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East Beltline Developments

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What is the difference between Parisian and Younkers (I'm not sure I've ever been in Younkers)?

Parisian (owned by Saks) is smaller, and I think a bit more upscale than Younkers (although maybe not much). Not saying much, but Younkers blows away Macy's, at least in men's clothes, and it's probably one step below Nordstrom.

Probably splitting hairs. :P I just read on the blog that it will be 120,000 square feet. That's a pretty good sized department store.

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I have shopped many times at the Von Maur in Fort Wayne at Jefferson Pointe lifestyle center and I think it is the best department store. I like it better than Nordstroms, Macys or Saks. It will bring in other stores and restaurants such as PF Changs and maybe even Trader Joes. :)

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With General Growth Properties heading towards possible bankruptcy, Curcuit City already going bankrupt and retail sales across the board dipping and add that to Michigan's stuggling economy and high unemployment play into the status of the this development? It just seems like the economics on this are getting more difficult by the day.

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With General Growth Properties heading towards possible bankruptcy, Curcuit City already going bankrupt and retail sales across the board dipping and add that to Michigan's stuggling economy and high unemployment play into the status of the this development? It just seems like the economics on this are getting more difficult by the day.

I'm guessing that's why this is the "2011" debut and not the fall of 2009 or spring of 2010 debut. They are obviously hoping that things will have rebounded a bit by then. I certainly hope so, but there are no guarantees.

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... maybe even Trader Joes. :)

At one time (I'm sure that I have some posts from a year or two ago to support this) I was all about a Whole Foods or a Trader Joe's coming into the area, but now I don't think I'd want to see one. It's a novelty at best IMHO. Go through a new D&W (what will hopefully eventually go up at Michigan and Fuller) or Meijer at Cascade, and you will find (albeit in between 10,000 other products) very similar products at about the same price. Meijer Organics are about as good as I have found quality-wise, especially given their price point. I used to shop at Whole Foods every week when I lived in Ann Arbor, so I'd like to think I have appropriate basis to say this as well. Instead of always clamoring for another out-of-town competitor to come into GR, it would be REALLY refreshing to instead lobby Meijer or Spartan to try a new concept that would be along the lines of a Trader Joes, such as a 20,000 store that is predominantly Meijer brand food.

I'm not trying to pick on you, GR2010 (there's a half-dozen other recent threads begging for a TJ's or WF's), this just happened to be the most recent posting mentioning it is all :)

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At one time (I'm sure that I have some posts from a year or two ago to support this) I was all about a Whole Foods or a Trader Joe's coming into the area, but now I don't think I'd want to see one. It's a novelty at best IMHO. Go through a new D&W (what will hopefully eventually go up at Michigan and Fuller) or Meijer at Cascade, and you will find (albeit in between 10,000 other products) very similar products at about the same price. Meijer Organics are about as good as I have found quality-wise, especially given their price point. I used to shop at Whole Foods every week when I lived in Ann Arbor, so I'd like to think I have appropriate basis to say this as well. Instead of always clamoring for another out-of-town competitor to come into GR, it would be REALLY refreshing to instead lobby Meijer or Spartan to try a new concept that would be along the lines of a Trader Joes, such as a 20,000 store that is predominantly Meijer brand food.

I'm not trying to pick on you, GR2010 (there's a half-dozen other recent threads begging for a TJ's or WF's), this just happened to be the most recent posting mentioning it is all :)

Does Meijer have reasonably cheap dark chocolate covered espresso beans? :) I would not mind seeing a cool new Meijer concept store here. But, the only thing is that I don't know how well this would play in other markets. Here, they have a lot of brand loyalty because they are a local company. In other markets where they might try to open these stores, they might not have that same recognition. I think it could work though.

Plus, a Trader Joe's is not going to have those, socks/underwear, OTC drugs, and basic clothing items that would make this a store that would prevent you from having to go out to the suburbs.

