NoDa (N Davidson St Arts District) Projects

[authenticbeing]

* Walked by Sunshine & Daydreams... it was emptied out and there was a bunch of Cabo Fish Taco stuff in there. CFT is currently closed for remodeling, so maybe they're finally expanding in there, although I didn't see any connection between the two spaces as of yet.

Are you sure that you are not thinking of a different store? CFT and Sunshine Daydreams are not even in the same building. Also I was just in Sunshine Daydreams last week and they were very much open so I just called them to see if they somehow just shut down and they did not. They asked me to please correct it on this board so that people do not think they are closed because they are very much open.

[voyager12]

I am quite relieved. I was just in there a week ago buying stickers and other stuff and there was no indication of anything amiss. I can continue to make my busted up car liberal visual clutter now that they are still open Edited January 3, 2007 by voyager12

[Vitamin_N]

Are you sure that you are not thinking of a different store? CFT and Sunshine Daydreams are not even in the same building. Also I was just in Sunshine Daydreams last week and they were very much open so I just called them to see if they somehow just shut down and they did not. They asked me to please correct it on this board so that people do not think they are closed because they are very much open.

Ack! My bad. It's not Sunshine Daydreams but that place next to CFT--New Waves of Joy.

Sorry for the mix-up and apologies for any alarm/panic I may have caused.

In other news, the Observer has another piece on the Johnston and Mecklenburg Mills, the gist of which is that the City Council doesn't really know what it wants to do with them:

http://www.charlotte.com/mld/charlotte/new...ws/16371272.htm

[Charlotte_native]

In other news, the Observer has another piece on the Johnston and Mecklenburg Mills, the gist of which is that the City Council doesn't really know what it wants to do with them:

http://www.charlotte.com/mld/charlotte/new...ws/16371272.htm

They really should quit trying to fill the role of the private sector. Elected officials and carreer beauracrats should not even think of anything but selling these, putting money in the public coffers, and moving on. Restrict them maybe for affordable housing, but hopefully they won't try to be too controlling and ruin such a great set of buildings like they already have.

They already lost control of these once to foreclosure - they guy that bought and fixed up Hoskins Mill had these in the same foreclosure -- but the city had the rights to repurchase them and did about 3 years ago. Though I think it is good the same guy didn't keep these and do a marginal job like at Hoskins, at least they wouldn't have fallen into such poor shape.

[TransCorpTech]

Anyone know the reason why units from 28th row aren't selling that well compared to the ones in the heart of NoDa?

Also what's the deal with Steel Gardens? I've been waiting for pricing for the longest time...

[kennethlin]

Anyone know the reason why units from 28th row aren't selling that well compared to the ones in the heart of NoDa?

Also what's the deal with Steel Gardens? I've been waiting for pricing for the longest time...

Uhh, I think you may be mistaken, but 28th Ro is doing VERY WELL. They've, so far, sold 71/92 units for a whopping 77% pre-sales rate before the project even has broken group. That's pretty impressive. As for the other units, they are NOT available for sale yet. 28th Ro is doing these units in phases, due to some builders having issues with selling too many in the beginning to rake in sales, only to see that their profit margins get eaten away due to higher construction costs and under-budgeting. Currently, they are on phase II, as ALL UNITS in phase I has sold out. Expect to see them hold Phase II for some time until they are ALL sold out, due to seasonal and market issues. You can expect the developers at 28th Ro to BUILD to SUIT, meaning the units in Phase I will get built very soon, as they've ALL sold. Until Phase II units and future Phase III and IV gets sold, they will NOT build them all at once. That was announced by the developer himself before this project took place.

As for Steel Gardens, go to www.steelgardens.com/pricing/list.cfm. You will see that just about ALL units that ARE AVAILABLE for sale has been sold. Only a handful of units left are in inventory, and the smaller 1-bd units will become available next. They are selling the LARGEST units first to make their sales goals, and the 1BD units are profits for them, as the builder probably anticipates that there will be more singles and young crowds wanting to buy the 1BD units up fast. I don't think they'll have a problem with those, as the pricing is very good.

So in conclusion, if you are looking to buy, you ought to do it soon, especially in a place like NoDA where property values are creeping higher and higher each year and you are beginning to see some major developments in the area in anticipation to the demand to live closer to Uptown Charlotte and the future-planned light rail system running the NE rail lines.

The only thing that I see that isn't selling well in NoDA are the so-called "risky investors" who think they go in and buy a home in NoDa for $100k and resell in 3 months for $400k against over 50 homes listed "for-sale" in the area currently. I don't know what they are smoking, but I would like some of that if they really think they can triple their profits by renovating projects with local Home Depot and Lowes quality materials. You may actually be better off with a condo in NoDA as opposed to a SFH as, bucking national trends, it seems NoDA's condo market is doing better than the SFH sales market in the area, unless you home is priced $200k or below. I haven't seen ANY homes in NoDA that's sold for over $400-500k yet, except for a select few that had incomparable renovations and/or extravagent additions and restorative work done to it. But give it 3-5 years, you'll see that the area will become another Plaza/Midwood, where homes are rediculously priced in the $200-300/sq. ft. range, similar to Uptown Charlotte.

