Columbia Economic Notes

[goodbye]

Great shots, waccamatt! Nice to see so much residential development in progress or just complete.

I especially love the new First Citizens building at night! Imagine if they had stacked the two sections...

[krazeeboi]

^It would be 15 stories by my count. Not enough to make a new tallest, but it would make a better impression within the skyline. I do like it's classic look, however.

[waccamatt]

Great shots, waccamatt! Nice to see so much residential development in progress or just complete.

I especially love the new First Citizens building at night! Imagine if they had stacked the two sections...

I totally agree, Sky. IMHO, bigger (or taller in this case) is better!

[superjack]

I am very pleased to see all of these projects coming along. With all the residential growth and development in DT Columbia, it seems only natural that a new office (or mixed-use) tower should pop up pretty soon. We need something 400 feet or more! I'm really tired of the SouthTrust building being the "ambassador" building of Columbia's skyline. We need something original, much bigger, and more beautiful as the center piece. It would do so much for encouraging the overall progress of Columbia.

[krazeeboi]

I predict that within 3 years, a new tallest will be proposed for Columbia.

[tablrock]

I predict that within 3 years, a new tallest will be proposed for Columbia.

that would be nice!!

[803metlife]

Have anybody heard the rumor that a cheesecake factory is coming to sandhills?

[Mr.Marc]

Have anybody heard the rumor that a cheesecake factory is coming to sandhills?

Haven't heard that, but it would be nice to have one somewhere in Columbia.

Downtown would be my pick though.

[GMoxley]

The annexation chief must be doing a good job...Thestate in a article yesterday said the city annexed over 400 acres in 2005 and more than 100 acres this year so far. So now the city is about 132 square miles

That's really NOT that good. A square mile is 640 acres...so, in the past 2 years Columbia hasn't even annexed 1 whole square mile of property into the city. But still, out size is not that bad, except for the fact the we have an Army base that takes up more than have of the city land. What we need to work on is density, its a weak 928 persons per square mile.

Just to put everything in comparison, these are the stats some of our bigger neighbors. (Source: Wikipedia)

Charlotte - 280.5 square miles / 2232 per square mile (density)

Atlanta - 132.4 square miles / 3162 per square mile (density)

I know density calculations for Columbia can be difficult since Fort Jackson does not contribute much to the size of the city. Also, I don't know whether or not Fort Jackson's population is counted in the census data for Columbia. So, heres my attempt at adjusting the stats.

Population of Columbia: 120,000 (est.)

Fort Jackson Land Area: 81.25 square miles

Land Area of Columbia without FJ: 50.75

First assumption - Fort Jackson contributes no people to Columbia's population as counted in the census.

120,000/50.75 = 2364 persons per square mile for Columbia [NOT BAD!]

Opposite Assumption - Fort Jackson population is counted in Columbia population.

The population of FJ is 13600.

120000-13600 = 106400

106400/50.75=2096 persons per square mile

Let me know if my math is wrong. But if I am right...either way, we're not that for behind Charlotte.

[krazeeboi]

I hope the Greenville forumers don't discover this thread.

[waccamatt]

I hope the Greenville forumers don't discover this thread.

I know, they have their heads buried in the sand regarding the relevance of having 2/3 of the city's area undevelopable.

[superjack]

I know, they have their heads buried in the sand regarding the relevance of having 2/3 of the city's area undevelopable.

Matt, what exactly do you mean by this? Just curious.

[waccamatt]

Matt, what exactly do you mean by this? Just curious.

Krazee and I were referring to the fact that some Greenville forumers think it is irrelevant regarding density and population that 84 of Columbia's 130 or so square miles is the undevelopable area of Fort Jackson.

Edited March 2, 2006 by waccamatt

[superjack]

Krazee and I were referring to the fact that some Greenville forumers think it is irrelevant regarding density and population that 84 of Columbia's 130 or so square miles is the undevelopable area of Fort Jackson.

Gotcha! Yeah, what a shame. I hate to see something like that skew the numbers for Columbia. Columbia's city population is also somewhat hindered by the fact that virtually everything across the Congaree river is in Lexington County (cities of Cayce & W. Columbia) and will never be annexed by the city. I've always felt that the city population of Columbia doesn't accurately capture its "size." If you subtracted Fort Jackson and added Forest Acres and the eastern portions of West Columbia and Cayce, Columbia would appear MUCH larger -- and rightfully so. Without consulting the census, one may survey Columbia for a week or so and determine that its city population "feels" like 200,000 plus. I, for one, think that Columbia feels awefully large for the meek 116,000 that is reported in the census, and I drive all around in the city nearly every day.