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Does Meijer have reasonably cheap dark chocolate covered espresso beans? :) I would not mind seeing a cool new Meijer concept store here. But, the only thing is that I don't know how well this would play in other markets. Here, they have a lot of brand loyalty because they are a local company. In other markets where they might try to open these stores, they might not have that same recognition. I think it could work though.

Plus, a Trader Joe's is not going to have those, socks/underwear, OTC drugs, and basic clothing items that would make this a store that would prevent you from having to go out to the suburbs.

Been to [email protected]? Their local prototype concept store. (I made my weekly lunch run yesterday, otherwise I would go reconnoiter the mentioned espresso beans. Believe I've seen truffles and them there fan-cee painted designer chocolates. Haven't studied the offerings, as such product has a tendency to leap into my cart.)

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Assuming Von Maur is going to be the Southern anchor, I wonder who they are targeting for the Northern anchor? The Village of Rochester Hills has Parisian and Whole Foods. With five WF in Southeast Michigan now, it seems like it's just a matter of time (even if it is 2010/11).

2329088448_3abd14dc4f_b.jpg

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Good afternoon,

I have an exciting announcement that I wanted to share with you: Department store Von Maur signed a Letter of Intent to join us for the 2011 debut of the Village of Orchard Hills in Grand Rapids, Michigan. Once open, the Village will be Western Michigan's first and only Main Street lifestyle center.

We have some additional information regarding this great news on our project blog.

http://www.thevooh.com

Entries recently published on the blog include:

Blog Post 1: "The Announcement"

Blog Post 2: "What Does This Mean for National and Local Retailers?"

Blog Post 3: "What Does This Mean for Michigan's West Coast?"

Blog Post 4: "Grand Rapids has community strategy, access to cash, 'can-do' spirit"

Blog Post 5: "The Village of Rochester Hills on Youtube"

Cheers,

Scott Aikens

The Kid called it November 4, 2008 at 4:30p! WOO HOO!! :yahoo:

. . . . I'm betting on Von Maur, Dillards and <insert drum-roll>, of course either Lord & Taylor or Nordstrom.

With all that is going on with retail in the Midwest now, I would have to admit that the most likely candidate is Von Maur. This is logical since they are the retailer most aggressively going after and catering to all of the disgruntled Marshall Fields devotees in the Midwest that now refuse to shop at MessyMart . . . . er, Macy's.

Now what's up with the talk about Parisian also being a tenant? Anyone hear about that?

Also, this might cultivate support for an East Beltline BRT with stations at VOH, Celebration Village, Knapp's Corner, Cornerstone University, a Transfer Station with a potential Cascade Road/Michigan Street/Bridge Street Medical Corridor BRT, Central Michigan University-East Beltline, Calvin College, WMU-East Beltline, Woodland, Aerotech Business Park and Ford Airport. Just thinking of the possibilities. :whistling:

Edited by metrogrkid

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metrogrkid: Parisian has come up because it is one of two anchors at the Village of Rochester Hills, which was developed by the same group that's developing Orchard Hills. I think people have just been comparing the two...

Anyone know if this development is supposed to primarily contain upscale stores (Neiman Marcus, Ralph Lauren, Armani Exchange, etc.), or more "plain" (for lack of a better term coming to mind) stores like those in the Village of Rochester Hills (Hollister, Gap, Abercrombie, etc)? I wouldn't expect this mall to have many of the same stores as Woodland due to proximity, so I would think they might be going after some new-to-West-Michigan stores such as Urban Outfitters and some other name-brand shops.

Edited by the_grand_raggidy

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metrogrkid: Parisian has come up because it is one of two anchors at the Village of Rochester Hills, which was developed by the same group that's developing Orchard Hills. I think people have just been comparing the two...

Anyone know if this development is supposed to primarily contain upscale stores (Neiman Marcus, Ralph Lauren, Armani Exchange, etc.), or more "plain" (for lack of a better term coming to mind) stores like those in the Village of Rochester Hills (Hollister, Gap, Abercrombie, etc)? I wouldn't expect this mall to have many of the same stores as Woodland due to proximity, so I would think they might be going after some new-to-West-Michigan stores such as Urban Outfitters and some other name-brand shops.

