Crabtree Valley Mall

[NCMike1981]

it's all new suburban stuff out there now....and an ancient K-Mart in the middle of it all....

Edited November 22, 2005 by NCMike1981

[DigitalSky]

That Kmart looks soo out of place there

[urbanesq]

That Kmart looks soo out of place there

...and will no doubt be redeveloped in the relatively near future into a SuperMax-BigBox-Plus.

The reason it wasn't built in a "nicer looking" area is precisely that it was built at the intersection of 540 and 1. We all drive cars, and so traffic volume is about the only consideration. Who cares what the area looks like as long as people can pull into the parking lot directly off the freeway. Besides, the location has sparked exactly the kind of development that makes a few people very very rich. 100% success, right?

[NCMike1981]

Give that area about 10 years and it will probably look like the area closer to 440 on Capital...

[Rufus]

Has anyone seen the new layout of Belk at Crabtree. It seems to have gone veru upscale. They now have St. John, Lacoste, Boss, Polo, Kate Spade, Oscar de La Renta, Sigrid Olsen, Cole Haan, Kenneth Cole, and not to mention many other high-fashion boutiques. Does anyone know why a good middle class department store would change itself into high fashion? It might just be that that department store is one of the busiest, just like the flagship at SouthPark Mall in Charlotte.

[ncwebguy]

Triangle Town Center feels like it was created on the of "build it and they will come", but so far, they haven't. Things may pick up when 540 makes it to 64, so residents in the eastern suburbs of Knightdale, Zebulon, Wendell, etc. will join the Wakefield, Wake Forest, Lousiburg, etc. residents already there. In the meantime, it is a the nicest indoor walking track in the area LOL.

It seems the "Commons" concept would have worked better if it tied the mall to Poynter place's "lake" or

maybe was an extension of the lower level food court, since that area seems to generate the most foot traffic. Making the Chilis and/or Macaroni Grill as part of the Commons could have increased foot traffic there too, but that didn't happen either. They were building a Dicks at Southpark in charlotte last time i was there, but not sure how well it's doing.

If they were smart, TTC would *beg* Urban Outfitters to put a store in place of Pier 1 kids or Swoozies. It would be the first in the triangle and could pull the fashion queen teens from Crabtree, but I don't see that ever happening.

They wanted to make a lot of money off as few customers as possible -- Saks, Twisted Fork, Teds, Orvis, etc. but seem to have seen the error of their ways with the arrival of the Gap suite of stores next year.

[StevenRocks]

Has anyone seen the new layout of Belk at Crabtree. It seems to have gone veru upscale. They now have St. John, Lacoste, Boss, Polo, Kate Spade, Oscar de La Renta, Sigrid Olsen, Cole Haan, Kenneth Cole, and not to mention many other high-fashion boutiques. Does anyone know why a good middle class department store would change itself into high fashion? It might just be that that department store is one of the busiest, just like the flagship at SouthPark Mall in Charlotte.

Most of that stuff has been there for years. Hudson Belk has been quite upscale for a while, but the previous store layout hid a lot of these things. It's no Belk SouthPark, but it's pretty much equal in all but the highest high-end brands. It

[Damien]

That Belk was way overdue for a remodel. It was so cramped in there while the process was underway though. I can't say I will miss the cafeteria. There food was mediocre at best, and the people that worked in there usually seemed p*ssed off about something.

[StevenRocks]

That Belk was way overdue for a remodel. It was so cramped in there while the process was underway though. I can't say I will miss the cafeteria. There food was mediocre at best, and the people that worked in there usually seemed p*ssed off about something.

What I've wondered is why they won't actually give the place a full and needed remodel. It's always been piecemeal. Some parts of that store's interior are exactly the same as they were in 1980 or earlier, while other parts have been redone three or four times. They've done a decent job trying to blend every thing together, but it's still ragged around the edges. They'd never have Belk SouthPark looking like that.

I wasn't a fan of The Capital Room's food, but it was pleasant enough, and the interior was both nice and kind of a time-warp. One thing I'll never figure out is why the first server I ran into on my last time there was a lady with no teeth. Now I'm not saying that she should be ashamed of having no teeth, and she was really nice, but its definately not the first human image I'd want associated with my cafeteria.

[JunktionFET]

Hudson Belk at Cary Towne Center had a little cafe that was installed when they remodeled the second floor into shopping space. I have no idea if it is still there because honestly I haven't been on Belk's second floor in about 10 years. However I do remember having a burger there shortly after the remodel was complete--I was in my early or mid teens I believe. The food seemed alright and the staff was decent.

I cannot recall if I ever had food from Crabtree's cafeteria. I think I recall an eatery of some sort in the store, but I cannot cite any details.

[StevenRocks]

The Cary Hudson Belk is still a pretty good-looking store. I think they last remodeled it in 1991 and it's holding up pretty well, though I can't remember if the restaurant is still there.

