NoDa (N Davidson St Arts District) Projects

[MrBluePrint]

21 hours ago, KJHburg said:

NoDa Mill District walkabout today.  Boy is the area between Parkwood and Matheson just booming with new apartments and retail and a lot more to come.  

Kudos to Camden NoDa when you build to keep (like Camden does) you build to last!  My favorite apartment complex under construction in the entire metro area.  

Hardly any retail, though, unless you count the gyms built into each apartment complex. Camden is looking very nice and the design respects its surroundings, unlike most of the Soviet-style apartments we see over here.

 

[KJHburg]

6 minutes ago, ATxIn said:

Hardly any retail, though, unless you count the gyms built into each apartment complex. Camden is looking very nice and the design respects its surroundings, unlike most of the Soviet-style apartments we see over here.

 

Camden NoDa is going to have lots of retail and there is retail coming at that Lintmens with its food hall.  https://www.lintmens.com/    https://www.udmnoda.com/

[MrBluePrint]

Maybe you're forgetting that these homes were built for families and not just "workers." 

Those few blocks of Davidson are fraught with issues, on-street parking, vendors selling crap and blocking businesses, empty storefronts and graffiti. There's a lot of talk of a pedestrian-friendly neighborhood, but Davidson doesn't need more traffic. 

[JRCLT]

Maybe you're forgetting that these homes were built for families and not just "workers." 
Those few blocks of Davidson are fraught with issues, on-street parking, vendors selling crap and blocking businesses, empty storefronts and graffiti. There's a lot of talk of a pedestrian-friendly neighborhood, but Davidson doesn't need more traffic. 

Depends…more traffic tends to slow traffic flow and results in less speeding. Less speeding is less dangerous for pedestrians. Accommodated with proper pedestrian crossings and infrastructure, more traffic would not affect pedestrian-friendliness very much in a negative way.

[Desert Power]

On 1/25/2023 at 5:49 PM, ATxIn said:

Those few blocks of Davidson are fraught with issues, on-street parking, vendors selling crap and blocking businesses, empty storefronts and graffiti. There's a lot of talk of a pedestrian-friendly neighborhood, but Davidson doesn't need more traffic. 

These issues all have potential solutions beyond restricting development and restricting development does nothing to address them. On street parking should have been long banned along North Davidson for sure, but the city would have to have a willingness to enforce it. They seldom enforce the stretch it is banned on. Same thing with these vendors on the sidewalk. The redevelopment at the YMCA site should yield a public garage that will help give an alternative to on-street parking.

Charlotte isn't choking on over-development; it is choking on bad governance and an unwillingness to enforce laws.

[CLT Development]

On 1/25/2023 at 5:49 PM, ATxIn said:

Maybe you're forgetting that these homes were built for families and not just "workers." 

Those few blocks of Davidson are fraught with issues, on-street parking, vendors selling crap and blocking businesses, empty storefronts and graffiti. There's a lot of talk of a pedestrian-friendly neighborhood, but Davidson doesn't need more traffic. 

Seems like you should move to Arboretum. I live in NoDa and the vendors are really one of the most cosmopolitan things about this neighborhood, and I cannot imagine complaining.

meanwhile on 35th street.

Edited January 28, 2023 by CLT Development

[Desert Power]

Oh that is awesome. If only we could turn that rail line into a trail

[JRCLT]

Oh that is awesome. If only we could turn that rail line into a trail

Or have a trail adjacent I was thinking!

[kermit]

On 1/28/2023 at 4:31 PM, Desert Power said:

Oh that is awesome. If only we could turn that rail line into a trail

Removal of those tracks (and conversion to a trail, part of Cross-Charlotte) has been on the books since 2007 (item #14 on the map below). Despite being a fully planned project, it has been in the inactive / unfunded list since then. The most recent mention I can find says "put on hold indefinitely" I would not be surprised if the proposed new ACWR right of way has fallen victim to NoDa / Sugar Creek gentrification by now.

Its a fine project for infrastructure bill funding but no one in Charlotte appears to want any of that money.

https://charlottenc.gov/Projects/Documents/CharlotteRailroadProjectsUpdate.pdf

Edited January 29, 2023 by kermit

[Reverie39]

This is probably silly and more of a far-fetched thought experiment than anything else. But could there be some potential use for that railway if it is unneeded by anyone else?