With VOH being surrounded by Forest Hills, Ada, Cascade, East Grand Rapids and the NE portion of the City, you would think that high-end super-regionals that heretofore required a trip to Chicago or Troy would be highly sought after targets. I am sure that many a breadwinner of east metro upscale married couples - were one of them is a bonified and out-of-control shopping maniac - are quaking in their boots about now. They're going to be having nightmares with their spouses screaming "CHARGE IT!!" in Bedrock outfits. :lol:

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At one time (I'm sure that I have some posts from a year or two ago to support this) I was all about a Whole Foods or a Trader Joe's coming into the area, but now I don't think I'd want to see one. It's a novelty at best IMHO. Go through a new D&W (what will hopefully eventually go up at Michigan and Fuller) or Meijer at Cascade, and you will find (albeit in between 10,000 other products) very similar products at about the same price. Meijer Organics are about as good as I have found quality-wise, especially given their price point. I used to shop at Whole Foods every week when I lived in Ann Arbor, so I'd like to think I have appropriate basis to say this as well. Instead of always clamoring for another out-of-town competitor to come into GR, it would be REALLY refreshing to instead lobby Meijer or Spartan to try a new concept that would be along the lines of a Trader Joes, such as a 20,000 store that is predominantly Meijer brand food.

I'm not trying to pick on you, GR2010 (there's a half-dozen other recent threads begging for a TJ's or WF's), this just happened to be the most recent posting mentioning it is all :)

Organic and natural foods are a tricky issue for grocers. Organics spoil quicker and natural foods overall are more expensive. If stuff doesn't get bought and goes bad...you are losing more money than you would just stocking the regular goods. Given the tight economic times, people likely will not be willing to pay the extra money for these type of items. Businesses will also be a lot more shy about taking any unneccessary risks. They are a lot more likely to go with more conventional offerings that prove to bring in customers including; coupons, Starbucks/Seattles Best, fuel centers, and drive-thru pharmacies. If they knew it would help to make them more money, trust me, they'd be doing it.

Having worked at a D&W/Family Fare in the past...I can tell you I often spent more time dusting the product than selling it.There is just still too much of the old West Michigan thrift mentality still around (not necessarily a bad thing...just bad for high end grocery). However, it is changing somewhat with the new generation.

Edited by j3shafer

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Been to [email protected]? Their local prototype concept store. (I made my weekly lunch run yesterday, otherwise I would go reconnoiter the mentioned espresso beans. Believe I've seen truffles and them there fan-cee painted designer chocolates. Haven't studied the offerings, as such product has a tendency to leap into my cart.)

At great personal effort and sacrifice, I reconned [email protected] for the aforementioned product.

All of the candy is located up front, by the grocery entrance, adjacent to greeting cards and bakery. One aisle, Everyday chocolate, containes yer basic big name brands. Another, Premium chocolate, has many shelves with Lindt and high-end Russell Stover stuff. (Chocolate chai drops. How healthy!) Another section, Kids stuff, has all those odd plastic shapes filled with appropriately-themed sugar bombs. (My favorite is garbage can-dy; I don't consume it, just fond of the concept.) I also noticed Harry Potter "blood suckers" (someone should have brought those DT on 10/30).

Lots of chocolate-covered items: Altoids, Harry & David fruits (cranberries, blueberries, cherries) and nuts (pistachios, almonds, cashews). Bulk Brach's with more covered nuts. Something called "black chocolate drops" next to the Jellie Bellies.

An island with gift boxes and those painted schmancy designer truffles in a cityscape-print box. I guess that's what urbanists are supposed to like.

The only espresso beans in the place are from the green goddess. Candy area has milk, and dark chocolate ones are over by produce and the **$$ stand.

