Who will reach 100,000 first?

[Mith242]

Beaver Lake is somewhat rocky and mountainous in this area. I could see more homes and condo's being built out there, but land is a little more to develop out there. Our best option is to build up and use up what land we do have and annex land out near Centerton and Cave Springs. There is a lot of land that still can be developed, but you still have to think about the future and annexing and such.

I know everyone wants to take the flat easy to develop land but I think everyone has been ignoring areas just because they aren't flat. Granted I guess it would be more expensive to do so everyone will wait to look into those areas last. But I'd like to see some of the hilly areas get some developments. I think it could be done if you had the right mindset. Not just try to go in and bulldoze the area flat. But as I said I imagine it is more expensive to develop these areas so it might be a while before any of this happens.

[mcheiss]

I know everyone wants to take the flat easy to develop land but I think everyone has been ignoring areas just because they aren't flat. Granted I guess it would be more expensive to do so everyone will wait to look into those areas last. But I'd like to see some of the hilly areas get some developments. I think it could be done if you had the right mindset. Not just try to go in and bulldoze the area flat. But as I said I imagine it is more expensive to develop these areas so it might be a while before any of this happens.

There are some nice sub-divisions out in Rogers on Beaver Lake. And there are plenty under construction. I think that development with condo housing and even single family housing will continue thanks to the Grandview Condos. Is there much housing development in Washington County near Beaver Lake?

I thought I heard about a developer who wanted to put condos in down near Fayetteville on the lake or something a little while back.

[Mith242]

There are some nice sub-divisions out in Rogers on Beaver Lake. And there are plenty under construction. I think that development with condo housing and even single family housing will continue thanks to the Grandview Condos. Is there much housing development in Washington County near Beaver Lake?

I thought I heard about a developer who wanted to put condos in down near Fayetteville on the lake or something a little while back.

Hmmm...not sure I know what lake they might be talking about. I'm sure Springdale has some houses along Beaver Lake, but keep in mind Beaver Lake isn't too big by the time it gets to Washington County. I think it basically ends on the northeast edge of Springdale or close to it. There are houses out there but I'm not sure just how organized it is, if there are any big housing developments and so on. In Fayetteville all we have is Lake Fayetteville and Lake Sequoyah, both very small compared to Beaver Lake. Lake Fayetteville is not too far east of the Northwest Arkansas Mall area in the north part of town. Lake Sequoyah is to the southeast of the city. It's in the city limits but I don't think there's much development out that way, just some houses.

[mcheiss]

Hmmm...not sure I know what lake they might be talking about. I'm sure Springdale has some houses along Beaver Lake, but keep in mind Beaver Lake isn't too big by the time it gets to Washington County. I think it basically ends on the northeast edge of Springdale or close to it. There are houses out there but I'm not sure just how organized it is, if there are any big housing developments and so on. In Fayetteville all we have is Lake Fayetteville and Lake Sequoyah, both very small compared to Beaver Lake. Lake Fayetteville is not too far east of the Northwest Arkansas Mall area in the north part of town. Lake Sequoyah is to the southeast of the city. It's in the city limits but I don't think there's much development out that way, just some houses.

I think development will surely increase out at the lake now, since the word is out.

[Mith242]

I think development will surely increase out at the lake now, since the word is out.

Yeah but our lakes aren't anything like Beaver Lake. I always wonder how things would be if either Beaver Lake was bigger and extended further down to us or if it had been the dam had been built further upstream and a major lake was closer to Fayetteville. I wish we had a major lake closer to Fayetteville. But I guess it will work out well for Rogers.

[mcheiss]

Rogers has a lot of land out there, it's just the homeowners and the land!

Beaver Lake has a lot to offer. There's a nice state park out there also called Lost Bridges or something like that, islands that offer a lots of privacy, and underwater buildings that used to be a hotel or something. There's also the views, which I think is what's going to drive developers to build large condo towers and nice homes.

Could Fayetteville ever build around Lake Fayetteville or Sequoyah?

