Virginia Beach Stores, Retail, and Restaurants

[urbanvb]

man, I am failing in my old age. Yes indeed, City Walk.

[rusthebuss]

Could be a urban target like what we want there.

[urbanvb]

That would be great but never seen a Target locate so close to a Walmart - but who knows.

[urbanfan]

That would be great but never seen a Target locate so close to a Walmart - but who knows.

Not to get off topic, but the gettomart in hampton has a target right next door to it. Less than 1/1000th of a mile.

[rusthebuss]

The Target is very close to the Walmart on Princess Anne Rd. and the one in Norfolk aren't that far either

[wrldcoupe4]

Not to get off topic, but the gettomart in hampton has a target right next door to it. Less than 1/1000th of a mile.

In Fairfax in Fairlakes, there is a Target in the same shopping center as a walmart. There's a BJ's Wholesale in between them and that's it.

[urbanvb]

I heard today Target is still looking for a location around Pembroke but one has not been nailed down yet - at least that am aware of.

[rusthebuss]

I heard today Target is still looking for a location around Pembroke but one has not been nailed down yet - at least that am aware of.

I think it will be across the road from the Westin

[urbanvb]

Where exactly do you mean?

[vdogg]

Where exactly do you mean?

I think he means on the old Kroger lot, the one where it sounds like they're planning to put a strip center.

[urbanvb]

I think he means on the old Kroger lot, the one where it sounds like they're planning to put a stip center.

That store and site is much too small for a Target.

[hoobo]

That store and site is much too small for a Target.

It could work with an "urban" 2-story Target with roof-top parking.

What about turning the B&N/Planet Music/BB&B/Regal shopping center into a pedestrian friendly one by creating a t-street, building two parking structures where the outparcels and lots are, moving BB&B and the small retail to the bottom floors of those strucures, expaning Regal Columbus, and building a 2-story Target where BB&B now stands?

As much as I'd like a true downtown, I don't think VB can magically create a downtown in Pembroke. Norfolk, Portsmouth, Suffolk, NN, and Hampton all started out with grid patterns a century or more ago. The Oceanfront is really the only place in VB that has the design to be turned into a true downtown. Pembroke like Oyster Point/Jefferson Ave in NN can be truned into a hybrid downtown until over time a true downtown develops. Not some office/retail town center but a dense mixed-use area. Wal-mart and Target can be part of the birth of the Pembroke downtown. Eventually, they'll disappear, replaced with high-rises just as Pembroke Office Park with turn into streets of high-rises. I don't want strip malls, but "urban" big-box retail is okay with me now because one day they will be replaced.

Edited May 11, 2006 by hoobo

[vdogg]

Red mullet I've never heard of this resturant. Is this new?

[metalman]

Not really. There was one in Hilltop East that faced Lakin Road. From what I remember hearing, it was a bit pricey for a Dinner, they tried to make it up scale. It closed. Who knows...

Before it was the red mullet, it was a Denney's. Now it is the No Frills Grill. Which I heard the food is exactly like the one in Norfolk. I haven't been to this one yet.

I don't know where this Red Mullet is going to be. If I had to guess, I'd say Redmill Commons...ya know urban Pungo.

[urbanvb]

A peek at Brooks Brothers

[vdogg]

It's good that they're opening but it is kinda disappointing. It appears that this is a lower version of the actual Brooks Bros. chain because they didn't feel our area could support the real thing. I wish we could get past that.

[rusthebuss]

It's good that they're opening but it is kinda disappointing. It appears that this is a lower version of the actual Brooks Bros. chain because they didn't feel our area could support the real thing. I wish we could get past that.

We are still a stereotyped area with low paying jobs and just a tourist destination. This stereotype is going to take a long time to break away from.

[hoobo]

How is a store that's on par with Banana Republic a bad thing? San Fran and NoVa only have one store each. I don't really get how Richmond has a full-fledged Brooks Brothers, though. I only wish it was listed as "retail" and not "outlet" since it is a retail store.

[Stunad]

HR will continue to be typecast as an area that's a gamble, unless we get more high paying jobs/industry. It's unfortunate, but we are an overlooked region with regards to getting our just due recognition. With a population just shy of 2mil, we should have a lot more retail/restaurants than we presently do. Until we get over the stigma of "Just being a NAVY town," we'll never live up to our potential as a metropolitan area.

[vdogg]

How is a store that's on par with Banana Republic a bad thing? San Fran and NoVa only have one store each. I don't really get how Richmond has a full-fledged Brooks Brothers, though. I only wish it was listed as "retail" and not "outlet" since it is a retail store.

Wow, my earlier reply disappeared so I guess i'll try again. Must've happened when the site went down. I am by no means saying that this is a bad thing. I just think their excuse for not bringing their flagship store is getting a bit tired. I am happy that we are adding yet more retail to TC, I just wish we could break free of the "blue collar" stereotype. I think that the market does exist for higher end retail but retailers are reluctant to take the risk due to our military/tourist town image.

[wrldcoupe4]

How is a store that's on par with Banana Republic a bad thing? San Fran and NoVa only have one store each. I don't really get how Richmond has a full-fledged Brooks Brothers, though. I only wish it was listed as "retail" and not "outlet" since it is a retail store.

The Brooks Brothers store in Richmond is basically adjacent to the Saks Fifth Avenue at Stony Point. There are also some very strong demographics nearby with some of the highest household income in the region only a couple miles away.

If I was in HR, I'd be happy that a company such as this one looked at my market to test a new concept like this. I see nothing wrong with it. I'm sure retail companies do a little more research than simply listening to stereotypes about an area when it comes to opening a store.