[The_sandlapper]

Actully Clums pop now is about 121,000 with a 2010 projection of about 125,000. But your right that number doesn't accurately reflect the size of Cola. its the 4th largest UA in the Carolinas behind CLT 750K, Ral 500K, Charles 425K, aand Clum at 423K.

Edited March 2, 2006 by The_sandlapper

[waccamatt]

The urbanized area population is a much better indication of a city's true size.

[digital_sandlapper]

I recently caught up on this string by reading all 35 pages . .

It was worth it, though--I'm so excited to live in Columbia! . . and at this moment in time, especially!

A couple of recent developments were not mentioned: the razing of Carolina Plaza, and the news of the baseball stadium on the river, two great things!

A couple of things Columbia needs more of, IMO:

1) small parks/plazas

The city should take the time NOW, before too late, to plan where more small green urban parks are needed, buy the land, and build them. The Vista is in SERIOUS need of these outdoor gathering spots. The extensive greenway along the river will be wonderful, but big, OPEN grassy areas are utterly lacking within walking distance of one another in Columbia. Sure, we have the State House grounds, but activity there is limited, of course. Finley Park, is impressive--but too vertical and chock-full of ornamental plantings--not much room to throw the ball or have a romantic picnic on the grass under a shade tree. Savannah has its crown jewels, the squares . . as well as Forsyth Park--the model urban park. Charleston has Marion Square, the Battery, Washington Square, and Hampton Park, but needs more small ones in between. Some would say that property is too valuable to be used in this way. I say, even small parks will increase nearby properties' values dramatically. Odd-sized lots too small for buildings would work perfectly. A European-style plaza would be a welcome addition to a monumental building in the Vista or elsewhere. Perhaps USC will include some of these in Innovista?

2) boulevards

Assembly and Elmwood, particularly are BEGGING to be beautiful boulevards! The center should be a median of shade trees, along with shade trees on each side, benches, grass and flower beds. Again, Savannah is a model--just venture down Liberty or Oglethorpe Streets. Of course, Columbia's versions would be even grander, wider, with at least four lanes. The utilities would be buried, walkability would be drastically improved, and traffic slowed. The gateway into the city on Elmwood, with a long vista of the Bull Street development at its terminus would be particulary enhanced. Have you sat at the light at Assembly and Blossom lately? What a harsh, mean, paved-over environment! Now, imagine it as a shady boulevard . . nice, huh? USC would probably benefit from this, as their new campus grows south of Assembly, for safety's sake if nothing else. Crosswalks would be very attractie and safe in a boulevard setting. Development would boom even more, as well!

Who do we send these suggestions to for them to be taken seriously? The Mayor? The state DOT?

I think I'll start a new topic . .

[CorgiMatt]

I recently caught up on this string by reading all 35 pages . .

It was worth it, though--I'm so excited to live in Columbia! . . and at this moment in time, especially!

A couple of recent developments were not mentioned: the razing of Carolina Plaza, and the news of the baseball stadium on the river, two great things!

A couple of things Columbia needs more of, IMO:

1) small parks/plazas

The city should take the time NOW, before too late, to plan where more small green urban parks are needed, buy the land, and build them. The Vista is in SERIOUS need of these outdoor gathering spots. The extensive greenway along the river will be wonderful, but big, OPEN grassy areas are utterly lacking within walking distance of one another in Columbia. Sure, we have the State House grounds, but activity there is limited, of course. Finley Park, is impressive--but too vertical and chock-full of ornamental plantings--not much room to throw the ball or have a romantic picnic on the grass under a shade tree. Savannah has its crown jewels, the squares . . as well as Forsyth Park--the model urban park. Charleston has Marion Square, the Battery, Washington Square, and Hampton Park, but needs more small ones in between. Some would say that property is too valuable to be used in this way. I say, even small parks will increase nearby properties' values dramatically. Odd-sized lots too small for buildings would work perfectly. A European-style plaza would be a welcome addition to a monumental building in the Vista or elsewhere. Perhaps USC will include some of these in Innovista?

