Orchard Park Development

[localtalent]

With names like that, getting Cabela's is probably just a formality at this point.

I'm pretty sure that's not the case.

Getting Cabelas is about playing their game. They're a major draw and they know it.

They attempt to dictate terms to every party at the negotiating table.

If these developers aren't willing to play ball (which I have come to believe they aren't), then Cabela's will walk.

Trademark and Urban Retail Properties will make this happen with or without Cabela's. They know they can be successful even without Cabela's, so they aren't interested in giving away the farm just to have Cabela's.

[allbusiness]

I see the GR Press finally got their copy of the GR Business Journal...

http://www.mlive.com/news/grpress/index.ss...3130.xml&coll=6

[GRDadof3]

Are you picking on the Press allbusiness?

One interesting thing they mentioned is that two major department stores looking at this development are Dillards (330 stores mainly in the South) and Von Maur

[MJLO]

wow Dillards would be huge, that would definately be a first for the GR area

[Rizzo]

wow Dillards would be huge, that would definately be a first for the GR area

What is Dillards..? Wait, according to their site they are a glorified "I am woman" center.. Not another place for my girl to blow cash money to get an over the top "hot" print .

[MJLO]

Dillards is like Macy's, maybe stuck between Macy's and Nordstrom

[GR8scott]

Dillards is a department store found in malls as an anchor so it would be like building a freestanding JC Penney not what I would like to see there. I hope the Cabellas goes through allthough they dont usually build in or near cities and I heard that they pick locations of small-mid-sized towns that have had hard economic times with easy highway acess, so Walker doesnt really fit that

[MJLO]

those were kind of my thoughts GR8scott, Look at cabellas in Dundee, when they came there, the commerce exploded. if you look at the types of developement around it, the hotels the restaurants, I wonder if there would be enough room for all of that, because the area at 4mile and Walker is kind of built up. Mainly with residential tho.

[Phizzy]

I hope the Cabellas goes through allthough they dont usually build in or near cities and I heard that they pick locations of small-mid-sized towns that have had hard economic times with easy highway acess, so Walker doesnt really fit that

According to the Press article, Cabela's seems interested:

While he carefully avoided naming potential building sites, Cabela's spokesman David Draper said it is a matter of time until the outdoor giant builds in West Michigan.

"We are definitely looking in the Grand Rapids area," he said, although nothing has been formally announced. "It is a great area for us. There is a great base of customers there."

"We were told by Cabela's representatives that they are seriously looking at our site," said Zach Bossenbroek, a group representative.

Bossenbroek said Cabela's contacted Walker Orchard Land Partners several months ago to show interest in the site.

[GRDadof3]

Cabela's built a store last year in Chicago's Hoffman Estates. Definitely suburban.

[MJLO]

well there you have it, they built it in sears territory. I guess it could work pretty good then, Walker is much less developed than hoffman estates

[Josh]

Cabela's built a store last year in Chicago's Hoffman Estates. Definitely suburban.

If they do eventually build here in Walker, please do not put an ocean of parking out to the road. They could at least put parking in back and put a park/sculpture theme in the front. All the property around there will skyrocket if definite plans are announced.

[zenstyle]

I guess it helps to actually read the posts.

From the title of this thread, I had assumed that "Cablelas" was some pseudo-ethnic chain restaurant.

While doing a Froogle search for base layer clothing, Cabelas came up repeatedly. Nice stuff! But I would never drive to Walker to buy long undies; I would buy them from their website. Yes, this runs contrary to the "shop locally" axiom, but to me it's important NOT to place yet another car unnecessarily on the already clogged Alpine Ave. I'll let the UPS man bring it. He's on the road anyway.

...on second thought, maybe I'll vespa over to Reynolds to see if they have my longies....

[allbusiness]

<snip> While doing a Froogle search for base layer clothing, Cabelas came up repeatedly. Nice stuff! But I would never drive to Walker to buy long undies; I would buy them from their website.

Word is, that the Cabela's in SE Michigan draws something like 5 million visitors annually -- many of whom book hotels, stay overnight, visit local restaurants, visit other local attractions, etc. I know, I don't "get it" either! I find it difficult to understand the impact this single retailer might have on the city of Walker, but from what I've heard, they're a force to be reckoned with.

