NoDa (N Davidson St Arts District) Projects

[rjp212]

^^ Thanks.  Couldn't get the photo to upload for some reason.

[Rufus]

Liking the artwork along the podium.  Makes it way more attractive.  Hopefully they'll get local artists to do the painting. 

[archiham04]

so much better guys. Way to go Noda. 

[go_vertical]

^^Freaking love it.

Liking the artwork along the podium.  Makes it way more attractive.  Hopefully they'll get local artists to do the painting.

Considering this is going in NoDa I think the developers would be drawn and quartered if they didn't go with a local artist.

[archiham04]

This technique of adding artwork to make bad buildings better is discussed here:

http://www.urbanplanet.org/forums/index.php/topic/45016-southend-midrise-projects/?p=1366105

Edited June 25, 2015 by archiham04

[Guest]

Main street Noda is by far the coolest locale of the city Iv'e looked at so far. I see great things in it's future but I hope the community will strive for slower, incremental development. So far its.... cram as many units as possible.

 

Is it financially impossible for developers to make smaller investments on smaller plots instead of taking up entire blocks?

[DEnd]

Is it financially impossible for developers to make smaller investments on smaller plots instead of taking up entire blocks?

Basically yes. It's really more a matter of real estate being too costly for small projects. Small projects require a larger percentage of outside walls per sqft of floor space, they don't take advantage of scale for management costs, etc... For these and other reasons the major financial backers for real estate just aren't interested in doing small.

[UrbanGossip]

200-300 units is the sweet spot for apartments in this market for the reasons DEnd said. When retail is introduced it can shake that up a bit if it's a strong market and location for retail, but typically a developer will need the residential portion to stand on its own financially. Financial structures of the two are very different long term so using one to bolster the other is a risky and bad idea.

[Guest]

I'm looking at the small developers, builders page on Facebook and it seems it's very possible. Rent has to be pretty high though.

[atlrvr]

^ There-in lies the problem.  Small projects mean they don't have the majority of the items listed: pools, gyms, "chef demonstration kitchen", lounges, conf rooms, on-site maintenence techs, covered parking.  So, really, how do you market this?  "We, ummm, offer less, and need to charge you more, so, um...RENT HERE, because I care about developing small apartments."  I think this work for apartments, only where the land costs/acre are very low, given a somewhat out of the way location, or there is no possiblity for bigger assemlages.

 

Now, for condos, it might work a bit better, because a buyer (sometimes) cares more about relative privacy, than a full on social explosion.

[archiham04]

Which brings me back to my "form based retail" requirement... Instead of requiring a developer to include "retail" which may not be financially feasible...  I propose we require developers to build the first floor to standards that are conducive to future retail upfit.  My list includes:

1. Sidewalk level access to the space.
2. 30 foot column spacing
3. 16 foot clear to structure
4. Rear service access.

If they want to put little loft apartments in these spaces fine.  but at least one day a John's Country Kitchen, a Soul, a Nova's, or a Hall's Clocks could move in.

[Guest]

Yet some of the smaller shops are doing fine... so it's not like small scale is impossible. I haven't started to number crunching yet so I gotta get that done first but seriously, there's a few spots left in this city where you don't have to build +5 story condo piece of crap to make an honest dollar.

[archiham04]

Smaller shops are fine.  but let me tell you.  the stick built apartments that are being built on the street level have about 10 feet MAX clear between the walls and are cut up into tiny rooms.  There is no possibility of removing or changing walls.... that is the definition of "stick built"  the sticks (walls) hold it up.

[southslider]

Stick atop podium can have ground-floor retail. But then, the added construction cost usually means higher rent per square foot. Add parking deck driveways, emergency egress doors, and a leasing/management office for a 200-plus-unit development, then the pedestrian-propulsion of seamless street-level activity suffers. And no small business wants higher rent for less foot traffic.

[archiham04]

^yes you are right.  a poorly designed podium project can be a block killer.  Let's not build them bad.

[Guest]

On a side question, was there a required setback for the building? Looks like it was forced 10 feet from the street. Not sure if that makes any difference in how ugly it is.

[rjp212]

Fairly major development.  Crescent is seeking to rezone the property between N. Tryon, Craighead and N. Davidson for a mixed use development to include single family, multi family and retail.

 

http://ww.charmeck.org/Planning/Rezoning/2015/090-106/2015-095%20site%20plan.pdf

[Guest]

Fairly major development.  Crescent is seeking to rezone the property between N. Tryon, Craighead and N. Davidson for a mixed use development to include single family, multi family and retail.

 

http://ww.charmeck.org/Planning/Rezoning/2015/090-106/2015-095%20site%20plan.pdf

Holy crap, thats very very huge for the area. Crescent is making very big waves.

[RaleighHeelsfan]

What type of height are we looking at with this development?

[tozmervo]

Relatively unrestricted, depending on how close it is to the R zones (there is some distance from R zones that triggers restrictions). Proximity to Bernard Avenue will keep it a little lower.

[rjp212]

Fairly major development.  Crescent is seeking to rezone the property between N. Tryon, Craighead and N. Davidson for a mixed use development to include single family, multi family and retail.

 

http://ww.charmeck.org/Planning/Rezoning/2015/090-106/2015-095%20site%20plan.pdf

 

The CO just posted about it too.  http://www.charlotteobserver.com/news/business/biz-columns-blogs/development/article26677930.html

[atlrvr]

This is going to be no more than 5 stories.  No way.  Land cost way too cheap to justify high-rise here.

[DEnd]

This is going to be no more than 5 stories.  No way.  Land cost way too cheap to justify high-rise here.

 

 

The is no bottom limit to justifying high rises, there is an upper limit for justifying low rises however.  That said I agree with you, 36th street station is aiming for 80 feet (6ish stories), no way are they going higher than their marque project in the neighborhood. 

[Third Strike]

I hope this development leads to changes across the street. The industrial area facing this development is a huge eyesore, but prime real estate, since it's right next to the rail lines and light rail station. I also like how the growth of NoDa is finally spilling over unto the north side of the tracks.

[kermit]

^ I dunno, somebody just spent a giant pile of money to redo the rail spur leading to the scrap yard and concrete plant so I don't think they are looking to sell yet.