Norfolk Light Rail and Transit

[brikkman]

Light rail finally dipped below expected ridership numbers this past sunday: 2847

but jump right back up on monday to: 4797

Sunday was 9/11 so its fhard to guage if that will be constant sunday numbers or was it just a dismal day in america.

NSU and student commuters/TCC commuters still seem to be a huge part of ridership. Frogger is in full affect and the fact that TCC sign that new agreement with NSU, NSU should feel bad fighting the city about that stop. They did not consider their students for the relocation of a very dangerous LRT stop 30/40 yards away from campus.

[urbanlife]

Yeah, with the NSU issue, you will probably see an expensive skybridge in the future to make up for the mistake the college did for fighting against it.

[Mos]

Yeah, with the NSU issue, you will probably see an expensive skybridge in the future to make up for the mistake the college did for fighting against it.

I would hope that they planned for this contingency and could simply add stairs on the north (east) side of Brambleton. Yeah , I know; hope is for suckers.

[Jim Nasty]

I never said that light-rail would be profitable. Another poster suggest raising the fares. I did the analysis based on the fact that raising fares accomplishes nothing.

[varider]

5123 rode on wednesday

[usermel]

Good news regarding over 5,000 on light rail wednesday. As for the debate regarding light rail making money, I agree with Jim Nasty. When cities bring in subway's or light rail profits aren't the main goal. Aside from that, look at the positives light rail will bring, funny how humans manage to find a lump of used coal in a numerous amount of diamonds,hahahaha! No offense is meant to anyone saying anything about profits regarding light rail, don't get me wrong. My comment is to say this. Light rail is a good thing locally and regionally, period. Iv'e been here for ALL MY LIFE and never imagined a subway or light rail EVER. What light rail does is show progress and thats what we all should hope for and a need for it in the future. I think Norfolk feels in the future this type of transporting people around will be a need and they did so beforehand.

Light rail was meant to provide locals with an option that doesn't require driving to some locations and if the 1st section works, look for expansion locals and be happy. See the growth this metro is trying to slowly but surely accomplish and be happy we didn't lose light rail due to cost. Then what would be the discussion, hahaha! LGNM

[urbanlife]

Good news regarding over 5,000 on light rail wednesday. As for the debate regarding light rail making money, I agree with Jim Nasty. When cities bring in subway's or light rail profits aren't the main goal. Aside from that, look at the positives light rail will bring, funny how humans manage to find a lump of used coal in a numerous amount of diamonds,hahahaha! No offense is meant to anyone saying anything about profits regarding light rail, don't get me wrong. My comment is to say this. Light rail is a good thing locally and regionally, period. Iv'e been here for ALL MY LIFE and never imagined a subway or light rail EVER. What light rail does is show progress and thats what we all should hope for and a need for it in the future. I think Norfolk feels in the future this type of transporting people around will be a need and they did so beforehand. Light rail was meant to provide locals with an option that doesn't require driving to some locations and if the 1st section works, look for expansion locals and be happy. See the growth this metro is trying to slowly but surely accomplish and be happy we didn't lose light rail due to cost. Then what would be the discussion, hahaha! LGNM

Funny thing about that is that often times LRT and streetcars are looked at when it comes to profits, but it is in a nondirect way. If over the course of the next ten years, this line helps stem new development or makes areas in Norfolk more attractive which causes rents to go up and land values to rise, then it would be easy to argue that LRT is actually helping the city increase revenue flows, but things like that take time and are often overlooked when someone is simply wanting to point to a simple number to show that rail is failing.

It will be very interesting to see what this line will be able to do for Norfolk.

