hey all you yankees, listen up!

[Snowguy716]

Ah, how I love your justifications for slavery and your spin on the Civil War to make it sound like the north were the bad guys and the southerners were simply innocent, hard working people that wanted ecnomic stability.

Sorry, ain't buyin' it.

If I were to buy your version of the Civil War based on what you just said, I'd have hte impression that the south was a bunch of peaceful, hardworking slaveholders making a killing (In more way than one) in life while the north were a bunch of restless racists that wanted nothing more than to stir up violence and attack the south.

It's the biggest croc of sh*t I've ever heard in my life. I'm sorry, but I have absolutely no respect for that opinion. (It's an opinion because there is not grounds to back it up.)

It actually does nothing but irks me and I will say no more... but I think from my message you can now kind of get an idea of what northerners think of southerners in general... which is sad, because there are many southerners that are wonderful people.. but there are others that have ill-grounded opinions about touchy subjects, and unfortunately, it is upon those ideas that northerners form their opinions about the south.

[MrSmith]

People, societies, races, regions and natiations that never examine the truth and their own behavior will never learn from their triumphs or mistakes.

It is undeniable that the South has a lower level of education accross all economic levels and races. It is undeniable that the civil rights record in the South towards blacks has been worse then the North (which may explain why the South has so many uneduated blacks --as a previous poster used as an excuse). It is undeniable that it has more poverty. It is undeniable that the North fought the South to prevent it from illegally leaving the union. (In case the South forgot we were a democracy and the country did not vote to let the South leave the Union).

You can continue to deny that this is true and call US News and Worlds Reports a tabloid, but that doesn't make true...and , of course, sticking your head in the sand never improves anything.

[RiversideGator]

If I were to buy your version of the Civil War based on what you just said, I'd have hte impression that the south was a bunch of peaceful, hardworking slaveholders making a killing (In more way than one) in life while the north were a bunch of restless racists that wanted nothing more than to stir up violence and attack the south.

Snowguy: Who invaded whom?

Ah, how I love your justifications for slavery and your spin on the Civil War to make it sound like the north were the bad guys and the southerners were simply innocent, hard working people that wanted ecnomic stability.

I did not provide a justification for slavery. I simply explained why it existed. Stop being emotional and read what I wrote. The point I made was that slavery has been universally practiced, not that it was morally right. If I could press a button and change history so that it had never occurred, I would. But, this is obviously not possible. Instead of demonizing people, perhaps you should try to understand what really happened.

It's the biggest croc of sh*t I've ever heard in my life. I'm sorry, but I have absolutely no respect for that opinion. (It's an opinion because there is not grounds to back it up.)

This is not an argument. I cited specific facts and you simply curse at me and state that you do not respect what I have said. This is no way to win an argument.

It is undeniable that the South has a lower level of education accross all economic levels and races.

MrSmith: Can you please cite evidence for this conclusory statement. While it may be true, you have shown no evidence which proves your argument.

Harvard, Yale, Princeton, Carnegie Mellon, Brown, Penn, Columbia, Chicago U., Notre Dame, Michigan, Villa Nova, Temple, we can list and list all day check the US News rankings this year, last year, 10 years ago etc. there is no way with those stats you can infer anything BUT the north being primary in academics.

PghUSA: How much of this is based on reputation and Northern bias and how much is based on reality? College rankings are extremely subjective.

many southerners that are wonderful people.. but there are others that have ill-grounded opinions about touchy subjects, and unfortunately, it is upon those ideas that northerners form their opinions about the south.

Then why did you want to keep us in the Union??

[RiversideGator]

It is undeniable that the North fought the South to prevent it from illegally leaving the union. (In case the South forgot we were a democracy and the country did not vote to let the South leave the Union).

MrSmith: Where does it say in the US Constitution that secession is illegal? In fact, the first group of states to explore secession was New England in 1812. And, what was the American Revolution but a successful secession from the British Empire? Finally, all Southern states who seceded did so by a vote of the legislature or by a secession convention, whose members were elected by the people. This is the way our system works. Texas, however, did have a referendum on secession, which passed by a 75.8% to 24.2% margin. Under your theory of democracy, should Texas alone have been allowed to secede?

I must warn y'all that I have a BA in history with a specialization in Southern and military history, from the University of Florida (another inferior Southern university??).

[csedwards72]

Harvard, Yale, Princeton, Carnegie Mellon, Brown, Penn, Columbia, Chicago U., Notre Dame, Michigan, Villa Nova, Temple, we can list and list all day check the US News rankings this year, last year, 10 years ago etc.  there is no way with those stats you can infer anything BUT the north being primary in academics.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Villanova? Temple?

They are supposed to be top schools?

I wouldn't use them as examples of good schools.

Princeton, Penn, Columbia, etc. are far better. Check the US News rankings.

[rusthebuss]

Ah, how I love your justifications for slavery and your spin on the Civil War to make it sound like the north were hte bad guys and the southerners were simply innocent, hard working people that wanted ecnomic stability.

Sorry, ain't buyin' it.  But oh well, you can have those opinions if you want to, as long as you live in the south.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

He didn't try to justify it and the so called spin is correct. I don't care about this stupid north v. south crap so i don't have any bias. He didn't try to state that the south was innocent either.

[RiversideGator]

Just to reiterate, I think slavery is wrong. I do not ever wish to see it happen again. I was just explaining the history behind slavery. Slavery was certainly an issue and a cause of the War, but not the only one. The people in the South in 1860 were stuck with a situation not of their own making and, as Jefferson stated, the situation was like holding a tiger by the ears: you didnt like it, but you dare not let go for fear that what might happen would be worse than holding the tiger's ears. It is important too when viewing historical conflicts to understand that usually there were bad things done on both sides. Never do you have a situation where one side in a war is completely virtuous and the other side is completely evil.

[monsoon]

Agreed. I am always amazed at people who will enter a debate on the Civil War yet have never bothered to open a history book to find out what really happened. They automatically assume the war was about the honorable North wanting to free the poor slaves from the ruthless racists in the South. Ignorance such as that is probably where all the misconceptions about the South spring from in the first place including the ones that have been presented here.

I am closing this thread because some of the insults that have been thrown here about heads being stuck in sand, crock of crap, etc. are going to get otherwise decent forumers suspended or banned. It is a shame that we can't have a dialog such as this as reasonable adults because some people are unable to get their point across without being asses about it.