Did Bush and the Federal Govt Fail New Orleans

[monsoon]

Since we have had multiple political discussions break out on Bush's failure or success with dealing with the New Orleans disaster, I've decided to consolidate them all here. Please limit discussions on Bush's abilities as president as it relates to NO to this thread.

[Viper]

From my understanding, this is FEMA's area, not Bush. All these attacks on him are unwarranted as his actions are irrelavent to what is happeneing.

Emergency relief decisions are made by others like FEMA.

[ironchapman]

From my understanding, this is FEMA's area, not Bush.  All these attacks on him are unwarranted as his actions are irrelavent to what is happeneing. 

Emergency relief decisions are made by others like FEMA.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I agree with you there Viper.

Also, a disaster of this magnitude requires quite extensive planning from the government as to how they will provide relief that apparently our era of instant gratification doesn't seem to allow. If the government had just rushed in there the day after Katrina left, it might be in the same situation as many hink it is in Iraq, entering without a well thought out plan. Also, there are a few other things to consider:

• The magnitude: The most common disaster I see this situation compared to is 9/11, which affected only three major buildings. It is much easier to gain enough men and money to search through the ruins of a few buildings than the ruins of an entire city & region.

• Accessibility: 9/11's affected buildings were still able to be accessed through many streets, so aid could come in from all directions. New Orleans has, I believe, only one or two links that are on the western side of the metro. This makes it a lot more difficult for relief to get in and out without putting the supplies/people transported at risk.

I'll post more later.

Could they have gone a little faster? Probably, but coming up with an effective plan would still take a couple of days.

[krazeeboi]

I believe there is plenty of blame to go around for all levels of governement: local, state, and federal.

[Gusterfell]

Fact: Bush was warned in early 2001 that a major hurricane flooding NO was one of the three most likely disasters to strike the US in the near future. (another was a terrorist attack in NY, BTW.)

Fact: Bush diverted funding for strengthening the levees to pay for his tax cut and crusade in Iraq.

Fact: Bush diverted the National Guard from its duty of guarding the nation to fight his war, leaving minimal forces available at home to respond to a disaster.

That, my friends, is criminal negligence.

Also, a disaster of this magnitude requires quite extensive planning from the government as to how they will provide relief that apparently our era of instant gratification doesn't seem to allow. If the government had just rushed in there the day after Katrina left, it might be in the same situation as many hink it is in Iraq, entering without a well thought out plan...

Could they have gone a little faster? Probably, but coming up with an effective plan would still take a couple of days.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

How long do they need to plan for this? There were years of warnings that this disaster was going to happen, sooner or later. Plans should have been in place, ready to be implimented. The Bush administration claims they are making us safer, but I find that hard to believe when it takes four days for them to begin to help victims of a predictable disaster. How would the administration react to a nuclear terrorist attack? How would they react if a terrorist had bombed the NO levees?

This administration is incompetent, and a disgrace to the nation.

[MikesLogic]

I see Bush has become the pinata for this party.. The people I would lay blame on are local government for failing to organize an evacuation plan that included the poor/elderly/sick and those that just could not get out by their own means.

Federal government has been going 24/7 non-stop since they were ordered to take over this effort. Coast Guard has been plucking people off of houses since the flooding began. I just don't see how the blame could be placed on Bush of all people...

[derrickskugler]

Gusterfell... never let REAL facts stand in the way of a ridiculous attempt to further your agenda...

FACT: Of course Bush was warned that a hurricane was a major problem in N.O. It ALWAYS has been. You do remember Betsy in 1965, do you not? Yeah, let's blame Bush for that while we're at it. He must have had SOMETHING to do with it, afterall... It was a major problem when Clinton was President as well... as it was with Bush the elder, Reagan, Carter, etc., etc. This response would have been no different had Clinton or anyone else been President. Since we're using "facts"... here's one for you: The Federal Government wasn't even asked to provide assistance from the Governor of Louisiana until more than 48 hours after Katrina hit. Perhaps some of the onus should be thrust upon the Governor of Louisiana and Mayor of New Orleans, both of which had absolutely no clue how to address this situation. But, that doesn't fit your liberal agenda because... well... they're liberals.

