Norfolk Stores and Retail and Resturants

[CaveMaN]

I think it's equally unfair to compare Norfolk to Charlotte or Baltimore. After all, where do you go for entertainment in those cities? Most likely the only places they have: downtown. Hampton Roads, on the other hand, due to several large independent cities, has numerous competing destinations. You don't have to go to downtown Norfolk for a huge selection of places for dinner or nightlife. You can also go to the oceanfront, Shore Drive, Town Center, Greenbrier, downtown Portsmouth, the Peminsula, etc. If you were to compare the aggregate of those places to those other cities, it would be a completely different story. The problem with Hampton Roads is that because we have multiple cities, we have a region spread out and dispersed much like Washington, DC, with several different centers of activity. The difference is that DC has 3 times our population and can more easily handle these many centers. In some ways having this diversity and options is good; in other ways, it usually results in unfair (or incomplete) comparisons.

I guess it comes down to preference... I'd much rather have there be 1 place to go with everything, than have the alternative as we seem to have in hampton roads. I understand that that's just the way it is here, but it's frustrating as varider mentioned when you go elsewhere & return.

I really enjoyed Baltimore's inner harbor, I"m not quite sure why Norfolk hasn't made more of an attempt at mimicking that type of setup on our harbor. The thing I enjoy most about Charlotte is the streetscape, it's beautiful, the trees, the marble curbs & sidewalks...the way the buildings seem to be one with their surroundings. Don't get me wrong, I love parts of downtown Norfolk... freemason area is beautiful, and ghent is gorgeous as well, but our downtown just is lacking in many areas. I just hope they continue with the betterments, but they have a long way to go.

[varider]

Most likely a biased statement, but Norfolk is one of the most beautiful city centers on the east coast. The activity in the harbor, cruise ships docked, the Wisconson, Town Point Park, Scope, Harbor Park, Granby Street, ect. I love it so much. It's peaceful on a Sunday to just stroll Downtown. You guys might disagree but I think with the 5 or 6 new stores at Wells Fargo and the Westin some parts of Downtown will be just as great as Baltimore/ Charlotte. Monticello should be booming with activity (i think some of you are underestimating the effect wells fargo will have) if the stores are cool, Granby and Main Street always have activity. I think Norfolk will be alright. Like someone commented earlier, in 25 or so years Norfolk will be a great, urban, booming, big city............... hopefully

Edited April 13, 2009 by varider

[urbanvb]

I think Norfolk is doing a heck a lot of good things. It's mayor seems to be progressive and wanting to move forward. Look who is bringing the first light rail to the region. It's just taking longer than what we would like. I'm hoping light rail will go over big and make folks realize just what mass transit can provide for the area.

[urbanlife]

Jacksonville compared to Portland

Just read this, thought I would post it here seeing it goes with what is being talked about in here.

While I do think our Urban Growth Boundary has had a very positive effect on the city, forcing residents to deal with anything they dont like about their city rather than move to the far off suburbs, we are in no way a city with just one place to go in our city. While there is great things to do downtown, much of the activity happens outside of downtown as well...and this is what I am getting at with being connected. The problems with Oceanview have an effect on downtown Norfolk. If the city focused on how to make each neighborhood within the city vibrate and connected, downtown would do the same because it would be addressed the same way.

Portland Design Guidelines

This is a link to the design guidelines for each neighborhood and downtown of Portland. In each pdf(which are free to look at, they cost money to order copies), it shows what is required of each new development and what they have to do to work within the city...new development should work for the city, not just be a new building in the city. If Norfolk wants to change its city and push it forward, it will need much more than just a guideline for what type of aesthetics are allowed on a building.

[mistermetaj]

Comparing Norfolk to other cities and metros is pointless. The MAJORITY of the money and population is in the suburbs of Va Beach. On top of that, Norfolk, like Baltimore has a reputation for being very unsafe (I know it's not, but a lot of people don't see it that way) and is not a destination among its metro, let alone the rest of the country. Furthermore, with the exception of suburban areas like Va Beach and Chesapeake, Portsmouth, Newport News, and Hampton have a very poor population. Furthermore, there is constant fighting among all cities for businesses, thus creating such a spreading affect of the new business (workers, investments, developments, etcs) that everything in Norfolk is stunted, thus people don't move in to be closer to work because their work isn't in Norfolk. On top of all of that, there is no business for young people in this region, unless they want to be in the Navy. No finance, little engineering or architecture, outside of the shipyards. There is just not a demand for a downtown right now we all want.

On top of that, the transit in this area is horrendous. Richmond, DC (and Nova), Wilmington(that place should not be bigger than Norfolk it is), Philly, NYC, all connecte by 95 and Amtrak. Amtrak won't come past NN right now which is simply pathetic. There is simply no major highway near the area, and the bridge tunnel did nothing to help, because 13 stayed a route without any real connections to the Northeast. On top of that, this metro is about the 33 biggest in the country, and not growing.