Edited January 6, 2007 by kennethlin

[TransCorpTech]

Thanks for the info. I was actually looking at the condos at those two particular places but didn't think the time frame was right for me since I want to be in a place by May of this year.

From the 28th row website, http://www.28throw.com/units.htm, it looks like there are still some units available. When speaking to them last year they told me they'd finish by summer of this year but I haven't heard of them even breaking ground yet.

As for Steel Gardens, I haven't heard from them yet either and I've been on their mailing list for the longest time. I'm interested in the 1 bedroom lofts/2B condos.

[Charlotte_native]

As for Steel Gardens, I haven't heard from them yet either and I've been on their mailing list for the longest time. I'm interested in the 1 bedroom lofts/2B condos.

If you aren't getting a response from the sales team just go to any realtor -- they can represent you and you'll pay no more for the unit than if you weren't represented.

[Charlotte_native]

The only thing that I see that isn't selling well in NoDA are the so-called "risky investors" who think they go in and buy a home in NoDa for $100k and resell in 3 months for $400k against over 50 homes listed "for-sale" in the area currently. I don't know what they are smoking, but I would like some of that if they really think they can triple their profits by renovating projects with local Home Depot and Lowes quality materials. You may actually be better off with a condo in NoDA as opposed to a SFH as, bucking national trends, it seems NoDA's condo market is doing better than the SFH sales market in the area, unless you home is priced $200k or below. I haven't seen ANY homes in NoDA that's sold for over $400-500k yet, except for a select few that had incomparable renovations and/or extravagent additions and restorative work done to it. But give it 3-5 years, you'll see that the area will become another Plaza/Midwood, where homes are rediculously priced in the $200-300/sq. ft. range, similar to Uptown Charlotte.

There has been one sale over $400,000 in NoDa at $410,000. There are two properties pending $444,000 and $435,000 and 5 listed over $400,000 (one is listed at $563,000 -- you are right, what are they smoking). There are actually only 24 homes listed in NoDa right now (total) when you take out the other 6 that are actually in surrounding neighborhoods that their agents are trying to pass off as NoDa. I agree with you about quality (HGTV and Home Depot specials) and speculative renovations in the 'hood -- just wanted to get some accurate stats out about pricing there. There are still homes under $200,000 in NoDa by the way.

[uptownliving]

Construction on Steel Gardens started a few months ago. I went by there last week and phase 1 is pretty much topped out. They have also grade the site and put in the internal road network.

[kennethlin]

There has been one sale over $400,000 in NoDa at $410,000. There are two properties pending $444,000 and $435,000 and 5 listed over $400,000 (one is listed at $563,000 -- you are right, what are they smoking). There are actually only 24 homes listed in NoDa right now (total) when you take out the other 6 that are actually in surrounding neighborhoods that their agents are trying to pass off as NoDa. I agree with you about quality (HGTV and Home Depot specials) and speculative renovations in the 'hood -- just wanted to get some accurate stats out about pricing there. There are still homes under $200,000 in NoDa by the way.

Yes, you are correct in that the homes you mentioned are pending or have sold. BUT you have to put them in perspective too. Those homes are ACTUALLY WORTH paying the price for. I'm not saying that EVERY investor cheapens their homes with low budget materials, but it seems like many do. I was lucky enough to get a nicely renovated 3 story home right in NoDA off of Charles and Pinckney last year for $125/sq. ft. While I agree that pricing in the area has skyrocketed in NoDA ( I believe the average sales price/sq. ft in the area is in the $180/sq. ft range now), there are TOO many people that think they can come in an area like NoDA and buy a run-down house, while borrowing a construction loan and put only $50k-$80k and expect to resale at $375k-$400k.

I think what really put it into perspective was when I read that Observer article about a month ago, on the front cover page, where they were mentioning investors making a KILLING by buying in areas like NoDA. They even showed a guy that supposedly ONLY buys $100k homes and resales at $300k+, and he owns two houses on Charles that have YET to be sold, and I don't anticipate him being able to for the price and quality of work he's put in. Then the article mentioned that he's a SELF MADE MULTI-MILLIONAIRE now at only age 32 by flipping homes. They even gave a more vivid example of a house he bought for $70k, and he put $60k into it, and resold it after 3 years of renovations for $179k. Honestly, you mean to tell me that for $130k and having to pay the mortgage for 3 years and interest/taxes/insurance, that he DID WELL? Oh, let's not forget the agent fees for the listing of the property. Subtract 5% minimum there, and what do you have left? Chump change. I'm afraid that the Observers' portrayal of these speculative investors is ONLY going to add fuel to the fire of mortgage deliquencies and depressed home values.