2) boulevards

Assembly and Elmwood, particularly are BEGGING to be beautiful boulevards! The center should be a median of shade trees, along with shade trees on each side, benches, grass and flower beds. Again, Savannah is a model--just venture down Liberty or Oglethorpe Streets. Of course, Columbia's versions would be even grander, wider, with at least four lanes. The utilities would be buried, walkability would be drastically improved, and traffic slowed. The gateway into the city on Elmwood, with a long vista of the Bull Street development at its terminus would be particulary enhanced. Have you sat at the light at Assembly and Blossom lately? What a harsh, mean, paved-over environment! Now, imagine it as a shady boulevard . . nice, huh? USC would probably benefit from this, as their new campus grows south of Assembly, for safety's sake if nothing else. Crosswalks would be very attractie and safe in a boulevard setting. Development would boom even more, as well!

Who do we send these suggestions to for them to be taken seriously? The Mayor? The state DOT?

I think I'll start a new topic . .

First Citizens' Bank's plan includes an urban park on the Corner of Main and Lady. And beside the new building they are finishing up a large plaza. It has tons of trees. Also, next to the Tapps building they have put in a tiny plaza. They planted trees in it and will probably put in some benches.

[digital_sandlapper]

Everyone, just wanted to let you know I started a new topic on my earlier idea for more small parks, plazas, and boulevards. It's called "The Greening of Columbia". Please visit and comment if interested, and we'll just discuss it there from now on . .

P.S. I also found out that Waccamat had already started this dialogue last summer, and his ideas are linked in the above topic string. His vision is a "must-read"!

[emerging.me]

Heard rumblings today about *another* new hotel being proposed for the Vista. A site is being looked at. Don't have any details and couldn't give them if I did, but has anyone else heard anything? Did I miss some news?

[krazeeboi]

I'm sure Spartan will be pleased with this news. I wonder what brand it will be?

I think that the convention center should be expanded, especially with these new hotels coming downtown. I mean, 145,000 sq ft is a bit paltry when compared with convention centers of other cities of comparable size. But I also realize that perhaps city/county leaders wanted to test the waters first. I think something around 200,000 or 250,000 sq ft is in order.

[waccamatt]

I'm sure Spartan will be pleased with this news. I wonder what brand it will be?

I think that the convention center should be expanded, especially with these new hotels coming downtown. I mean, 145,000 sq ft is a bit paltry when compared with convention centers of other cities of comparable size. But I also realize that perhaps city/county leaders wanted to test the waters first. I think something around 200,000 or 250,000 sq ft is in order.

I agree, it is in definite need of expansion; with its location next to the Colonial Center it could become a popular center.

[smithc57]

How is everyone doing. I'm new to this and I enjoyed reading through all 35 pages of this discussion. It is really beneficial and interesting. I learned alot and saw that many agreed with my hopes for the city of Columbia, SC.

I really felt that Interstate 126 should have went through Elmwood and connected to Highway 277. This would have provided commuters two ways to get from Downtown to Northeast area. Interstate 20 is way to packed. Hopefully the idea may be reconsidered or a new one will be established. I would also like to see another office building. I do feel that the city is doing well with the developments. Hopefully the new Walmart will increase business for the Bush River area but it will also increase traffic; which is already a battle at times.

I also feel that the city should consider anexing the northeast area. I live in this area and developments are popping up all over the place. I could see the city widening I-20 near the clemson road in order to make traffic run smoother. Right now it is only two lanes.

Too bad that they are probably going to demolish the Carolina Colesium. I graduated in that place. Hopefully something replaces it that is very nice.

I lived in this city ever since I was 5 and I rather be no other place. I am now in college in Rock Hill and the Metro Charlotte area is booming. Do you think counties like Newberry, Sumter, and Orangeburg will be added to the Columbia MSA?

[The_sandlapper]

Newberry for sure its already in the Columbia CSA, Sumter and Orangeburg are possibilities as well. The south is growing at an alarming rate and as many of the major cities beocme overcrowded people are gonna be looking to settle in bedroom cities 30-45mins of the metro.

[smithc57]

Concerning population issues there is no probability of how the Columbia population will grow. During one decade the population increased by 20,000. Charlotte's population increased by 40,000 between 2000 and 2005. Between the years of 1970 and 1980 the Atlanta population decreased by 72,000 people. Columbia seems to have a population more than 121,000. I guess the college populations of USC, Benedict, Allen, Midlands Tech, and commuters contribute to this point of view. Lets make Columbia the best it can be.