The only thing Norfolk can do to turn this around is to one (and they are trying) get a high speed rail to the southside connecting to the Northeast, offer incentives to big companies and banks to build headquarters in the city, and build up a middleclass population in downtown.

Places like St. Paul's place is a chance to do some of those things, but already there's a fight for "affordable housing" which for this area means welfare housing. Not a good way to convince your metro that the area is becoming safer.

As for retail, I don't know why Norfolk is doing so bad with retail at the street level..cough, cough...Mccarthur Mall...It served its initial purpose by bringing people and business back downtown, but now it's just stealing all the businesses and leaving the streets bare with nothing but cheap retaurants and bars.

The pattern book wants more retail space and I love that, hopefully from here on out development will cater to that.

[mistermetaj]

Officials push for high speed rail service to region

Here is your ticket to a much bigger and better Norfolk. Most likely, it will just stop at richmond and not come to us. We are the forgotten region of the state.

[urbanlife]

Officials push for high speed rail service to region

Here is your ticket to a much bigger and better Norfolk. Most likely, it will just stop at richmond and not come to us. We are the forgotten region of the state.

geographically at a disadvantage as well....minus the water connection. Though the possibility of having high speed rail run from Richmond to Norfolk could potentially happen...but I wouldnt want to hold my breath for that.

[ffjjjj]

I think Norfolk is doing a heck a lot of good things. It's mayor seems to be progressive and wanting to move forward.

I agree completely, and would go even further and say I believe Mayor Paul Fraim may possibly be the most progressive and best mayor the city has ever had. Certainly, I believe, he has worked harder than anyone to grow the downtown specifically, and the city as a whole. Seems to really want to promote city growth and knows how to do it and get it done. Seems to be an unusually smart and forward thinking individual. He has done a lot, especially given his difficult positiion of having to deal with the traditional competition (animosity?) from CONTIGUOUS large cities Ches. and VB!

Edited April 13, 2009 by ffjjjj

[mistermetaj]

I guess it comes down to preference... I'd much rather have there be 1 place to go with everything, than have the alternative as we seem to have in hampton roads. I understand that that's just the way it is here, but it's frustrating as varider mentioned when you go elsewhere & return.

I really enjoyed Baltimore's inner harbor, I"m not quite sure why Norfolk hasn't made more of an attempt at mimicking that type of setup on our harbor. The thing I enjoy most about Charlotte is the streetscape, it's beautiful, the trees, the marble curbs & sidewalks...the way the buildings seem to be one with their surroundings. Don't get me wrong, I love parts of downtown Norfolk... freemason area is beautiful, and ghent is gorgeous as well, but our downtown just is lacking in many areas. I just hope they continue with the betterments, but they have a long way to go.

I was at Baltimore's nner harbor a little over a month ago. It is really very nice and a great place to visit. However, it is kind of like disneyland when compared to the rest of teh city which is really filthy and unwelcoming. I would not want Norfolk to be anything like Baltimore unless it was JUST referring to the inner harbor.

Charlotte is really pretty with its fountains and all, but it is still a small downtown. Obviously bigger than ours, but still very small compared to the northeastern downtowns.

[varider]

guys, with the addition of belmont @ freemason, westin, wells fargo, and the expansion of tcc, i honestly believe downtown will be close to a big downtown(not big as in Philly, NYC obviously).the population growth will have streets more busy, meaning businesses will feel good about opening up stores downtown. westin will be able to hold big conferences, the additional residents, and obviously more hotel guests, wells fargo of course has the retail, and around 1300 more workers in downtown (EXPECT HORRID TRAFFIC), and the expansion of TCC will mean more foot traffic as well. I think if all of that happens it will at least give us the largest downtown in the state. And hopefully the Westin will become our tallest giving us a great skyline as well. By 2020 my crystal ball has Norfolk having the biggest, most inviting downtown between Philly and Charlotte. I mean come on we have all the additions i mentioned St. Pauls Quadrant, Skyscraper hopefully on Snyder Lot, Granby Tower Lot, come on we got this Norfolk.

Edited April 13, 2009 by varider

[Sky06]

geographically at a disadvantage as well....minus the water connection. Though the possibility of having high speed rail run from Richmond to Norfolk could potentially happen...but I wouldnt want to hold my breath for that.

Am I wrong to believe that the rest of the state doesn't want this to come to HR? If that's the case, the region has to work together to get the message to the Feds and not try to rely solely on Virginia. But I'm wondering if things have changed, considering the state's desire to fund light rail in Norfolk and even VB. The demand for high speed rail (with military, business travelers, tourists, international folks at NATO, etc.) is much higher here than Richmond or a lot of other places on the proposed corridor. Making people drive from here to a stop 2 hours away is also counter-productive.

