SUPER-REGIONAL RETAIL IN METRO GR

[metrogrkid]

FLOOD THIS THREAD WITH THE HEARSAY OF PLANS FOR NEW HIGH-END RETAIL IN GR THAT WOULD HAVE NO OTHER BRANCH EXCEPT IN CHICAGO OR DETROIT.

Is a full-scale Nordstrom going into the Knapp's Corner lifestyle center proposals? Where does Lord & Taylor want to go in the wake of its being blocked by the former Hudson's from anchoring Woodland (where the Cinemark Theatre and lifestyle center expansion is currently going)?

Thoughts? . . . .

[snoogit]

FLOOD THIS THREAD WITH THE HEARSAY OF PLANS FOR NEW HIGH-END RETAIL IN GR THAT WOULD HAVE NO OTHER BRANCH EXCEPT IN CHICAGO OR DETROIT.

Is a full-scale Nordstrom going into the Knapp's Corner lifestyle center proposals? Where does Lord & Taylor want to go in the wake of its being blocked by the former Hudson's from anchoring Woodland (where the Cinemark Theatre and lifestyle center expansion is currently going)?

Thoughts? . . . .

I personally hope its not headed out there, that lifestyle center is nothing but a fancied up shopping center. I doubt any good retailer will be locating there. Most of these places dont come into suburban areas before they establish themselves in the downtown area.

[GRDadof3]

Neither the Knapp's Corner proposed development nor the Village of Orchard Hills (3 Mile and Beltline) are going to have an anchor large enough for Nordstroms or Lord & Taylor. The largest buildings in both plans are about 50,000 sq ft, which I believe is too small.

However, the proposed Village of Orchard Hills (Robert Aikens' lifestyle village) will most likely contain one or more of the following (from what I hear):

Parisian Specialty Department Stores

http://www.parisian.com/default.aspx

(owned by Saks)

The Food Emporium

http://www.thefoodemporium.com/index.asp

(owned by Atlantic & Pacific Tea Co.)

Moosejaw

http://www.moosejaw.com/moosejaw/

White House - Black Market

http://www.whiteandblack.com/store/store_locator.asp?n=sb

(owned by Chicos)

Smith & Hawken

http://www.smith-hawken.com/home.jhtml

That and Cabelas in Walker. That's all I got

[mpchicago]

I have seen some high end retailers (Saks) with square footage at 70 to 75 thousand sf, so who knows maybe they could squeeze in a Nordstrom

[fluffy]

I have been a Dayton Hudsons (Now Marshall Fields/Macys) employee for years. Dayton Hudsons had a contract with Mall Management to have a word in with any retail competition that the mall would have come in.

DH vetoed Lord and Taylor only to be bought out by the May Corporation (L&T) last year. Following, Federated (Macys) purchased May.

It's almost like "World Bank." With so many mergers happening, what large retailers are left to be purchased?

[metrogrkid]

I personally hope its not headed out there, that lifestyle center is nothing but a fancied up shopping center. I doubt any good retailer will be locating there. Most of these places dont come into suburban areas before they establish themselves in the downtown area.

GOOD SH___! Downtown needs to be positioned as the preferred location for the upscale/super-regional retail.

. . . . the proposed Village of Orchard Hills (Robert Aikens' lifestyle village) will most likely contain one or more of the following (from what I hear):

Parisian Specialty Department Stores

http://www.parisian.com/default.aspx

(owned by Saks)

I've always thought a Parisian would push the fashion envelope a little bit more toward the big city vibe. Let's hope you're right about EB area being a target for that one.

[zenstyle]

"With the closing of Jacobson

[LA Dave]

I cannot believe that Marshall Field's will soon be a name of the past. That was the ne plus ultra of department stores when I was a kid. That one-day visit to Chicago was not complete without the requisite trip to State Street and the big building there. (Agony was trying to rush Mom and Dad along so that my brother and I could get to the South Side and an hour in the Musuem of Science and Industry before the trip home on the Skyway to GR.)