[Mith242]

Rogers has a lot of land out there, it's just the homeowners and the land!

Beaver Lake has a lot to offer. There's a nice state park out there also called Lost Bridges or something like that, islands that offer a lots of privacy, and underwater buildings that used to be a hotel or something. There's also the views, which I think is what's going to drive developers to build large condo towers and nice homes.

Could Fayetteville ever build around Lake Fayetteville or Sequoyah?

I've heard they are totally redoing the state park around Beaver Lake. It's going to eventually become a much bigger park with more to offer. I think they have decided part of this because of the population growth here in northwest Arkansas. I think they are going to somehow incorperate Beaver Lake State Park and the Hobbs SMA. But now that I think of it I think Lost Bridges is a bit southwest of Beaver Lake State Park. I guess I had forgotten it was a state park too.

Fayetteville could build around Lake Fayetteville to a certain degree I guess. Although part of that land is for the botonical park and there's also a city park too. Then the north side of the lake is Springdlae land where they also have a park too. I think the Springdale side has more houses near the lake. I think Fayetteville has tried to keep more of it's side more natural. But I don't know if either one is big enough that anyone would want to try to put in much of a development. I guess it just depends on how you look at it.

[mcheiss]

I've heard they are totally redoing the state park around Beaver Lake. It's going to eventually become a much bigger park with more to offer. I think they have decided part of this because of the population growth here in northwest Arkansas. I think they are going to somehow incorperate Beaver Lake State Park and the Hobbs SMA. But now that I think of it I think Lost Bridges is a bit southwest of Beaver Lake State Park. I guess I had forgotten it was a state park too.

Fayetteville could build around Lake Fayetteville to a certain degree I guess. Although part of that land is for the botonical park and there's also a city park too. Then the north side of the lake is Springdlae land where they also have a park too. I think the Springdale side has more houses near the lake. I think Fayetteville has tried to keep more of it's side more natural. But I don't know if either one is big enough that anyone would want to try to put in much of a development. I guess it just depends on how you look at it.

I didn't hear about that, another one slid under my nose!!

[Mith242]

I didn't hear about that, another one slid under my nose!!

I think it's going to be a slow process. But at the original Beaver Lake State Park, there wasn't a lot to offer that other state parks had. I think they realized that being so close to an up and coming population center could offer more if they did something with that area. I think Devil's Den State Park is often helped by the fact of it's nearby location to northwest Arkansas metro.

[mcheiss]

I think it's going to be a slow process. But at the original Beaver Lake State Park, there wasn't a lot to offer that other state parks had. I think they realized that being so close to an up and coming population center could offer more if they did something with that area. I think Devil's Den State Park is often helped by the fact of it's nearby location to northwest Arkansas metro.

The area is prime. I think they just completed a boat dock expansion in that area, and they are planning another one soon.

[skirby]

According to the U. S. Census Bureau Fort Smith has already reached the 100,000 mark. The daytime estimated population of Ft. Smith is 108,834. Fayetteville is the next highest in your poll with 69,536.

[Aporkalypse]

According to the U. S. Census Bureau Fort Smith has already reached the 100,000 mark. The daytime estimated population of Ft. Smith is 108,834. Fayetteville is the next highest in your poll with 69,536.

Daytime population is a different animal. Ft Smith provides a nidus for medical care, law, banking and shopping for Eastern Oklahoma and a smaller chunk of Western Arkansas. There are a ton of commuters from these areas and a lot of regional offices there. It is interesting that in many ways in these areas it is well ahead of NWA as Benton and Washington Cos didn't have a regional role until fairly recently.

I have to wonder how Beverly going on the chopping block will affect things.

[Mith242]

I don't think 69,000 is a very accurate daytime population. I believe most people believe we've already hit or are very near this mark with regular city population. And if Ft Smith gets to add extra daytime people what about all the students here at the university? There's an extra 18,000 just right there not including other people in the surrounding area who come to work in Fayetteville. But Ft Smith has been the center of this region. Something that Fayetteville and the rest of northwest Arkansas is still having a hard time trying to wrestle away some of this. Look how many of the tv stations are still mainly based out of Ft Smith instead of northwest Arkansas for example.