Thinking ahead to a NoDa corridor in 2035 that is chock full of high-density apartments and popular commercial spots... would some sort of NoDa tram be useful there? If you go too far north it's just single family housing but wondering what a tram would look like that maybe starts where those tracks cross Sugar Creek Rd, making several stops through NoDa and possibly doing something like hopping onto Brevard, ending at 25th St station for Blue Line transfers? Just brainstorming since it's not often you have unused railroad tracks just happily sitting there running through a medium-density urban place. Of course, the Blue Line already runs through NoDa but seems more useful to connect to other neighborhoods of Charlotte, as opposed to allowing people to travel (or like bar hop) within NoDa itself.

Edited February 2, 2023 by Reverie39

[buildleft]

On 2/2/2023 at 3:32 PM, Reverie39 said:

This is probably silly and more of a far-fetched thought experiment than anything else. But could there be some potential use for that railway if it is unneeded by anyone else?

Thinking ahead to a NoDa corridor in 2035 that is chock full of high-density apartments and popular commercial spots... would some sort of NoDa tram be useful there? If you go too far north it's just single family housing but wondering what a tram would look like that maybe starts where those tracks cross Sugar Creek Rd, making several stops through NoDa and possibly doing something like hopping onto Brevard, ending at 25th St station for Blue Line transfers? Just brainstorming since it's not often you have unused railroad tracks just happily sitting there running through a medium-density urban place. Of course, the Blue Line already runs through NoDa but seems more useful to connect to other neighborhoods of Charlotte, as opposed to allowing people to travel (or like bar hop) within NoDa itself.

How much traffic does the in-town segment of the ACWR get anyway? Genuinely asking, as that is really unclear to me.

Anyway, I've always dreamed of an east branch of the Blue Line, but I suppose a stub-end or partially-street-running tram could work, too. If the city could somehow get their hands on the ROW, this could probably be one of the strongest potential rail projects on a cost v. ridership basis

 

[kermit]

^ I don’t live beside the tracks but it’s my understanding that ACWR might run 1 train per day into Charlotte (and probably run it back out again hours later). I would bet the number is often less than 5 trains per week.

Unlike NS, I am sure the ACWR would be happy to sell off 3/4 their ROW to CATS. Unfortunately it’s not a strong transit corridor beyond NoDa. 

[CLT704]

Anecdotally, from when I lived at 30Six NoDa, ACWR would typically run 3-4x trains a week, it definitely wasn't daily; the inbound would come through late evening and the outbound early in the morning (it took a long time to get use to the horn at 2 am). There was a looooooong train in the early-to-mid afternoon on a Friday quite often too. The most I saw was 2 return trips (so 4 total, 1 into the CLT rail yard and 1 from the CLT rail yard twice) in a day. There was also the odd shuttle run to reposition a locomotive. I miss the train actually, it was weirdly comforting. 

Edited February 7, 2023 by CLT704

[KJHburg]

10 hours ago, kermit said:

^ I don’t live beside the tracks but it’s my understanding that ACWR might run 1 train per day into Charlotte (and probably run it back out again hours later). I would bet the number is often less than 5 trains per week.

Unlike NS, I am sure the ACWR would be happy to sell off 3/4 their ROW to CATS. Unfortunately it’s not a strong transit corridor beyond NoDa. 

but don't you think this will greatly increase with the Charlotte Pipe and Foundry in Oakboro right off this train line?  My brother a train enthusiast thinks it will greatly and CLT Pipe gets multiple trainloads a week if not daily 

[kermit]

24 minutes ago, KJHburg said:

but don't you think this will greatly increase with the Charlotte Pipe and Foundry in Oakboro right off this train line?  My brother a train enthusiast thinks it will greatly and CLT Pipe gets multiple trainloads a week if not daily 

yea could be. I had forgotten about that. ACWR may just run longer trains to Charlotte instead of more trains (but I have no idea).

It all depends on where Charlotte Pipe will get their scrap, it may not come from Charlotte after the move.

[3397char]

On 1/28/2023 at 4:31 PM, Desert Power said:

Oh that is awesome. If only we could turn that rail line into a trail

The NoDa Neighborhood planned for it back in 2010.  (Page 45)  But little support from government and little efficacy by  A&WCRR to make it happen. 

https://noda.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/09/noda-vision-plan-aug-31-2010.pdf

[videtur quam contuor]

Welcome 3397char. Great entry post. What a memory you have and documents from 2010. Well done. Join the fray.