[GRDadof3]

With the closing of Jacobson

[Prankster]

Younkers is not bad, and is much better than Marshall Field's (Macy's) for men's clothes, IMO.

Very true, very true. They are, IMO, the highest end department store currently in this area. That just means plenty of room in town, or more specifically downtown, to locate a couple of higher end stores. God knows that this market could easily support it.

An interesting factoid - The shoppers at Neiman Marcus on Michigan Ave in Chicago consist of a higher percentage of people with area codes from West Michigan than any other area, including Chicago.

[egrguy]

i dont know the feasibility, but i would love to see a up-scale mall hit dt. as prankster mentioned, i think gr could support an upscale mall as i have and know of many that go to chicago for weekend shopping trips.

another rivertown/woodland... no, i think the gr market has reached saturation for a mid-end mall.

my 2 cents - but an upclass mall located dt would do well and also offer up a very nice carrot to lobby conventions to the area.

[MJLO]

I just can't imagine, a Neimans, or a Saks, Making ends meet in a City of Grand Rapids size. I honestly think we need to get more trendy stores, like Urban Outfitters downtown. While most of the people in GR could probabally afford an $800 sweater, they seem all to thrifty, to be suckered by that. Thanks, I'll stick to my cheap target, and Banana Republic clothes.

[GRDadof3]

Or maybe an Off 5th - Saks 5th Avenue, like Nordstrom Rack:

http://www.saksincorporated.com/ourstores/off5th.asp

Or how about the nation's first Merrills - Patagonia outlet store? Hello, Wolverine??

Burberry:

http://www.burberry.com/us/Home/main.shtml

Kate Spade:

http://www.katespade.com/home/index.jsp

Jimmy Choo:

http://www.jimmychoo.com/index_flash.html

New York & Co.

http://www.nyandcompany.com/

I'm trying Rudy

[metrogrkid]

I just can't imagine, a Neimans, or a Saks, Making ends meet in a City of Grand Rapids size. I honestly think we need to get more trendy stores, like Urban Outfitters downtown. While most of the people in GR could probabally afford an $800 sweater, they seem all to thrifty, to be suckered by that. Thanks, I'll stick to my cheap target, and Banana Republic clothes.

Don't miss the point here.

It is not about the size of GR "City" or even its "thrifty" inhabitants. It is about DOWNTOWN GR being at the hub of a 2.2 million people trade area that includes the entire GR Tri-Metro Area (GR/Muskegon/Holland), Greater Lansing and the Kalamazoo/Battle Creek Urban Complex - ALL WITHIN A ONE HOUR DRIVE FROM DOWNTOWN GR.

Because of downtown GR never thinking of itself this way, it NEVER HAS and WON'T position itself appropriately to be - among its other superlatives - a hub of super-regional and upscale retail. All it takes to move us toward such a future is changing that NEVER HAS and WON'T into WILL and NOW. If you look toward what's coming over the immediate horizon for Metro GR and downtown within it, we truly are becoming a region with a downtown that serves those FAR beyond the confines of the region.

Sounds to me like we're becoming the region and downtown that we say we're not.

-Metrogrkid

[krylonics]

"While most of the people in GR could probabally afford an $800 sweater"

Wow...........not the GR I know. Thats a house payment. I guess I need a new job.

[GaryP]

It is not about the size of GR "City" or even its "thrifty" inhabitants. It is about DOWNTOWN GR being at the hub of a 2.2 million people trade area that includes the entire GR Tri-Metro Area (GR/Muskegon/Holland), Greater Lansing and the Kalamazoo/Battle Creek Urban Complex - ALL WITHIN A ONE HOUR DRIVE FROM DOWNTOWN GR.

I went to see an economic development speaker who said the same thing could be true with the airport. If lansing, kalamazoo, and battle creek didnt each have an airport, then GRR could support non stop service to every major metro in the country and even support some international flights.

