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Research Triangle Park (RTP) & the Triangle Biotech Cluster


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The Triangle area is viewed commercial real estate firm Savills as one of the top 20 science hubs in the WORLD.  Actually coming in #8 worldwide!  Savills | Report: Science Cities – 2021

Not tired of winning these type of projects yet.  201 jobs avg salary $102,000 coming to RTP from Beam Therapeutics. https://www.wraltechwire.com/2020/08/11/boston-based-beam-therapeutics-to-buil

I've been following econ development in NC since the early '90's and what's happening in RDU right now is absolutely remarkable.

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Interestingly, a house just went up for sale on my street, and the first two families that looked at it are moving from the Bay Area.  Needless to say, $750,000 goes MUCH farther in NC than it does in California.

While I love California, this would be a rather easy choice IMO.  In fact, considering the massive cost differential between The Triangle and the big tech centers (CA, NYC, Boston, and Seattle), I think that we’re at the tip of the iceberg, and tech jobs will mushroom in the Triangle.

 

Chapel Hill

1 St James Place, Chapel Hill, NC 27514| Little Hill| MLS# 2373835 (trianglerealestatejournal.com)

1118 Burning Tree Drive, Chapel Hill, NC 27517| The Oaks| MLS# 2372586 (trianglerealestatejournal.com)

102 Yukon Lane, Chapel Hill, NC 27514| Chandler Green| MLS# 2363525 (trianglerealestatejournal.com)

612 Arlington Street, Chapel Hill, NC 27514| Pine Knob| MLS# 2373536 (trianglerealestatejournal.com)

Mountainview, Ca

Mountain View, Santa Clara County, CA Real Estate - Mountain View Homes for Sale | realtor.com®

Mountain View, Santa Clara County, CA Real Estate - Mountain View Homes for Sale | realtor.com®

Mountain View, Santa Clara County, CA Real Estate - Mountain View Homes for Sale | realtor.com®

Mountain View, Santa Clara County, CA Real Estate - Mountain View Homes for Sale | realtor.com®

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Californians are moving to NC in record numbers.  It used to be somewhat unusual to see a California tag in Charlotte for example but now it is not.  and the Triangle with its tech and biopharma has always been a hotspot of Californians.  They are fleeing high housing costs, high taxes among a few of their problems and they are heading east.    Some companies are moving lock stock and barrel to NC including several to the Asheville area.  

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On 3/28/2021 at 9:37 PM, KJHburg said:

Californians are moving to NC in record numbers.  It used to be somewhat unusual to see a California tag in Charlotte for example but now it is not.  and the Triangle with its tech and biopharma has always been a hotspot of Californians.  They are fleeing high housing costs, high taxes among a few of their problems and they are heading east.    Some companies are moving lock stock and barrel to NC including several to the Asheville area.  

Californians used to go to Dallas to flee the high costs, but Dallas has grown so much that it’s now expensive compared to  NC and has A LOT of insane traffic.  

The same is true with Atlanta.  While the cost of living is still low, the traffic is insane .

 NC offers a better QoL than Dallas or Atlanta.

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1 hour ago, rolly said:

As Californians (and New Yorkers, etc) flee their highly regulated and taxed states, will they vote for the exact same in their new states?

I doubt it.  The New Yorkers that flee are largely the lower level/middle class  ones that couldn’t make it in the Big Apple, and they don’t support super liberal causes and absurd taxes that fund them.

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18 hours ago, SydneyCarton said:

I doubt it.  The New Yorkers that flee are largely the lower level/middle class  ones that couldn’t make it in the Big Apple, and they don’t support super liberal causes and absurd taxes that fund them.

This is a very problematic take. People from a number of backgrounds come from NY to NC. Sure there is a stark contrast between NYC and the other regions from a ideological and demographic perspective, but let's not all call them "lower level/middle class."

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32 minutes ago, Rufus said:

This is a very problematic take. People from a number of backgrounds come from NY to NC. Sure there is a stark contrast between NYC and the other regions from a ideological and demographic perspective, but let's not all call them "lower level/middle class."

It’s largely true.  People who work for Goldman, Morgan, etc that make $500k and more don’t leave.  People who make $200k and less do, as you can live a much better life in NC on $200k than you could in NY.  

There are limited exceptions to the foregoing, but that’s largely true.  If you can afford to live in Scarsdale, Bronxville, Rye, etc., there’s no reason to leave.  They’re among the most beautiful towns in America with unparalleled school systems.