[Desert Power]

On 2/13/2023 at 10:29 AM, 3397char said:

The NoDa Neighborhood planned for it back in 2010.  (Page 45)  But little support from government and little efficacy by  A&WCRR to make it happen. 

https://noda.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/09/noda-vision-plan-aug-31-2010.pdf

Yeah. I lived and owned property next to that line for a while. Feels like the railroads are holding all of North Charlotte hostage. The city needs a vision and budget for these type of corridors; they are transformational.

[MrBluePrint]

The ACWR runs at least every day. I live practically on top of it. I keep track because I live with a railroad fan. We love the trains.

Also, it's not always ACWR engines on that line. Sometimes it's Norfolk Southern.

Back to the topic of the YMCA, can anyone expand on what the zoning allows? 

Also, any idea when the plan will be announced, and with the announcement should we expect a proposed design?

Neighborhood gossips are saying the YMCA is promising this or that, and that they are "tossing around designs..." and that the YMCA won't just build a big "block" there...rumours abound.

[MrBluePrint]

On 1/28/2023 at 3:36 PM, CLT Development said:

Seems like you should move to Arboretum. I live in NoDa and the vendors are really one of the most cosmopolitan things about this neighborhood, and I cannot imagine complaining.

Seriously? How are people selling the old t-shirts you dropped off at Goodwill two years ago "cosmopolitan"? The African trinkets are mostly from China via drop-shipping by AliExpress, the potions being peddled contain god knows what. There were tables full of fake Nikes one day, and one lady sitting out all night with her toddlers playing in the gutter between parked cars. Empty storefronts full of stickers and graffiti, broken glass everywhere. It's trashy.  

And before you send me to the Arboretum again, I'm all over the country, all the time. I spent the last two weeks in LA and NYC and N Davidson resembles the Skid Row area of DTLA more than it does say, Silverlake or West Hollywood. The East Village and Williamsburg don't have this kind of junk being sold on the streets -- or the trash that comes along with it. 

What if you ran bing one of the few remaining shops in NoDa and had someone standing outside selling items similar to what you're stocking. Or you're Ever Andaolo and there's some guy lighting up and blocking your customers' access with his selection of mystery drinks. Imagine complaining? 

It would be helpful if some of you folks who are plugged in with the developers would advocate for artist studios or micro-retail sites. NoDa is no longer the "Arts District" because there's no art here, besides murals, and those are everywhere. Look at the River Arts District in Asheville. 

[JRCLT]

It would be helpful if some of you folks who are plugged in with the developers would advocate for artist studios or micro-retail sites. NoDa is no longer the "Arts District" because there's no art here, besides murals, and those are everywhere. Look at the River Arts District in Asheville. 

Perhaps it was a huge demographic shift over the years…

[san]

9 hours ago, ATxIn said:

 

It would be helpful if some of you folks who are plugged in with the developers would advocate for artist studios or micro-retail sites. NoDa is no longer the "Arts District" because there's no art here, besides murals, and those are everywhere. Look at the River Arts District in Asheville. 

You’re strange but I will agree that NoDa is definitely not an arts district. There really should be an attempt at creating an artist community there since TAC gallery was genuinely the only place that even supported artists there.

[MrBluePrint]

I have autism, which does make me strange, I guess. I wish the powers that be would stop marketing NoDa as an "Arts District," as there are no galleries,  working studios, or performances of art, dance, open mic, stand up  or musicals. We have Neighborhood Theatre and Evening Muse for music at night, and that's it.  No festivals, nothing. 

[Reverie39]

I think Charlotte as a whole could use more of those art-based things.

[kermit]

^ The arts district label is a holdover from 25 years ago when NoDa actually was cheap* and had bars which also had art galleries (Pat’s Time for One More! RIP).

Neighborhood labels don’t die easily. Is the city or neighborhood association actually still using the Arts District label? I thought they dropped that long ago.

* I remember looking at 3 or 4  NoDa mill houses when I was shopping for my first house in Charlotte 23 years ago. Every house I saw had a crappy renovation (new electrical circuits run using visible conduit, trailer park sinks in bathrooms, carpet over hardwood, etc.) but none of these houses were cheaper per square foot than much sturdier and better maintained houses in "lesser-Dilworth" (e.g. McDonald, Magnolia, Ideal Way). I am sure the gallery and studio space was cheap in NoDa back then, but I suspect the last time housing in NoDa was a bargain was 30+ years ago.

Edited February 17, 2023 by kermit