Edited October 24, 2005 by Mith242

[CentralArkansas]

I don't think 69,000 is a very accurate daytime population. I believe most people believe we've already hit or are very near this mark with regular city population. And if Ft Smith gets to add extra daytime people what about all the students here at the university? There's an extra 18,000 just right there not including other people in the surrounding area who come to work in Fayetteville. But Ft Smith has been the center of this region. Soemthing that Fayetteville and the rest of northwest Arkansas is still having a hard time trying to wrestle away some of this. Look how many of the tv stations are still mainly based out of Ft Smith instead of northwest Arkansas for example.

Well, in that case, you can add just under 15k to Conway's population.

[mcheiss]

I don't think 69,000 is a very accurate daytime population. I believe most people believe we've already hit or are very near this mark with regular city population. And if Ft Smith gets to add extra daytime people what about all the students here at the university? There's an extra 18,000 just right there not including other people in the surrounding area who come to work in Fayetteville. But Ft Smith has been the center of this region. Something that Fayetteville and the rest of northwest Arkansas is still having a hard time trying to wrestle away some of this. Look how many of the tv stations are still mainly based out of Ft Smith instead of northwest Arkansas for example.

Doesn't Fayetteville have a population of 70,000 permanetly?

[Mith242]

Doesn't Fayetteville have a population of 70,000 permanetly?

Yeah I guess that was what the point I was trying to make. Now I don't know if it's hit 70,000 just yet but most estimates put it pretty close already. This doesn't take in to account any daytime population. But I imagine most people are going off of 2000 census figures. I kept hearing about most of the cities up here having special censuses but I haven't heard any info back on anything. But all of this is hard to judge, I don't know if people are using current estimates for cities like Conway because we may not be as familiar with it and vice versa on cities up here for other people in the state. If we did figure in daytime populations I wonder where Little Rock would be at then.

[mcheiss]

Yeah I guess that was what the point I was trying to make. Now I don't know if it's hit 70,000 just yet but most estimates put it pretty close already. This doesn't take in to account any daytime population. But I imagine most people are going off of 2000 census figures. I kept hearing about most of the cities up here having special censuses but I haven't heard any info back on anything. But all of this is hard to judge, I don't know if people are using current estimates for cities like Conway because we may not be as familiar with it and vice versa on cities up here for other people in the state. If we did figure in daytime populations I wonder where Little Rock would be at then.

Rogers is having one in 2006 simply for turn back funds

Centerton is having one as well in 2006 for turn back funds and for permanet city officers like the mayor and such.

Bentonville and Springdale I know are both having one.

They estimate Springdale's will be around 65,000 to 67,000 and Rogers will be around 49,000.

[Mith242]

Rogers is having one in 2006 simply for turn back funds

Centerton is having one as well in 2006 for turn back funds and for permanet city officers like the mayor and such.

Bentonville and Springdale I know are both having one.

They estimate Springdale's will be around 65,000 to 67,000 and Rogers will be around 49,000.

Maybe everyone is having theirs in 2006 then. I don't know about Rogers but I've seen some varying figures on Springdale. I've seen some predicting they have closer to 62,000 and not being quite so close to Fayetteville's size. But I guess we'll eventually find out whenever they do the special censuses and have time to put out the figures.

[Mith242]

Since this was mentioned earlier, I noticed the Arkansas Democrat Gazette or at least the northwest edition of it had an article talking about daytime populations. I don't have the exact figures but it was something like this. Little Rock of course dominated with around 59,000 additional people. Ft Smith had around 28,000 additional. Bentonville had around 13,000, Hot Springs and Fayetteville around 11,000. And Springdale and Jonesboro coming in with a little over 10,000. The article focused particularly on Bentonville and talked about how people as far away as Carroll County, southwest Missouri and eastern Oklahoma worked in Bentonville.