[urbanvb]

The Richmond market with its many corporate offices and high paying jobs offers much different demographics from Hampton Roads. Although I would love to have a full fledged Brooks Brothers one may indeed argue if $1k suits would sell here. We have a much more casual atmosphere than Richmond so perhaps the more casual wear store is a better fit for us.

[hoobo]

Right on, urbanvb. Would anyone here pay the full retail prices on a full-fledged Brooks Brothers store? I know I wouldn't. When I go home and walk around Nordstrom, it appears fairly empty compared to the ones out here. Maybe I'm going at the wrong times, but the contrast is still striking. People in HR may be able to afford the real thing, but that doesn't mean they want to pay for it. My perception of the area, having grown up there, isn't that people are poor or are not fashionable, but that we're cost conscious. No one I knew shopped at WRV for clothes, because WRV charged $2 more per shirt than 17th St. Gap does fine but their low cost alternative, Old Navy, does better. And just look at H&M. HR people want good quality at good prices. Until Nordstrom starts doing really well, the upscale national chains will stay away. As for high-end fashions, HR has the mom & pop boutiques because they don't have to meet a certain sales quota to stay open.

Edited June 13, 2006 by hoobo

[baobabs727]

Wow, my earlier reply disappeared so I guess i'll try again. Must've happened when the site went down. I am by no means saying that this is a bad thing. I just think their excuse for not bringing their flagship store is getting a bit tired. I am happy that we are adding yet more retail to TC, I just wish we could break free of the "blue collar" stereotype. I think that the market does exist for higher end retail but retailers are reluctant to take the risk due to our military/tourist town image.

My sentiments, exactly. As for the rest of you who seem so willing to settle, so unwilling to challenge our region's development leaders, I offer you the following:

(Excerpt from an email I sent to Mr. Divaris 19 May 2006. No response received to date. And please remember, he was my source from almost the inception of this discussion forum. Note that while I was attempting to empathize with his plight and to take the high road, I did put that analogy before him for serious consideration and discussion.)

"Mr. Divaris--....Well, I was finally prompted to write to you again after having discovered last week that media reports (and actual early promotional signage?) referencing a Brooks Brothers store were--ahem--slightly off target. To make a not-so-veiled reference to my email of March 2005--: What LOFT is to Ann Taylor, _______(Blank) is to Brooks Brothers. Yes, I am disappointed; however, I am trying to take solace in the fact that the parent company committed to Town Center in some form. Are you at liberty to fill me in on the details? Thanks."

(Excerpt from an email I sent to Carolyn Shapiro on 1 June 2006. Of course, she penned the aforementioned article of 13 June 2006 on this very subject.)

"Ms. Shapiro--I'm a huge fan of Town Center and of Norfolk and Virginia Beach development, in general. Over the past decade or more, I have experienced both elation and deep disappointment with regard the local retail and development scene. Unfortunately, I write to you today as a concerned and somewhat frustrated development wonk. Specifically, I'm writing to you to ask you to investigate the story behind Brooks Brothers and Town Center.

As you may know, the original announcement from Mr. Divaris indicated that Brooks Brothers had chosen Town Center as their point of entry into the Hampton Roads retail marketplace. Promotional signage at the future store location soon followed. These signs were dark blue and sported the usual Brooks Brothers logo. At no time that I can recall did Mr. Divaris let on that we would receive anything other than the classic Brooks Brothers store, one replete with fashionable men's (and sometimes women's) suits, dress shirts, ties, slacks, etc. A big step up from the Men's Wearhouse, for sure! So, imagine my surprise when one day during a "drive by" I spied the Brooks Brothers "346" signage being installed over the main doors. Huh? 346? What is a 346, you ask?? I had no idea, but I was determined to find out. In fact, I went home and Googled this 346 creature straight away. The hits were scarce, but what I was able to locate caused me some heartburn.

Apparently, the 346 concept is a new one for Brooks Brothers. This concept involves a line of "casual" clothing obviously marketed to a different (read: lower) demographic than the clothing found at the classic Brooks Brothers unit. Ironically, the only detailed article I could find on 346

(* http://www.kansas.com/mld/kansas/business/...rs/14351923.htm ) featured a Wichita developer actually bragging that Brooks Brothers had reversed course there, deciding to provide his development with a full scale Brooks Brothers store rather than the 346 concept the company had originally intended to build. The developer went so far as to mention that the reason for the change was the retailer's favorable impression of their own tour of Wichita and of the presentation of the demographics for that MSA. My goodness! What irony! So, might we infer that Brooks Brothers took another look at our own demographics and decided to dump their full scale (read: upscale) store and replace it with this lesser 346 concept?? I sure hope not, but I fear there is truth in this supposition.

Anyway, I emailed Mr. Divaris about this issue nearly 2 weeks ago, but I have not received any response. This is unsual for him. I must tell you that I have met with Mr. Divaris in person and have communicated with him and his staff by email on several occasions over the past few years. I have always found Mr. Divaris to be open, honest and generous of spirit. However, I do feel a bit betrayed by this latest development. I simply want to know what he knew and when he knew it? I would also like to hear from Brooks Brothers on their decision to build a 346 store instead of the originally announced Brooks Brothers store.

I do thank you for your time and hope that you will give serious consideration to my request for an investigative article (or at least an inquiry). Thanks."

(Finally, an excerpt from my thank you note to Ms. Shapiro today)

"Ms. Shaprio--I wrote to you a couple of weeks ago about the

[vdogg]

Welcome back, long time noe hear.