Actually, I don't know if Belk has any restaurants left in-store beyond the occasional coffee bar and Arthur's at Belk SouthPark.

[JunktionFET]

I wonder if Belk will bring back the cafes in the future? With Federated as well as other names entering this market, I would think Belk may want to bulk up their high-end image to put them above the rest, and an in-store eatery is certainly a novel thing to have nowadays.

I realize this is hardly an appropriate comparison, but Macys at Herald Square (NYC) has a rather impressive selection of food. Then again, with like 9 HUGE levels of shopping, serving food does make a lot of sense.

[StevenRocks]

Macy's at Herald Square is a fair comparasin, even though their store is a lot bigger and fancier.

Macy's has integrated a wide variety of merchandise and food options into their store and it makes it a more interesting shopping experience. Belk could be doing more than they are on that front, especially at large stores like Crabtree's

[StevenRocks]

Macy's at Herald Square is a fair comparasin, even though their store is a lot bigger and fancier.

Macy's has integrated a wide variety of merchandise and food options into their store and it makes it a more interesting shopping experience. Belk could be doing more than they are on that front, especially at large stores like Crabtree's

[csedwards72]

If Crabtree's Belk is the highest-performing Belk, and SouthPark is #2, what are the others in the top 5 (or where do you get this kind of information? I find it really interesting). Thanks.

[StevenRocks]

If Crabtree's Belk is the highest-performing Belk, and SouthPark is #2, what are the others in the top 5 (or where do you get this kind of information? I find it really interesting). Thanks.

I no longer have a source inside the Belk organization, but I do know that Hanes Mall (Winston-Salem), Haywood Mall (Greenville), and The Avenues (Jacksonville) are high-volume stores.

[csedwards72]

I no longer have a source inside the Belk organization, but I do know that Hanes Mall (Winston-Salem), Haywood Mall (Greenville), and The Avenues (Jacksonville) are high-volume stores.

Thanks for the info. Do you know which Belks are the worst-performing? I'd think that Richland Mall in Columbia and maybe Eastland Mall in Charlotte are among those.

Also, which other department stores in the Southeast do particularly well? I'd say the Macy's at Lenox Square must be up there.

[DigitalSky]

Also, which other department stores in the Southeast do particularly well? I'd say the Macy's at Lenox Square must be up there.

I think in terms of JC Penney, North Hills, Cross Creek, Four Seasons and Hanes do really well.

For Belk's worst stores - Eastland possibly, i'm not sure about that though.

[StevenRocks]

Thanks for the info. Do you know which Belks are the worst-performing? I'd think that Richland Mall in Columbia and maybe Eastland Mall in Charlotte are among those.

Also, which other department stores in the Southeast do particularly well? I'd say the Macy's at Lenox Square must be up there.

Among the larger Belk stores, Eastland (Charlotte), Richland Mall (Columbia), Tanglewood Mall (Roanoke), Four Seasons (Greensboro), Regency Square (Jacksonville) and Oak Hollow Mall (High Point) are a little weaker than the rest of the pack. But none of those stores is underperforming to my knowledge, they're just not top performers. Most of the truly troubled large Belks have been divested over the last 10 years or so. Most of Belk's smaller stores have good sales per squre foot.

Among other Southeastern department stores, McRae's and Parisian tend to do well in the larger cities, Proffit's owns East Tennessee, Dillard's rules a lot of midsized markets, and Macy's is strong at Lenox, Riverchase, Perimeter, Aventura and Dadeland malls.

[perrykat]

Any more news on Crabtree? When is Lord and Taylor leaving?

I think a nice addition would be Dillard's; the closest one is at the Cary mall and Triangle Town Center. The area could certainly use one after the North Hills location closing.

[NCMike1981]

I think the going out of business sales are supposed to start at Lord & Taylor shortly after Christmas. They'll probably be out of the mall by early February. I haven't heard any new news about a new anchor, aside from the Bloomingdale rumor that was in the paper a while back. I predict the space will be split up for small tenants....

[StevenRocks]

Lord & Taylor's lease is up at the end of January.

[dmccall]

I think Dillard's is a ho-hum, non-destination store. I think if Crabtree really wanted Dillard's, the deal would have been done a long time ago. Crabtree needs (and knows this) that they need an anchor that one-ups the other malls in this market. A Dillard's would simply match, not exceed, what Southpoint and TTC are doing.

[richthofen]

I don't see Dillard's as a logical tenant at Crabtree. What differentiates them from Belk and Hecht's? In my experience, those stores are very similar. Maybe Dillard's is a *tiny* bit more upscale?

[DigitalSky]

I don't see Dillard's as a logical tenant at Crabtree. What differentiates them from Belk and Hecht's? In my experience, those stores are very similar. Maybe Dillard's is a *tiny* bit more upscale?

I think some people might see it as logical since the 2 other malls in Raleigh have Belk, Hecht's and Dillard's co-existing... but I agree, it'd be better to see something unique like L&T instead of another duplicate store