Edited April 13, 2009 by Sky06

[mikeas]

Am I wrong to believe that the rest of the state doesn't want this to come to HR? If that's the case, the region has to work together to get the message to the Feds and not try to rely solely on Virginia. But I'm wondering if things have changed, considering the state's desire to fund light rail in Norfolk and even VB. The demand for high speed rail (with military, business travelers, tourists, international folks at NATO, etc.) is much higher here than Richmond or a lot of other places on the proposed corridor. Making people drive from here to a stop 2 hours away is also counter-productive.

I'd like to see a multi-modal transportation corridor that runs from Atlantic City down the Eastern Shore through Hampton Roads eventually linking back up with 95 somewhere in North Carolina. I95 needs a bypass and the road network is almost there to have it come straight through HR.

[varider]

I think everyone on this site needs to write letters to our representatives, state government, and federal government officials. We need to stress the fact that there is 1.7 million residents in Hampton Roads that would absolutely love to have convenient high speed rail available in them middle of Downtown Norfolk. It is not fair for Richmond to get everything when they have a lesser population than Hampton Roads. There is the same amount of people in the Southside of HR then the whole Richmond Metro. Seriously guys lets get to work.

[varider]

Oh and guys Norfolk was humming with activity today

[mikeas]

A new Chinese restaurant will be opening soon between Bugattis and Domo Sushi on College Place. It's called Panda Garden and the signage was installed very recently. The address is 109 College Place. I like that the side streets are finally becoming populated.

http://www.superpages.com/bp/Norfolk-VA/Pa...L2113072140.htm

[Ghentite]

New hookah lounge is being built on 21st st in Ghent about a block from the Chanelo's Pizza joint. Good to see they're renovating some of those unique little locals on 21st. They have a ton of potential to be made into shops or cafes, especially if that Ghent Station gets built there.

[Sky06]

New hookah lounge is being built on 21st st in Ghent about a block from the Chanelo's Pizza joint. Good to see they're renovating some of those unique little locals on 21st. They have a ton of potential to be made into shops or cafes, especially if that Ghent Station gets built there.

Has anyone tried the Hookah bar at Nazef on Colley?

I went to 626 Press last Friday, and it was great. Very good food, huge wine list (with ABC off), Grolsch beer with pop-lid, packed. As someone said, I'll be back.

[Weaver24]

Swarovski Crystal is going to open in MacArthur in the old L'Occitane space on the second floor next to Cache and Starbucks. The sign is up now. I heard from an employee in the mall that the reason why L'Occitane closed is because Swarovski is willing to pay more money for the small space than L'Occitane and that L'Occitane was unable to renew their lease with Tubman. This is great but they just opened a store at Lynnhaven around 2 years ago. I'm suprised that they would even open a second location in Hampton Roads, especially another on the southside. I mean how many crystals do we need. I can't see this being a store that most of us are going or able to patronize on a regular basis. But this is good news that the mall is still able to attract some quality tenants.

Edited May 3, 2009 by Weaver24

[okinawatyphoon]

Swarovski Crystal is going to open in MacArthur in the old L'Occitane space on the second floor next to Cache and Starbucks. The sign is up now. I heard from an employee in the mall that the reason why L'Occitane closed is because Swarovski is willing to pay more money for the small space than L'Occitane and that L'Occitane was unable to renew their lease with Tubman. This is great but they just opened a store at Lynnhaven around 2 years ago. I'm suprised that they would even open a second location in Hampton Roads, especially another on the southside. I mean how many crystals do we need. I can't see this being a store that most of us are going or able to patronize on a regular basis. But this is good news that the mall is still able to attract some quality tenants.

That's great news. Swarovski stores are fantastic.

[miklos]

I was at Baltimore's nner harbor a little over a month ago. It is really very nice and a great place to visit. However, it is kind of like disneyland when compared to the rest of teh city which is really filthy and unwelcoming. I would not want Norfolk to be anything like Baltimore unless it was JUST referring to the inner harbor.

Charlotte is really pretty with its fountains and all, but it is still a small downtown. Obviously bigger than ours, but still very small compared to the northeastern downtowns.

I could not let your comment about Baltimore outside of the Inner Harbor being "filthy and unwelcoming" go by without comment. True, baltimore has some truly horrid abandoned, crime-infested parts, but it has also some of the most attractive and vibrant neighborhoods to be found anywhere in the Northeast. Have you ever walked around Bolton Hill, Mont Vernon, Little Italy, Federal Hill, Fells Point, just to name the best known? To me, they are all actually far more "welcoming" than the overly "touristy" Inner Harbor. Norfolk's Ghent is a great neighborhood and I love exploring it on foot, but much of the rest of Norfolk would benefit from looking more like the best of Baltimore neighborhoods.