[usermel]

I agree Urbanlife. You explained what the benefits typically are. Subways make cities useful and several ways such as New York and Philly and Boston. Being able to leave a car sitting or not even owning a car is attractive to businesses that are considering a move to a metro or city and just go for business in general. I can only imagine where Norfolk and the area would be if we had regional light rail or subways. Id ride it all the time to save gas and just not to have to drive all day as we have for decades in Norfolks metro. Light rail helps down the line and indirectly as you said Urbanlife, I totally agree with you sir! LGNM

Light rail to me won't fail, I just had an issue of people getting used to it being downtown and not crashing into the rail cars. Thats my only concern. Plenty will use light rail especially due to the economy. In a way, the bad economy is why it will be used. Imagine gas being so high, we need light rail!!! I hope it works, and I'm confident it will. LGNM

[brikkman]

So far, it’s been pretty successful in my eyes. Yesterday, ridership dipped down to 2700+, but it rained literally all day and hard. My family even stayed in the house and didn't see outside until 830pm. I was actually thinking the ridership would dip to the 1000+, so that is still a good sign. It is apparent, that people, at least on the south want and adore urban cores. LRT proves that. Again, what they should do as a city is totally embrace urbanization.

The synder lot becomes a big deal now as well and definitely fort Norfolk. That is my wish for Norfolk now since st. pauls quad fiasco.

My top four plots for meaningful development in Norfolk:

1. Harbor Park
   
2. Fort Norfolk
   
3. Macey’s/McArthur Center plot
   
4. Synder Lot.
   

Those are some must does TOD projects that must be grand in IMO.

I hope they pan out.

[brikkman]

Couple of updates that I wanted to run by everyone:

1. Tide's wi-fi has been installed. No advertising to suggest it, but its there and operating very quickly I may add (Tidenet)

2. Dicussions have already been started about extending to ODU and NOB - http://www.wavy.com/dpp/news/local_news/norfolk/city-leaders-want-to-expand-light-rail

3. Ridership is at a constant 4000+ daily

4. Police are regulars on the tide (which is a good thing)

5. No new accidents..... YAH!!!

Edited September 22, 2011 by brikkman

[jeffconn]

Another story on the planned extension(s).

http://hamptonroads.com/2011/09/norfolk-start-planning-light-rail-extension-navy-base

I have to wonder about the proposed Granby Street route. That would put the Tide at the back of the Naval Station near the (base) airport, far away from everything on base. Also, no discussion about a route to the airport (Norfolk International).

[EDITED to clarify my comments.]

Edited September 23, 2011 by jeffconn

[urbanlife]

Mayor Paul Fraim and Councilman Barclay C. Winn said the city can't wait on Virginia Beach to determine if and when it might want light rail.

“Whatever Virginia Beach decides to do, they will do it in their own good time, Fraim said. “We can’t do anything to influence their decision. So we ought to move forward with our own planning.”

“We need to get moving,” Winn added.

Might be the best comment I have ever read from the Mayor of Norfolk. It is about time the city stop worrying about what VaBeach wants to do and start worrying about what Norfolk needs to do. In the past, this has always been Norfolk's biggest downfall, it seemed like they needed to get VB's approval with anything the city did.

Hope to see Norfolk begin planning several lines within their city and begin urban planning all of their districts and neighborhoods to give the city a true urban center feeling.

Edited September 23, 2011 by vdogg
Removed paragraph symbols

[varider]

Do the ODU/NOB route along the w side of the city and you increase ridership to about 20k+ trips a day.

[mistermetaj]

Do the ODU/NOB route along the w side of the city and you increase ridership to about 20k+ trips a day.

Hopefully this can be fast tracked. In down times, infrastructure investment by a city can really REALLY pay dividends in preparation for an economic upswings.

[BFG]

Might be the best comment I have ever read from the Mayor of Norfolk. It is about time the city stop worrying about what VaBeach wants to do and start worrying about what Norfolk needs to do. In the past, this has always been Norfolk's biggest downfall, it seemed like they needed to get VB's approval with anything the city did. Hope to see Norfolk begin planning several lines within their city and begin urban planning all of their districts and neighborhoods to give the city a true urban center feeling.