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7 minutes ago, SydneyCarton said:

It’s largely true.  People who work for Goldman, Morgan, etc that make $500k and more don’t leave.  People who make $200k and less do.  There are limited exceptions, but that’s largely true.  If you can afford to live in Scarsdale, Bronxville, Rye, etc., there’s no reason to leave.

Sheesh -- please stop with these types of comments, here and across a number of threads. They are extremely generalized and neglect to recognize an entire set of variables that influence why someone would leave one state for another. To boil it down to one aspect, such as income, is incredibly shortsighted. 

I live in NYC and make considerably less than $200k and I wouldn't leave at the moment. And you have to remember that there are some here that make even less and have no means to leave. They are stuck here, essentially. Also, you have to ask yourself why places like Rye and Scarsdale are so nice to stay in -- is it because they are designed only for the super wealthy, therefore acting as supersized gated communities that cater to their residents and no one else? Parts of the Bronx or Brooklyn would be similar if the wealthy actually paid their fair share of taxes and such instead of leaving for the suburbs. If places had the same level of investment from taxes and such, they would be great places to live. 

You comment pretty regularly about Chapel Hill being the best place in North Carolina particularly in terms of quality of life. Have you stopped to notice that it is also one of the most expensive locations to live in within the state, and how that omits people from all types of backgrounds, therefore not giving them the chance to live in such a great community? Have you stopped to look around Chapel Hill and see that it is only calling out the extreme socio-economic issues that plague our world today - one that inherently leaves some in the dust while a select few get to live in blissful ignorance? 

Here's the thing; if everyone paid their fair share of taxes that go into maintaining daily necessities, a lot of places would be great to live. And one would hope that those moving here from NY State would care enough to put in that fair share in hopes of getting out something great. But, it is largely not the case because of how poorly managed a lot of City, County, and State government budgets are. 

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2 hours ago, SydneyCarton said:

It’s largely true.  People who work for Goldman, Morgan, etc that make $500k and more don’t leave.  People who make $200k and less do, as you can live a much better life in NC on $200k than you could in NY.  

There are limited exceptions to the foregoing, but that’s largely true.  If you can afford to live in Scarsdale, Bronxville, Rye, etc., there’s no reason to leave.  They’re among the most beautiful towns in America with unparalleled school systems.

Bronxville is exceptional.

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So are Scarsdale, Rye, Bedford, Armonk, Chappaqua, Great Neck, Sands Point, Centre Island, and scores of other suburban towns like Greenwich, Connecticut and Alpine, NJ, which are probably the top two towns in the NYC metro.

 No one is leaving those places to come to NC.  Therefore, the point that was initially raised about whether New Yorkers fleeing high taxes and regulations will vote for them here is inapplicable.  The people who leave NY are lower to middle class and live in mediocre towns.  They resent paying  ridiculously high taxes to fund pie in the sky social programs and public salaries.  They come to NC and are elated that the dump they sold in Yonkers will yield enough money to buy a spectacular house in Chapel Hill, Cary, or Waxhaw and pay dramatically lower taxes too.

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40 minutes ago, SydneyCarton said:

So are Scarsdale, Rye, Bedford, Armonk, Chappaqua, Great Neck, Sands Point, Centre Island, and scores of other suburban towns like Greenwich, Connecticut and Alpine, NJ, which are probably the top two towns in the NYC metro.

 No one is leaving those places to come to NC.  Therefore, the point that was initially raised about whether New Yorkers fleeing high taxes and regulations will vote for them here is inapplicable.  The people who leave NY are lower to middle class and live in mediocre towns.  They resent paying  ridiculously high taxes to fund pie in the sky social programs and public salaries.  They come to NC and are elated that the dump they sold in Yonkers will yield enough money to buy a spectacular house in Chapel Hill, Cary, or Waxhaw and pay dramatically lower taxes too.

The only reason they would leave is for a better opportunity, forced relocation, or for personal reasons. 

40 minutes ago, SydneyCarton said:

So are Scarsdale, Rye, Bedford, Armonk, Chappaqua, Great Neck, Sands Point, Centre Island, and scores of other suburban towns like Greenwich, Connecticut and Alpine, NJ, which are probably the top two towns in the NYC metro.

 No one is leaving those places to come to NC.  Therefore, the point that was initially raised about whether New Yorkers fleeing high taxes and regulations will vote for them here is inapplicable.  The people who leave NY are lower to middle class and live in mediocre towns.  They resent paying  ridiculously high taxes to fund pie in the sky social programs and public salaries.  They come to NC and are elated that the dump they sold in Yonkers will yield enough money to buy a spectacular house in Chapel Hill, Cary, or Waxhaw and pay dramatically lower taxes too.