[lil-bear]

I could not let your comment about Baltimore outside of the Inner Harbor being "filthy and unwelcoming" go by without comment. True, baltimore has some truly horrid abandoned, crime-infested parts, but it has also some of the most attractive and vibrant neighborhoods to be found anywhere in the Northeast. Have you ever walked around Bolton Hill, Mont Vernon, Little Italy, Federal Hill, Fells Point, just to name the best known? To me, they are all actually far more "welcoming" than the overly "touristy" Inner Harbor. Norfolk's Ghent is a great neighborhood and I love exploring it on foot, but much of the rest of Norfolk would benefit from looking more like the best of Baltimore neighborhoods.

I have had the terror of driving all around Baltimore and I was horrified. Outside of the Inner Harbor there are blocks and blocks and blocks and blocks of run-down or abandoned row houses. Trash everywhere, the occasional shaddy person, and questionable corner stores with bars on the windows. Almost looks like the result of a bomb site. I have never seen any park of Norfolk or Portsmouth look that bad!!!!!

[Telmnstr]

I have had the terror of driving all around Baltimore and I was horrified. Outside of the Inner Harbor there are blocks and blocks and blocks and blocks of run-down or abandoned row houses. Trash everywhere, the occasional shaddy person, and questionable corner stores with bars on the windows. Almost looks like the result of a bomb site. I have never seen any park of Norfolk or Portsmouth look that bad!!!!!

Man I've got a story about buying a video projector (the 150 pound kind with 3 crt's on the front) from ebay, and going to pick it up in person in Baltimore.

[usermel]

I could not let your comment about Baltimore outside of the Inner Harbor being "filthy and unwelcoming" go by without comment. True, baltimore has some truly horrid abandoned, crime-infested parts, but it has also some of the most attractive and vibrant neighborhoods to be found anywhere in the Northeast. Have you ever walked around Bolton Hill, Mont Vernon, Little Italy, Federal Hill, Fells Point, just to name the best known? To me, they are all actually far more "welcoming" than the overly "touristy" Inner Harbor. Norfolk's Ghent is a great neighborhood and I love exploring it on foot, but much of the rest of Norfolk would benefit from looking more like the best of Baltimore neighborhoods.

I will side with Miklos on this one, while I respect the fellow members opinion truly. I have been to Baltimore and love the city. Without question a city of it size has its issues but, some of the brownstones and other older buildings there are classic. I love Norfolk and was born there but, Baltimore has a charm and spunk to it. The row houses and run down parts of Baltimore are just a small part of it and theres much more beauty to this city(Ravens Stadium). I know some thugs from Baltimore personally and its more of an environment and who they hang with issue along with economics. Also, we have crime and bad areas here in Norfolk as well.

Looks can be deceiving!! I Love Norfolk but, we must give Baltimore some respect here. If we want respect for our city Norfolk, let's give it to other great cities as well. Come on Johnny Unitas/Burt Jones(Baltimore Colts) classic!!! L.G.N.M

Edited May 4, 2009 by usermel

[mistermetaj]

I could not let your comment about Baltimore outside of the Inner Harbor being "filthy and unwelcoming" go by without comment. True, baltimore has some truly horrid abandoned, crime-infested parts, but it has also some of the most attractive and vibrant neighborhoods to be found anywhere in the Northeast. Have you ever walked around Bolton Hill, Mont Vernon, Little Italy, Federal Hill, Fells Point, just to name the best known? To me, they are all actually far more "welcoming" than the overly "touristy" Inner Harbor. Norfolk's Ghent is a great neighborhood and I love exploring it on foot, but much of the rest of Norfolk would benefit from looking more like the best of Baltimore neighborhoods.

It was proposed that Norfolk become more like Baltimore. It was not proposed that Norfolk become more like "just the nice parts" but all of Baltimore. That being said, for all the good Baltimore has, it has a large portion of the city that is very dangerous (or at least has that stigma) and I would not want all of that, even for the good Baltimore does have. I guess I conveyed my opinion in a more harsh way than I should have, but that was the only point I was trying to get across.

Edited May 5, 2009 by mistermetaj

[varider]

Baltimore is a cool city. I love Camden Yards, Inner Harbor, and the aquarium. Other than that, I have yet to see these nice parts of Baltimore. I'd love to though. Baltimore really isn't the greatest city for business either. I've heard arguments that Norfolk is better than Baltimore business wise. Same amount of fortune 500 companies if I'm not mistaken. Both cities have rough neighborhoods. Not downplaying anybody's city but I understand where mistermetaj is coming from. One day I do think Norfolk will be more successful than Baltimore.