FACT: Bush did NOT divert funding to strengthen the levees. He instituted a hiring freeze. He did not cut funding or divert funding. Your second "fact" is also a lie. Nice try, though.

FACT: Bush used the National Guard to help fight the war on terror. That's what he SHOULD have done. If he hadn't done that, you'd be somewhere b*tching that we need more troops over there and blaming him for that. If you dug a little deeper than your liberal talking points that you bummed off of Michael Moore, you'd also know that over 60% of the National Guard in the states of Florida, Georgia, Alabama, Mississippi & Louisiana is in the United States right now. Yes, they are HERE, not in Iraq or Afghanistan. Oops, there goes another one of your little "facts".

I should probably stop now seeing as how all of your liberal talking points have been destroyed for all to see. Now, go back to whatever you were doing before.

NOTE: I apologize for the tone of this post, but I have truly HAD IT with people who throw around complete and total LIES and try to pass them off as FACT hoping that people won't take the time to actually do the research and find out the TRUTH.

Furthermore, this is a time of national tragedy. Shame on those who choose to use this as an opportunity to further thier political agenda. As I said in another post... in this situation we are not Republicans or Democrats, we are Americans. It's time that some of us started remembering that.

[facilities man]

What bothers me is the delay in getting buses to get the people out after the fact. Seriously, how long does it take for the Gov., or Pres., to pick up a phone and tell, not ask the nearest non affected cities to send all their public transportation buses, school buses, tour buses, whatever. This should have been done in a day, and they should have arrive within 24 hours, even coming from Houston, Dallas, or even Atlanta or Jacksonville. This was totally unacceptable in my opinion. If the people would have be evacuated with 48 hours a lot of the looting, trouble and suffering could have been avoided. We can roll across Iraq in 72 hours during the liberation of Kuwait, but we can't send buses from a city 8 hours or less away?????

[cityboi]

You cant blame Bush on the Hurricane disaster but you can blame him and his administratio partially for the flooding in New Orleans. There was suppose to be millions of dollars alotted for upgrading the leveys in New Orleans a few years ago. But Bush 's war in Iraq combined with the big tax cuts to the rich took money away from the levey upgrades. The upgrades was suppose to be able to withstand a category 5 hurricane. THis is where Bush failed and many people didnt have to die.

[Florida]

All this week I've seen mainly starving, homeless black people on t.v.

Yesterday I saw Bush handshaking and hugging mainly white people, or in one case a very beautiful light-skinned black mother and daughter, both of whom had nice hair, and clean clothes on.

My first question was... where did these people come from? Especially those who seemed to be there just to see Bush, smiling, pumping their fist and cheering. Then my other question, why didn't I see him around any of the "truly devistated" people... those we've seen on the news all week crying, hungry, and begging for help.

Just my observation.

[derrickskugler]

Um... Cityboi... are you also not paying attention to facts? BUSH DID NOT TAKE MONEY AWAY FROM THE LEVEE UPGRADES!!! He instituted a hiring freeze. This did not effect the levees one bit. HELLO, FACTS!?!!?!?

[cityboi]

I think because thos really desparate people are pretty mad at Bush right now so its a security issue

[facilities man]

Past neglagence should be shared by all presidents going back to Kennedy. The problem with the levees was known for decades. None of the administrations wanted to commit the money for a project that might not be needed for decades. They all just spent the money on something else and crossed their fingers.

Since this was a known problem a bigger part of the blame for the mess is the lack of planning to deal with the result of a known problem. Where was the activation of an evacuation plan. The Mayor of NO's plan seems to have been wait for a catastrophe and then beg for help. This is an unbelievable lack of leadership to say the least.

[derrickskugler]

Thank you Facilities Man! Someone who uses logic! Let me buy you a beer, bro...

[Florida]

I think because thos really desparate people are pretty mad at Bush right now so its a security issue

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

So then its clear they feel he has failed them...

But I only wonder... isn't that like having a ton of very sick people in the hospital Emergency room, and the doctor only providing care for the clean, more attractive ones? It really doesn't matter to me how angry someone may be with me... if I'm there to help them... I'm there to help.