I agree. I like that Norfolk is taking initiative and realizing there's more areas in their own city that could use this. If VB wants to get onboard, then great. However, going from DT to ODU/NOB, and possibly the airport are great ideas, and sorely needed.

I think VB will realize the potential here, but it could take a little longer.

[willy]

Rail project to be built next to Harbor Park. If everything goes as planned it should be ready by next year.

http://www.wtkr.com/...0,1271138.story

Edited September 30, 2011 by willy

[brikkman]

Rail project to be built next to Harbor Park. If everything goes as planned it should be ready by next year. http://www.wtkr.com/...0,1271138.story

This is awesome. I was over there yesterday looking for an area to do some photos and noticed the construction. I know someone mentioned that having a hub was possible, but didn't know it was finalized. It seem as though it wasn't, but construction has been going on for more than a month over t here I believe. With that being said, does that mean the ajacent land is slated for redevelopment as well? That's actually one of the area I wisht he city would market for redevelopment.

[usermel]

This is a GREAT sign for the city of Norfolk and the ENTIRE METRO!!! Now if the rest of the cities can finally see, Norfolk is the center of the area and should be supported more by the other cities. This will benefit the other cities so much I can't put it in words. Could we ever imagine a train from Norfolk to D.C (goes thru Richmond as well) ? This says something about how the state sees the area as well, they approved $100,000,000 for this so, I guess they see potential growth in Norfolk as well. GREAT sign Norfolk and the ENTIRE METRO!!! LGNM

[zeppelin14]

The Norfolk to D.C. train is great. I drove by the site today and construction was underway.

Back to the topic of light rail....

I had to go to VB City Center yesterday to get a few things. As soon as I got to the Newton Road section of I-264, you can clearly see VBCC not that far away. I'm not sure why VB has to study the light rail for so long. The hard work is long done. From the Newtown Station is a straight shot along an existing line. From Newtown, one stop can be at Witchduck and the next at VBCC. I don't think this starter VB line would cost the city much money. If it was available, I would have taken it yesterday since I live a block from the York Station. For $3.00 round trip, it's worth saving gas and wear and tear on my truck instead of dodging potholes on 264.

[BFG]

Good to see Norfolk having forward vision. And I'm glad they're finally being more independent, and not worrying about what VB does. This has a lot of potential!

[brikkman]

The Norfolk to D.C. train is great. I drove by the site today and construction was underway. Back to the topic of light rail.... I had to go to VB City Center yesterday to get a few things. As soon as I got to the Newton Road section of I-264, you can clearly see VBCC not that far away. I'm not sure why VB has to study the light rail for so long. The hard work is long done. From the Newtown Station is a straight shot along an existing line. From Newtown, one stop can be at Witchduck and the next at VBCC. I don't think this starter VB line would cost the city much money. If it was available, I would have taken it yesterday since I live a block from the York Station. For $3.00 round trip, it's worth saving gas and wear and tear on my truck instead of dodging potholes on 264.

I think most of the residents are caught up with running down to the ocean front. Although I love the idea, I just do not think it is necessary to do that right now. I think that is were the fear of cost comes in. Not saying running it to TC would be cheap, but definitely not anywhere clost to running to the ocean front. I actually think it is more important to run it through janaf to the airport and odu to the naval base. I just makes the area that more attractive IMO. I would even through in wards corner if they look to make that an uptown.

But harbor park should be a reconsideration for redevelopment, especially with the news about the amtrack. That is big IMO.

[vdogg]

Trains and mall were packed tonight. Don't know if there's a special event going on but there have been a lot of people out all day. It'll be interesting to see what Saturdays ridership numbers are.

[jeffconn]

The Admirals were at Scope tonight. On Friday, there were 4,500 or so seeing the Admirals play, so it will be interesting to see the ridership numbers.

[vdogg]

6,163 for Friday, about 1000 more than normal. Saturday will probably come in about the same.

[varider]

6413 on Saturday