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zenstyle

Kendall and the Keeler Building

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...for Kendall School of Art & Design to take over/lease/rent/whatever some floors of the kitty-corner Keeler Building as dorm spaces. Kendall used to have a few studio spaces there for senior students, but I don't know if that's still the case. What's the newest information?

zenstyle, always a-thirst for the latest scoop

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I haven't heard anything about that. It would be nice if they did take over those two buildings, but it looks like their expansion plans include the current Art Museum Building, and the Commerce Building North of that. They have already had 3 floors of Commerce renovated for student housing.

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I haven't heard anything about that.  It would be nice if they did take over those two buildings, but it looks like their expansion plans include the current Art Museum Building, and the Commerce Building North of that.  They have already had 3 floors of Commerce renovated for student housing.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Im sort of saddend by the fact that commerce is going to be used for student housing, I was hoping it would become part of a new city government complex on ionia

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I'm sure Azzar messed up the whole deal. The Keeler building could be so cool. I'd love to see that block spruced up (besides what is going on at Civic). Azzar needs to offload the property on someone who will do something with it, and SBC needs to get off their ass and stop making the old Michigan Bell building look as fortress like as possible. In fact, I'm cancelling my DSL tonight in protest... ;)

Joe

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While searching through commercial property on the Commercial Association of Realtors site, I came across this interesting rendition of the building.

353938.JPG

I wonder if this is a drawing from a past project that never worked out, or just some sketch so they don't have to show an actual photo of the building.

It's listed at $750,000 and has 15,000 sq ft.

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Yah, I've seen that before dbrok. It's got to be so Azzar doesn't have to post a picture of that dump. I think Nitro looked at this building before, and it is very tough to redevelop due to its location and the horrendous price on it. Drop it down to $300K or so, and then maybe ;)

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It was not feasible for Kendall to use the building as student housing so after looking at many buildings the Commerce Building was chosen. Yes, Keeler would have been ideal, but it wouldn't work due to the design of the building and, yes, the jacked up cost once interest was shown.

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I think Nitro looked at this building before, and it is very tough to redevelop due to its location and the horrendous price on it.

I looked at it. It was going to be hard to redevelop without any parking in close proximity. The building is in suprisingly ok condition and would be cool lofts.

It would make great student housing for Kendall but unfortunately the lower rental rates for student housing rarely work out in a developer's pro forma to offset the relatively high costs of redevelopment.

Nitro

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Indeed there is a parking crunch for the Kendall building (in fact, unless there is a parking spot or two in the alley behind the building, it has NO parking) but that would be a perfect scenario for student housing. I just hope Azzar releases the stranglehold on the building. Maybe a meteor can hit him in the head? ;)

Joe

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Isn't there an alley right behind the building? Would it be possible to park on the ground floor? I know some of you guys hate that, but IMO its better than the eyesore we have now.

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Indeed there is, but I think Civic owns the alleyway. It is pretty small and only has one entrance (from Sheldon).

Isn't there an alley right behind the building? Would it be possible to park on the ground floor? I know some of you guys hate that, but IMO its better than the eyesore we have now.

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Indeed there is, but I think Civic owns the alleyway. It is pretty small and only has one entrance (from Sheldon).

I just checked. The space directly behind the building is owned by the children's museum.

link

I wonder if they would consider sharing?

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I wonder if they would consider sharing?

I think it's a moot point. One parking space accomplishes nothing for that building. The few other spaces that are back there are used by museum staff. There is however an easement for horse and carrage unloading that goes with the Kendall Building, so it's got that going for it. :thumbsup:

Parking on the first floor is bad in two respects. One is logistical, the floor is wood framed and to strengthen it structurally to allow for parking would only drive the costs of construction even higher.

The second reason it is bad is that you loose the transparency and ground level storefront retail. I am of the opinion that you would need both of those retail spaces just to make the proforma work. At a going rate of $12 a square foot for leasing, it would be a tough pill to swallow loosing that chunk of your pro forma.

I don't know what the answer is for that building, if I did I would probably own it or be working on it for a client right now. The exorbanant asking price, no parking, asbestos up the wazoo, and high cost of rehabilition are all working against it.

Nitro

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It's too bad it couldn't have been incorporated into the Civic Theatre project, or maybe the Children's Museum could bust through their wall over Reynold's & Sons, and bust through the other wall, and make it a new "Science Center".

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Nitro,

Do you have rough estimates on the dollars it would cost to turn these into market rate apartments/ground floor retail? As far as parking, why couldn't someone strike a deal with Second Story and their parking ramp that they will be building across the street? Just a thought.

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Nitro,

Do you have rough estimates on the dollars it would cost to turn these into market rate apartments/ground floor retail? As far as parking, why couldn't someone strike a deal with Second Story and their parking ramp that they will be building across the street? Just a thought.

I had a discussion with one local developer about this and they estimated about $70/sq ft.

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I had a discussion with one local developer about this and they estimated about $70/sq ft.

The Keeler building is prime! I know of a dveloper that went through it. It would make a great project, approx. 200k sqft. It would be Just the thing for the MSU med school or a Market rate project. Only one problem. The absentee landlord wants $10million to get off it. Unfortunatly it will sit vacant for another decade. :sick::sick::sick:

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I had a discussion with one local developer about this and they estimated about $70/sq ft.

My guess is higher. There's close to a hundred thousand just in asbestos abatement. The basement is full of asbestos laden pipes and each of the 4 above grade floors is tiled in 9x9 asbestos floor tiles.

If you were able to take advantage of some brownfield tax credit money it would help.

Construction numbers are all over the board, depends on the level of finishes in the spaces. I love it when someone asks me what does it cost to build a house, commercial bldg, etc. My immediate response is, How much does a bag of groceries cost? Are you putting ramen noodles in the bag or beluga caviar?

You would be white boxing that space for $70-80 sq. ft. Tenant finishes would go up from there.

Nitro

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Construction numbers are all over the board, depends on the level of finishes in the spaces. I love it when someone asks me what does it cost to build a house, commercial bldg, etc. My immediate response is, How much does a bag of groceries cost? Are you putting ramen noodles in the bag or beluga caviar?

That's funny :D When people ask me "what is the cost/sq ft to build a house", I answer "How much does a car cost per pound?" It all depends on the kind of car you want. I'll have to use the grocery one too ;)

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I love it when someone asks me what does it cost to build a house, commercial bldg, etc. My immediate response is, How much does a bag of groceries cost?

:lol:

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Back to my earlier comment about a meteor hitting Azzar in the head... :wacko:

The Keeler building is prime! I know of a dveloper that went through it. It would make a great project, approx. 200k sqft. It would be Just the thing for the MSU med school or a Market rate project. Only one problem. The absentee landlord wants $10million to get off it. Unfortunatly it will sit vacant for another decade. :sick::sick::sick:

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Back to my earlier comment about a meteor hitting Azzar in the head... :wacko:

This is a case where that emminent domain ruling would have been nice.

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Dusting this thread off from conversations dealing with parking at Division and Library.

April 2005 had Azzar (owner) talking about a hotel.

Parking--could work in the adjacunt lot and service both that building, Kendall and Civic theater.

A two-story supermarket and lofts or studio space would be great here.

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