Clearly this is a major deficiency in Fred's product line.

For those who didn't know, Friday afternoons (about 2 pm) is when the sampling stations open up at [email protected]

Edited by Veloise

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Clearly this is a major deficiency in Fred's product line.

Clearly.

I'll just have to walk the two blocks to Martha's Vineyard and buy some of the ones they have. Trader Joe's are significantly cheaper, but since they are in Ann Arbor that adds to the cost. ;)

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It will be a consolidation of the 63rd District's 1st and 2nd Divisions.

(1st division) encompasses the Cities of Cedar Springs and Rockford; Townships of Tyron, Solon, Nelson, Spencer, Sparta, Algoma, Courtland, Oakfield, Alpine, Cannon, Plainfield, Gratton, Casnovia Village, and Lake and Kent City

(2nd division) encompasses the Cities of E. Grand Rapids and, Lowell; and the Townships of Grand Rapids, Ada, Cascade, Vergennes, Lowell, Bryon, Gaines, Caledonia and Bowne.

http://www.accesskent.com/CourtsAndLawEnfo...rts/default.htm

Right now the 1st division is in downtown Rockford, and the 2nd division is off of Cascade Rd and Kenmoor. The city of Rockford is pretty peeved about the move apparently.

This doesn't have it's own topic that I could find, so I'm posting it here.

Looks like the County is going ahead with it's plans to build the new courthouse at Knapp and E. Beltline, despite a pending appeal to the Michigan Supreme Court by the City of Rockford who is (Is a city a "who"? Should I be using "are"? Better call the grammar police! :) ) trying to keep its courthouse.

http://www.mlive.com/grpress/news/index.ss...ead_with_e.html

http://www.wzzm13.com/news/news_story.aspx...30&catid=14

The comments on the wzzm site are most entertaining, as usual.

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I would say "which," unless attempting to give the concept of the city a human facade, in which case "who" would be a fun word to throw around. I suppose "who" might work when using the human community of Rockford as opposed to the politics of the city, as well.

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At one time (I'm sure that I have some posts from a year or two ago to support this) I was all about a Whole Foods or a Trader Joe's coming into the area, but now I don't think I'd want to see one. It's a novelty at best IMHO. Go through a new D&W (what will hopefully eventually go up at Michigan and Fuller) or Meijer at Cascade, and you will find (albeit in between 10,000 other products) very similar products at about the same price. Meijer Organics are about as good as I have found quality-wise, especially given their price point. I used to shop at Whole Foods every week when I lived in Ann Arbor, so I'd like to think I have appropriate basis to say this as well. Instead of always clamoring for another out-of-town competitor to come into GR, it would be REALLY refreshing to instead lobby Meijer or Spartan to try a new concept that would be along the lines of a Trader Joes, such as a 20,000 store that is predominantly Meijer brand food.

I'm not trying to pick on you, GR2010 (there's a half-dozen other recent threads begging for a TJ's or WF's), this just happened to be the most recent posting mentioning it is all :)

-looks at you confused-

I terribly disagree.

Meijer organics? it's ok.

I would much rather prefer higher quality in Whole Foods.

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The Knapp's Corner "village" is starting to ask for concessions already:

The applicant requests that the following items in the approved site plan be

deferred until a later phase of construction or altered:

1) Reduction of the sidewalks on Main Street to eight (8) feet on the west

side and four (4) feet on the east side;

2) Deferred construction of the west side retaining wall along the Kent

County infiltration basin;

3) Deferred installation of the six (6) foot chain link fence on the east side

of the infiltration basin;

4) Deferred construction of the first drive south of Main Street;

5) Deferred installation of the retaining wall at the corner of Knapp and

East Beltline; and

6) Deferred construction of the west drive, parallel to the East Beltline.