[GRGridGirl]

Large malls are thankfully a thing of the past. As we closed our neighborhood stores and paved over greenfields to build & support malls, we increased sprawl and the obesity rate, losing the connection between vendor and guest, as well as negatively impacting the environment.

Boutique retail shops, boutique hotels, and boutique grocery stores would add to the vibrancy of the central city and add to our sense of place.

Quote from ULI:

"To help create demand, the supply has to be attractive. Downtown has to be people friendly, with a "humanized" physical setting and a concentration of compatible uses. James H. Bond, president of Central Parking System, Inc., in Nashville, noted that "people want a reason to come together and feel a sense of community." Downtown as a place can help create and support a market, remarked Eason. Daniel Brents, vice president of Gensler in Houston, observed that "the prevailing trend in developing successful urban retail is creating a sense of place." He defined a successful place as a gathering spot with special qualities and characteristics not found everywhere else that provides excitement, variety, and a range of choices; a human-scale environment with humanizing touches; and a safe, clean environment with convenient access and parking-like Clematis Street in West Palm Beach. Ultimately, it is "more about congregating than merchandizing," he said."

Speaking of those old single use malls, when closed known as grayfield sites, check out the following quote from ULI:

"Grayfield sites could benefit instead from a mixed-use redevelopment strategy that includes residential, necessity retail, services, and civic uses, plus an educational component. These sites could become hybrid edge city neighborhoods-new concentrations of office, retail, and residential uses, and employment outside the central business district. America

[joeDowntown]

I'd like to see a Great Indoors, Home Expo type store in GR.

Also, how about a Crate and Barrel, Ikea, Room and Board. All of our home furnishing stores (except EQ3 downtown, Stones Throw on Plainfield and a few others) are all stuffy and stodgy. We need some cool places to help upgrade our digs.

Also, not upscale, but I still want to see a House of Blues, Dave and Busters or Gameworks in town... (downtown I mean).

Joe

[MJLO]

i'll add, cheesecake factory, California Pizza Kitchen, and Chiaso to your list Joe

[GRDadof3]

Large malls are thankfully a thing of the past.

Tell that to Charlotte, Denver and a host of other cities which have recently seen an explosion of million+ sq ft malls

Maybe we could look at making our PWCD project more of an open air concept metrogrkid??

[mpchicago]

Not sure why, but GR seems to get passed over or have later entries for some national retailers/restaurants.

With regards to Home Depot

[GRDadof3]

It

[trongrr]

All I want is a Trader Joe's and I'll be happy as a clam.

Also the drive to the new IKEA in Bollingbrook, IL is much better than the drive to Schaumburg... but I still can't wait for the Canton Twp location. No more toll roads!

[zenstyle]

My two dollars worth...

Grand Rapids needs:

1. Whole Foods Market.

2. Trader Joe's.

3. PeaPod or other comprehensive grocery delivery service.

4. ZipCar.

5. An umbrella repair shop, for crying out loud (and don't say "just throw it out" or I'll smack you.)

6. a dog park you don't have to drive to.

These six businesses should be located north of Burton, South of Michgan/Bridge Street, west of Plymouth and east of Scribner.

[gr2newbie]

My two dollars worth...

Grand Rapids needs:

1. Whole Foods Market.

2. Trader Joe's.

Dittos for 1 & 2, I just returned from a trip south and found a great natural grocery store, Earth Fare http://www.earthfare.com headquarters in Ashville, NC. They have 12 stores in I believe smaller markets than GR, Knoxville TN, Charleston SC, Athens GA etc... (many in university towns). I like shopping at Harvest Health but I think GR is ready for a full sized natural grocery store.

I read somewhere that Trader Joes is owned by someone in the German family that owns Aldi Stores, anyone have any info? I have to rethink the monthly trips to TJ's after gas had gone up so high but I do have a small pantry filled with a 6 month supply of capers, balsamic vinegar and roasted red peppers.

For any foodies on the board, GR is home to a Penzey Spices, http://www.penzeys.com one of a couple dozen locations in US and first in Michigan.