Playing politics with disasters isn't cool to me.

[sleepy]

From my understanding, this is FEMA's area, not Bush.  All these attacks on him are unwarranted as his actions are irrelavent to what is happeneing. 

Emergency relief decisions are made by others like FEMA.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

FEMA's part of the executive branch of government of which Bush is the head.

He appoints the directors of both Homeland Security and FEMA, which is an agency of Homeland Security.

Gusterfell...  never let REAL facts stand in the way of a ridiculous attempt to further your agenda...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Facts on the cuts made to the Corps of Engineers and to federal flood control for southeastern Louisiana can be found here:

http://www.realcities.com/mld/krwashington/12528233.htm

Federal flood control spending for southeastern Louisiana dropped from $69 million in 2001 to $36.5 million in 2005.

Corps of Engineers' budget for Lake Pontchartrain hurricane flooding was cut from $14.25 million in 2002 to $5.7 million this year.

The Engineers' New Orleans office's budget was cut 71 million dollars and they cut funds to pay for a study on how to protect NOLA from a Category 5 storm.

In June of last year, the Engineers stopped major work on the NOLA levee system. The Times-Picayune ran an extensive series on that several months ago, and said that it was the first time in 37 years that had happened.

As for FEMA Even Bush's former director of FEMA's disaster management program has severely criticized FEMA's current ineptitude.

Didn't realize Clinton was still president--the buck stops with Bubba, I guess.

[derrickskugler]

Then I stand corrected, and the special I watched on TV a few months back was all incorrect information.

I'm proud to be uninformed. :->

[Florida]

Past neglagence should be shared by all presidents going back to Kennedy. The problem with the levees was known for decades. None of the administrations wanted to commit the money for a project that might not be needed for decades. They all just spent the money on something else and crossed their fingers.

Since this was a known problem a bigger part of the blame for the mess is the lack of planning to deal with the result of a known problem. Where was the activation of an evacuation plan. The Mayor of NO's plan seems to have been wait for a catastrophe and then beg for help. This is an unbelievable lack of leadership to say the least.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

John F Kennedy (D)

Lyndon Baines Johnson (D)

Richard Milhous Nixon

[cityboi]

Bottom line is there is enough blame to go around and Bush should be included. It like to some people Bush can do no wrong or make mistakes. Bush failed New Orleans, The governor of Louisiana failed New Orleans and the mayor, who is black, failed New Orleans.

[Florida]

Then I stand corrected, and the special I watched on TV a few months back was all incorrect information.

[kayman]

I have no political alligence to either liberal or conservative interests because I'm moderate. However, for some reason or another, I have a disheartening feeling race & politics are factors for such a huge delay.

In 2004, less than 36 hours after Hurricane Ivan had past through Florida panhandle and Southern Alabama, there were rescue crews and FEMA all over in each and every community affected. If you can argue that something is not fishy about the comparsions of these two similar situations but with different responses, then you are either ignorant or deeply in denial and God have mercy on your soul.

I say let this catastrophe be a warning to those in government who love to play politics, Karma is going to be a beotch for you down the road.

[Florida]

I agree 100%

[cityboi]

agreed!

[kayman]

Then I stand corrected, and the special I watched on TV a few months back was all incorrect information. 

I'm proud to be uninformed.  :->

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

SIDE NOTE: Ignorance, like money, are one of the roots of all evil.

[rusthebuss]

Why should the federal govt. keep paying for a city that continues to sink??? Why should the American people pay for stupidity of a city built that far below sea level?Everyone that blames Bush is just saying that due to their political bias! Also everyone talks about how good clinton was! He had a chance to kill Bin Ladden and dropped the ball! Just like I hear everyone screaming racist crap and it makes me sick! They had trouble getting people out of OBX when Isabelle hit us so give me a break. It was entirely to dangerous to send people in there at the time. The mayor and the governor should have bused those people out before the storm hit. Most of those people didn't want to go cause they where scared people where going to steal their stuff after the hurricane! Liberals pick the darnest times to attack. This is a disaster and yet this is always when they pick to use to their agenda!