7) Change from concrete paving and brick pavers to asphalt along Main

Street.

http://www.grcity.us/meeting.pl?meeting=719&type=agenda

http://www.mlive.com/news/grpress/index.ss....xml&coll=6

In somewhat similar geographical area, Pioneer has started on the new 63rd Consolidated Courthouse across Knapp St (behind Chase Bank). They have a lot of the site cleared already.

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Well yeah I would not be surprised for many stores to move from Woodland over to the new location...I can't imagine these retailers keeping two stores within a what 5 mile range? I mean if this was NYC or something then it would make sense.

Although given the sizes of the available stores - there is not much room for the big ones like jcpenney, macy's, sears - those would probably stay at woodland...but I could see stores like abercrombie, banana republic, pac sun, etc making their transition to newer buildings.

So if the anchor stores stay at their locations - this really could open up some opportunities for Woodland to get its own one-of-a-kind-in-its-area stores too. But some people at the same time will be going to the new lifestyle center more over woodland because of its convenience - and let's face it some if not all parts of Woodland need a serious makeover.

By the way - isn't it ironic how [email protected] is the only store so far in GR that is beefing up its look and trying to really get the high end feel going...it's almost like it knows a favorite grocer is coming to the area very soon :whistling:

Edited by blueradon

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I'm still surprised that this project is trying to move forward. Every prediction that I am hearing has the number of retail stores nationwide contracting 10% - 20%. There is simply too much retail (and too much of the same thing) out there for the market that exists today. I wouldn't venture the correlation that stores closing in Woodland will lead to a new store at Knapp. A store closing these days means that the company is pulling up the stakes for a while until the market / economy improves.

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Well yeah I would not be surprised for many stores to move from Woodland over to the new location...I can't imagine these retailers keeping two stores within a what 5 mile range? I mean if this was NYC or something then it would make sense.

Although given the sizes of the available stores - there is not much room for the big ones like jcpenney, macy's, sears - those would probably stay at woodland...but I could see stores like abercrombie, banana republic, pac sun, etc making their transition to newer buildings.

So if the anchor stores stay at their locations - this really could open up some opportunities for Woodland to get its own one-of-a-kind-in-its-area stores too. But some people at the same time will be going to the new lifestyle center more over woodland because of its convenience - and let's face it some if not all parts of Woodland need a serious makeover.

By the way - isn't it ironic how [email protected] is the only store so far in GR that is beefing up its look and trying to really get the high end feel going...it's almost like it knows a favorite grocer is coming to the area very soon :whistling:

Considering both projects are still in the "planning stages", I can't see any stores jumping Woodland's ship any time soon. All they want to build so far at Knapp's Corner is the D&W store. Orchard Hills is still in holding pattern it seems (and with the retail world rocked with this season's dismal Christmas season, it might be for a while). My guess is Pac Sun is just going out of business (I never see anyone in there).

What CK1 said. :)

Just take a mental inventory of stores that never seem to have any traffic, and I bet 2009 will be the last year you see them open.

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Considering both projects are still in the "planning stages", I can't see any stores jumping Woodland's ship any time soon. All they want to build so far at Knapp's Corner is the D&W store. Orchard Hills is still in holding pattern it seems (and with the retail world rocked with this season's dismal Christmas season, it might be for a while). My guess is Pac Sun is just going out of business (I never see anyone in there).

What CK1 said. :)

Just take a mental inventory of stores that never seem to have any traffic, and I bet 2009 will be the last year you see them open.

So basically Woodland Mall will be renamed "Macy's, Apple and a Food Court"

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I think there should be another option to shop here in Grand Rapid I was at Woodland Saturday night and I have never had such a hard time finding a parking spot in my life and its like that everytime i go to this particular mall now. Who's idea was it to take away from the parking to put in the plaza between on the border and Red Robin? I never see anyone sitting there spring summer fall or winter just seems like a waste and with Barnes and Noble moving in its only gonna get worse i think people in Gr are looking for other options as far as shopping other than Woodland or Rivertown so i think a lifestyle center would work it might just take away business from the other two but a little competition is good right? :P

Edited by Grandrapidsne

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