You are right again in that you can still buy homes in NoDA for $200k, but look at what you can get now for that price vs. just even a couple of years back. Not saying I'm complaining, as certainly, it looks good for my property value, but to say that I can only get a 1000-1200 sq. ft. home that is not the best of shape for $200k is pretty high up there already. Then, if I want a nicely remodeled home, I"d have to pay in excess of $300k. Luckily, I got in on the area a year back and I don't have to do anything to the home I got.

[Vitamin_N]

Gateway Homes has a new rezoning application for the 22-acre truck yard off of Brevard; it says they want to build up to 620 units of multi-family.

http://www.charmeck.org/Departments/Planni...ns/2007-046.htm

[atlrvr]

Including a 10-story building.....I wonder how the neighborhood will respond to that. It is set back off of Davidson a bit, so perhaps it won't be much of an issue.

[dubone]

It is behind the easternmost set of tracks behind Highland Mill and the Y. I think most barely think of that section as part of the neighborhood, so I can't image them minding some height with valuable condominiums.

Frankly, I think more population is what NoDa needs to get more activity on Davidson St. There are a lot of times where it is quite sleepy.

[AuLukey]

I agree dub, this area is attempting to revitalize itself, but it is first going to need the population to back this up. Having a low rise tower in NoDa shouldn't be a huge issue as long as it is designed with the neighborhood in mind. I'd really like to see a few more taller structures in Northern Charlotte sprouting up over the next few years to help balance out SouthPark.

[Justadude]

I would think that area, like Plaza-Midwood, would be a good place for some innovative architecture.

[voyager12]

I am grateful that most of the developers in this area have been relatively sensitive to the NoDa's artistic heritage. Here's to hoping this project will also be mindful of it's surroundings and not stick some sterile Bytneish condo in there.

[uptownliving]

Fat City Lofts got its Building Permits issued yesterday. Expect to see construction start soon.

[New Name]

Fat City Lofts got its Building Permits issued yesterday. Expect to see construction start soon.

I'm amazed by how artist's architectural renderings take so many liberties. C'mon people, is Davidson St even close to that wide or clean?

[Justadude]

Maybe not that wide, but it will be sparkling-clean after a few more years of gentrification.

[dubone]

It IS that wide. It is 24 feet wide at the narrow point at the bulb outs on the corner with the cross walk. It is then widens to about 40 feet behind the street parking.

http://local.live.com/default.aspx?v=2&amp...0&alt=-1000

The cleanliness is a whole other matter . I'm not sure the developer would be too happy if Risden threw in a few homeless guys, litter, and a hippy drum circle. All three would be accurate for NoDa (or 'Historic North Charlotte's North Davidson Arts District' for you abbrevationophobes ).

[voyager12]

The Gallery Crawl last night was very well attended. There was a good crowd later into the evening and it's just nice to see the neighborhood's sidewalks fill with people and life. Hopefully the new developments coming along with help to transistion this vibe into a more constant flow on a daily basis day and night.

[Charlotte_native]

The Gallery Crawl last night was very well attended. There was a good crowd later into the evening and it's just nice to see the neighborhood's sidewalks fill with people and life. Hopefully the new developments coming along with help to transistion this vibe into a more constant flow on a daily basis day and night.

There are two mill homes on N. Davidson across from Highland Mill that are having plans drawn up to be converted to galleries. Their rear lots will also be built out to accomodate outdoor art, sculpture, and parties similar to some of the events that took place behind Fat City in its heyday. Hopefully this will re-eliven some of the fell that NoDa has lost and bring back larger crawls. Look for openings late Spring. These will be galleries for local artists and will likely have some affiliation with small arts groups in the area.

[sleightofhand]

Anyone have any recommendations for purchasing in Noda?

Since I work in real estate a friend asked for my help taking a look at the different projects going on in Noda. I know very little about Noda so I just read all 25 pages of this thread and even called several of the offices of the different projects.

From what I can gather 28th Row, Steel Gardens, and Fat City Lofts look to be ok.

Any thoughts would be appreciated.

[sleightofhand]

I went by and checked out Steel Gardens yesterday. I must say I was very impressed. The standards they have for their townhomes are pretty highend and what upgrades they do offer aren't too expensive. For someone who is used to uptown prices it's hard for me to get over how affordable those places are. I beleive they told me their prices are at $147 a square foot. They're condos are going to be released as soon as next month. They'll be starting in the mid $150's.

Today I'm going to check out 28th Row and Fat City Lofts.