Norfolk Light Rail and Transit

[jeffconn]

Two recent articles from the Pilot:

http://hamptonroads.com/2012/10/norfolk-wants-new-bus-station-where

Why is this still not decided? Harbor Park is the perfect place for a multimodal transit station. Remember the plans for the Harbor Park transit station that surfaced a few years ago?

And somewhat related:

http://hamptonroads.com/2012/10/interest-builds-ferry-between-norfolk-peninsula

A high speed ferry would be a breeze to dock at Harbor Park, with a connection to the Tide, Amtrak, and (maybe one day) the Portsmouth ferry, HRT buses, the private water taxi, and Greyhound all within walking distance.

Okay, i'm off my soapbox now. Discuss.

[zeppelin14]

The bus transfer at Harbor Park would be out of the way. They need to tear down part of the SPQ and build a permanent one there.

Ferry service could work. I think it should start from downtown Hampton to Norfolk. Plenty of garage parking and no businesses in that office building in Hampton. They should build a ferry terminal (like a pier) at Towne Point Park. Very convienent place to build it.

A great example is the ferry service in the Bay area of California from Vallejo to SF.

[varider]

I check the ridership numbers posted on HRTs site fairly regularly. Im not sure how accurate they are but they seem to be rising. Nearly 7k rode Wednesday. Expand to ODU/Naval Station/ Oceanfront and this number would likely rise upwards of 25-30k/day

[zeppelin14]

^ Thank you Captain Obvious!

Just kidding!!!..... I just wish Norfolk would stop waiting to see what VB does and start expanding within the city now.

[Ghentite]

Two recent articles from the Pilot:

http://hamptonroads....s-station-where

Why is this still not decided? Harbor Park is the perfect place for a multimodal transit station. Remember the plans for the Harbor Park transit station that surfaced a few years ago?

I agree. And how the heck can they justify it costing an extra $15 Mil for road upgrades?! Ridiculous. Keep this at harbor Park as part of the multi-modal transporation station, which will help develop that area as the transportation hub of the region. Then develop St. Paul's as planned and once it's built up with a new road network have a few bus stops in there and connect it to harbor Park (it's not that far!).

http://norfolklive.blogspot.com/2012/10/where-to-put-bus-transfer-station.html

Edited October 12, 2012 by Ghentite

[urbanlife]

actually 15 million for road upgrades isn't really that much. I like the idea of turning Harbor Park into a transit hub, it is a great point to connect the city together and a great spot for new rail lines to originiate.

[jeffconn]

Lots of transit news lately. Now some entrepreneurs want to start a bike sharing program in the Portsmouth and Norfolk downtowns.

http://hamptonroads.com/2012/10/new-way-around-norfolk-could-be-bikesharing

[Glassoul]

Lots of transit news lately. Now some entrepreneurs want to start a bike sharing program in the Portsmouth and Norfolk downtowns.

http://hamptonroads....-be-bikesharing

While the idea works in Europe, the company that launched the "movement" in North America (and where they've been exporting the ide, technology,and bikes), is struggling to stay afloat.

http://www.cbc.ca/ne...ke-deficit.html

Edited October 22, 2012 by Glassoul

[mistermetaj]

They do bike sharing all over Washington DC. As far as I can tell it's extremely popular. That being said, Norfolk is not big enough for this IMO. This is meant for areas chocked with congenstion all day, not just during rush hour. New York has dedicated bike lanes up and down avenues (not streets thought).

We don't have the population density to support this. It won't be used and the nay sayers will tout it as another failed attempt to make Norfolk a "big city" when in reality it's just not a program Norfolk can support RIGHT NOW. In the future it will be a great idea.

[urbanvb]

Norfolk council is voting tonight whether to study to extend LR to the naval base and to endorse the Beach to extend the line.

http://hamptonroads.com/2012/10/norfolk-council-plans-push-tide-extension-beach

Edited October 23, 2012 by urbanvb

[urbanlife]

That is good news, I am really hoping VB jumps on board with this cause it would be awesome to have construction going on at both ends of the lines.

[varider]

http://www.wavy.com/dpp/news/local_news/norfolk/light-rail-study-bus-station-approved

The light rail resolution means Hampton Roads Transit has been approved to initiate studies of light rail extension stations, including destinations in Virginia Beach and Naval Station Norfolk.

The Downtown Plaza site has been approved as a bus transfer site for HRT. The Cedar Grove lot has been used as the temporary bus transfer site since 2008. With the Downtown Plaza approval, the City of Norfolk will begin designing and developing the facility. The budget for design, construction and interim facilities are projected to be between $4 and $5.5 million.

[jeffconn]

Bad, short-sighted choice. They should have put the transfer station in Harbor Park, so it would have been EASIER to integrate all the various modes of transportation: HRT buses, Elizabeth River ferry, Greyhound, Amtrak, the Tide, the water taxi, bike taxis, taxicabs, park-and-ride. And the possible FUTURE transportation options, like a Chesapeake Bay ferry, a commuter train from Edenton and Elizabeth City, and bike rental stations.

[brikkman]

I think I have given up on my home town's city council ability to make sound decisions.

Anyone get the feeling that they rushed themselves into a decision? They waited for ever (and still waiting) on the Westin spot, but couldn't wait a couple of years to get 15m more to build it at the harbor park? Harbor park could be the hub and the start of something great in that area we call hamptonroads and the city councils rushing a decision off 15 million because they fail to impower the police to do their job at cedar groove. You can't say multi-modal then put the buses someone else. This is absoutely ridiculous. In recent memory, I can't think of the city council's decision that seemed so forced for no reason at all. "Well if we build it at downtown plaza, it will cost 4m vs 20 million at harbor park" What a freaking joke....

