching the maximum of restaurants and delis in downtown, IMO. What we need are actual hardgoods retailers that will help complete the transformation from a 9 to 5 business part to a 24 hour vibrant city.

Any of the developers out there care to give an answer to this?

[allbusiness]

Granted, muskegon, holland, etc have malls too, so I don't know if theres a market for it or not.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

he he...Holland has a mall.....ha ha.....