[mcheiss]

Since this was mentioned earlier, I noticed the Arkansas Democrat Gazette or at least the northwest edition of it had an article talking about daytime populations. I don't have the exact figures but it was something like this. Little Rock of course dominated with around 59,000 additional people. Ft Smith had around 28,000 additional. Bentonville had around 13,000, Hot Springs and Fayetteville around 11,000. And Springdale and Jonesboro coming in with a little over 10,000. The article focused particularly on Bentonville and talked about how people as far away as Carroll County, southwest Missouri and eastern Oklahoma worked in Bentonville.

I saw that.

People come from all over the general area to come work in Bentonville. I even know people who live in Fort Smith that commute everyday to come work at Wal-Mart.

[Mith242]

I saw that.

People come from all over the general area to come work in Bentonville. I even know people who live in Fort Smith that commute everyday to come work at Wal-Mart.

Yeah it seems a bit odd to people who may have lived here in Arkansas. But people I know from California think nothing of it. I guess I'm just trying to figure out why so many people would opt to live that far away and work here. I think in California it's more understandable. But this isn't exactly the big city here. I guess the main thing I can see is house and real estate prices here in northwest Arkansas. But this goes back to the discussion about the idea of bussing people who live in Ft Smith up here to northwest Arkansas on a daily basis to work. If the jobs are here and not in Ft Smith why are there that many people who just won't move up here. I imagine there are circumstances like a spouse who does work in the city where they live. Maybe even the thought of not wanting to move the kids out of a school they are familiar with. Although I think most schools up here are pretty good. No offense to other areas, but I get the impression the schools here in northwest Arkansas are better than just about any other schools in the area.

[mcheiss]

Yeah it seems a bit odd to people who may have lived here in Arkansas. But people I know from California think nothing of it. I guess I'm just trying to figure out why so many people would opt to live that far away and work here. I think in California it's more understandable. But this isn't exactly the big city here. I guess the main thing I can see is house and real estate prices here in northwest Arkansas. But this goes back to the discussion about the idea of bussing people who live in Ft Smith up here to northwest Arkansas on a daily basis to work. If the jobs are here and not in Ft Smith why are there that many people who just won't move up here. I imagine there are circumstances like a spouse who does work in the city where they live. Maybe even the thought of not wanting to move the kids out of a school they are familiar with. Although I think most schools up here are pretty good. No offense to other areas, but I get the impression the schools here in northwest Arkansas are better than just about any other schools in the area.

Some people prefer to live in Fort Smith because they have family there, or they grew up there. Also, I think you nailed it when you talked about real-estate prices. They are somewhat higher here than in places like Fort Smith, Caroll County, and Southwest Missouri.

[Mith242]

Some people prefer to live in Fort Smith because they have family there, or they grew up there. Also, I think you nailed it when you talked about real-estate prices. They are somewhat higher here than in places like Fort Smith, Caroll County, and Southwest Missouri.

For that matter they are higher here than just about anywhere in this whole region. I'm pretty sure they mentioned last year that the average price of a home in northwest Arkansas had surpassed even Dallas. So perhaps that is one of the main hinderances in many of these people living up here.

[mcheiss]

For that matter they are higher here than just about anywhere in this whole region. I'm pretty sure they mentioned last year that the average price of a home in northwest Arkansas had surpassed even Dallas. So perhaps that is one of the main hinderances in many of these people living up here.

I hope our high real estate prices don't force an Atlanta effect up here.

Hopefully, it can cause more mixed-used downtown like projects.

[Mith242]

I hope our high real estate prices don't force an Atlanta effect up here.

Hopefully, it can cause more mixed-used downtown like projects.

Yeah or even like it is in California. That is one of the factors mentioned in why some of the are leaving the state for places like Fayetteville. Of course to them we're still pretty cheap. But yes hopefully there will be some other options. Otherwise we'll never be able to have much of a manufacturing base around here because too many people won't be able to afford living here.