[BFG]

Yeah, I'm scratching my head over this one. You have a light rail station, and future ferry and train hub coming to the Harbor Park area, yet you go to Downtown Plaza, which is a pain to navigate during rush hour, or better yet, when there's something at Scope. Makes no sense to me.

[Ghentite]

Traffic is going to ridiculous on St. Paul's, which means a lot of people will take Waterside to get to and from the interstate instead creating a logjam there. Horrible decision. I still don't see how it could possibly cost $16 Mil more to build on an open lot at Harbor park...

[BFG]

Not to mention if there's something with the tunnel or Berkley Bridge lifting. Very, very, very dumb move for so many reasons.

[varider]

6,459 rode LRT on monday. 60,000+ rode busses. 

[BFG]

In honor of the new Amtrak rail service in Norfolk, I present this gem:

 

 

 

Norfolk Terminal Station located at 1200 E. Main St. was completed in 1912, replacing the old wooden one, due to a fire. So elegant, including exterior & upper floor offices, but was demolished in the early 60's. What a crime (sigh)

 

 

Every time I see something from Norfolk's past that was torn down, it frustrates the living hell out of me. According to Wiki, it was due to a decline in passenger rail travel. Still, I've wondered how Norfolk would've handled something like a Union Station or Grand Central...never knew we had something similar to it.

[Ghentite]

Yeah, it's a shame a work of art like that was torn down, especially when consider passenger rail returned came back.  What a waste...

[urbanlife]

In honor of the new Amtrak rail service in Norfolk, I present this gem:

 

 

 

Norfolk Terminal Station located at 1200 E. Main St. was completed in 1912, replacing the old wooden one, due to a fire. So elegant, including exterior & upper floor offices, but was demolished in the early 60's. What a crime (sigh)

 

 

Every time I see something from Norfolk's past that was torn down, it frustrates the living hell out of me. According to Wiki, it was due to a decline in passenger rail travel. Still, I've wondered how Norfolk would've handled something like a Union Station or Grand Central...never knew we had something similar to it.

It is always such a shame when a city tears down their rail terminals.  It is something I wish had never happened in this country because we have lost so many useful treasures because of it.

[Ghentite]

http://ow.ly/i/1sEiA

 

Just thought I'd pass this along.  Found a rendering of the proposed bus transit center at St. Paul's.  It's funny because they've been holding a series of public meetings for this to explain what their doing and apparently everyone has been asking why this isn't a part of the proposed multi-modal transportation station at Harbor Park. 

 

The only thing about it that makes sense to me is that it'll be right in the middle of everything once St. Paul's is developed, but obviously, they'd need to have the train station on their route.  But I don't see St. Paul's fully developed for a long long time and right now, all it's going to do is clog things up. 

[lil-bear]

Im not impressed! It should have been placed behind harbor park!

[mistermetaj]

http://ow.ly/i/1sEiA

 

Just thought I'd pass this along.  Found a rendering of the proposed bus transit center at St. Paul's.  It's funny because they've been holding a series of public meetings for this to explain what their doing and apparently everyone has been asking why this isn't a part of the proposed multi-modal transportation station at Harbor Park. 

 

The only thing about it that makes sense to me is that it'll be right in the middle of everything once St. Paul's is developed, but obviously, they'd need to have the train station on their route.  But I don't see St. Paul's fully developed for a long long time and right now, all it's going to do is clog things up. 

 

I just don't like the fact they are already placing a superblock in St. Paul's quadrant after a big to do was made about reestablishing the street grid.  This belongs at a large multimodal center near harbor park, not off st. pauls.  Hopefully it will at least look nice.

 

Also, with these kind of stations comes a very large group of undesirable homeless people who can make the whole experience awful.  I hope Norfolk intends on having a police presence there 24/7.  Remember, this will still be very close to the largest projects in Norfolk.

 

I had to take a red eye train from Philadelphia's 34th St station to Union station a few months back.  For those of you who haven't been to the station, it is a gorgeous station.  However, while my friend and I were eating our breakfast, a man comes up to us, asks for money saying he just got out of prision and needs money to catch a bus.  It DESTROYED our experience.

Edited February 8, 2013 by mistermetaj

[urbanlife]

I just don't like the fact they are already placing a superblock in St. Paul's quadrant after a big to do was made about reestablishing the street grid.  This belongs at a large multimodal center near harbor park, not off st. pauls.  Hopefully it will at least look nice.

 

Also, with these kind of stations comes a very large group of undesirable homeless people who can make the whole experience awful.  I hope Norfolk intends on having a police presence there 24/7.  Remember, this will still be very close to the largest projects in Norfolk.

 

I had to take a red eye train from Philadelphia's 34th St station to Union station a few months back.  For those of you who haven't been to the station, it is a gorgeous station.  However, while my friend and I were eating our breakfast, a man comes up to us, asks for money saying he just got out of prision and needs money to catch a bus.  It DESTROYED our experience.

I loved the Philly station, spent some time down there in January when I went to Philly for the day.  Though I will say the coffee tastes like ass in that station so avoid it at all costs.

 

Sorry about the homeless experience, I have lived in a few cities where homelessness in urban areas are just apart of life, at one point or another someone is gonna ask you for change and give you a story.  As a matter of fact, I had a guy give my subway car a story about why he is panhandling.  You get use to it after a while and learn how to tune it out.