Although I've never been inside one (not a hunter), I hear their stores are more like an indoor hunting/fishing theme park than just a retail outlet. Plus they tend to draw "outlot" development such as hotels, chain restaurants, etc. Hopefully Walker city officials will have the fortitude to control it, making it an asset to the region and not just another mall.

[Prankster]

Hopefully Walker city officials will have the fortitude to control it, making it an asset to the region and not just another mall.

Wouldn't count on it.

[MJLO]

If they planned it right, it could be great. I can't think of to many things in Walker with this kind of scale. I don't think we should count Alpine. I don't think it's that terrible. besides they have run out of room to build on alpine, they are putting up businesses in parking lots.

[localtalent]

The Press has it right here. Great article on the Walker development:

http://www.mlive.com/news/grpress/index.ss...3090.xml&coll=6

"The development will be worth nearly $234 million"

Check out The Woodlands website for an idea of the plans for this development:

http://www.marketstreet-thewoodlands.com/

[MAU]

Although I've never been inside one (not a hunter), I hear their stores are more like an indoor hunting/fishing theme park than just a retail outlet.

I think stuffed animal carnage is probably a better description.

[Phizzy]

Check out The Woodlands website for an idea of the plans for this development:

http://www.marketstreet-thewoodlands.com/

There's plans to do something similar in Allendale (probably on a much smaller scale).

Video clip 1. Video clip 2.

[localtalent]

I just want to point out the contrast of this development, its price tag, and its size in comparison to the downtown project.

The Walker project is 238 acres, about 1.5 million square feet and has a price tag pegged at $234 million.

The downtown project is 30 or so acres and has a price tag of anywhere from $800 million to $2 billion.

The contrast here should yield one of two conclusions.

1) The downtown project is being grossly over-stated.

OR

2) People here aren't thinking big enough about it.

Which do you think is likely?

Also- I'd suggest a change in the title of this topic to better reflect a discussion of this Walker project as a whole, rather than just the Cabelas part of it, even though that may be the dominant topic of conversation for the foreseeable future.

[snoogit]

Dillards is like Macy's, maybe stuck between Macy's and Nordstrom

Isn't Dillards a southern state retailer on the same level as Macy's? I ask because the only place I have seen a dillards is in the south.

[allbusiness]

I just want to point out the contrast of this development, its price tag, and its size in comparison to the downtown project.

The Walker project is 238 acres, about 1.5 million square feet and has a price tag pegged at $234 million.

The downtown project is 30 or so acres and has a price tag of anywhere from $800 million to $2 billion.

The contrast here should yield one of two conclusions.

1) The downtown project is being grossly over-stated.

OR

2) People here aren't thinking big enough about it.

Which do you think is likely?

Well, another large potential differential is height. I assume most of the structures in Walker won't be more than 40-50 feet in height.

[snoogit]

Well, another large potential differential is height. I assume most of the structures in Walker won't be more than 40-50 feet in height.

if your lucky. although the larger anchor stores probably will be.

[localtalent]

Well, another large potential differential is height. I assume most of the structures in Walker won't be more than 40-50 feet in height.

Yes, but the Walker site is 8 times larger. And the cost is anywhere from 1/4 to 1/8 the projected number for the downtown site.

[localtalent]

I wouldn't call this a precedent nor would I consider this having ANYTHING to do with cabela's... first, cabelas is going into WALKER, not Grand Rapids, thus any brownfield would be done by the walker BRA not GR... meaning, any sbt credits filed would be from Walker, not Grand Rapids.

Am I insinuating that GR is the reason they didn't get the SBT credits? Kinda of, not because they are who they are but because they're requesting a ton of SBT with all the activity going on. Plus, I have a feeling Cabela's would be going for the +1 million SBT credit for 2007, not the 999,999 dollar one that Tall House was forced to apply for. Worth mentioning.

All excellent points.

I was pointing it out more to put the SBT credit issue on everyone's radar for the Cabelas deal. I suspect they'll be asking for a whopper.