It's a similar thing with Mexico. The only Mexicans that come to the US are the lower income earners and less educated. The upper middle class and wealthy have no reason to come to the US, so they don't. That's why most Americans think that all Mexicans are like the people they see here, and nothing could be further from the truth.

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M I left "rich" Connecticut for Raleigh.  I have friends here from Darien, Westport, Avon, Simsbury, Somers, CT, and Somers, NY,   I know people who have moved to NC from Dover, Manchester, and Hamilton, MA, Kennebunkport and York Harbor, ME; and, Franklin Lakes, Bernardsville and Basking Ridge, NJ.  None of these places are shabby, rundown, or mediocre and the people aren't poor shleps.   "No one" would leave these places is just false.   Paying higher taxes for great schools, public libraries, parks, or even "social" programs that help poorer areas of our towns or in my case, in nearby areas of Connecticut is something people don't generally resent unless there's a perception of waste.  There is discomfort paying for what some perceive as giving handouts to people who won't help themselves, that's not unique to these places. 

People from "poorer" areas of Connecticut, the parts that voted for Trump in northern and eastern Connecticut, absolutely don't like paying taxes for social programs until you take them away but even they are happy to vote for politicians who will spend money on expensive schools and other public infrastructure and facilities, like senior centers.   People from the towns around the cities, like Hartford or Bridgeport, look at them with disgust because they are filled with the working poor, immigrants, rundown places, and people on public assistance and they blame "government" without knowing the root causes of the problems.  It's not "government" alone.  It's also the private sector, which moved jobs out of the cities making them less accessible to poor workers and with the jobs, the tax revenues that once paid for great schools, parks, and other public infrastructure.  

Government is run by all of us.  The employees working in government can't make decisions unilaterally without the approval of the people we elect.  They are the final arbitors.  Would the people who left pay higher taxes to replicate the amenities and services of suburban Connecticut?  I would, for schools, parks, programs for kids and seniors, and education and transportation for the working poor and lower middle class.  NC cities and towns are relatively new...what happens as the infrastructure ages?we already can't afford to build the transportation infrastructure we need to accommodate our growth, who is going to pay for crumbling miles of roads if we keep sprawling outward?  The decision to build cities inefficiently isn't "government", it's us.  We elect the people who won't make the hard decisions and won't say no to fiscally wasteful growth. 

In the Triangle, I hear the most hypocritical stuff coming from liberals, like my own neighbors in my Durham neighborhood, made up of people from around the world, highly educated, making great incomes who don't want more density and change, but complain about the lack of affordable housing and the loss of farmland to sprawl.   The same people who complain about traffic but won't fight for transit-friendly land use and design.  People who demand economic opportunity for poor neighborhoods but don't want gentrification because we the people don't want higher density housing or to change our tax structure to reflect the efficiencies associated with maximizing existing infrastructure vs the fiscal inefficiencies associated with sprawl.  Our road funding mechanisms literally reward cities and towns for land use and design decisions that contribute to creating more vehicle mile traveled (VMT).

Basically....we are the enemy of better cities and places regardless of where we were born, our income, education, etc..   I wish the professionals hired to work in government would speak up more since many of them know the solutions.  Unfortunately, they are more silent than not because they have to temper what they say to avoid disagreeing with anyone.  They have to appear neutral.  

Edited by Phillydog
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  • 1 month later...

Here is the current state of the Hub RTP the new high density heart of the RTP at Davis Dr and Hwy 54 and I-40.   If I was MAA who is building the 1200 apartments I would start all at once the demand will be there.  With Apple's campus just down the road and GRAIL hiring hundreds right down the street this project at least on the residential side will be a home run!  I stopped at the Wells Fargo in the middle see map below.   again mostly horizontal work now but this one will go vertical soon with the apartments rising. 

Hub RTP | Research Triangle Park

here is the site plan. 

Office | Hub RTP

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1 hour ago, KJHburg said:

Not tired of posting these announcements yet.  200 more bio pharma jobs coming to Durham!  Average salary 75K

NC Commerce: Leading Cell Therapy Biotech Company Chooses Research Triangle for its North American R&D and Manufacturing Facility

I’m definitely not tired of it either! The collection of leading biotech companies making major investments in RTP right now makes me giddy.

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8 hours ago, Durham_Transplant said:

I’m definitely not tired of it either! The collection of leading biotech companies making major investments in RTP right now makes me giddy.

They certainly aren't wasting time congregating here. I guess they're all racing to get a peice of the action before it all drys up.

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  • 2 weeks later...

The Boxyard the container village of shops and restaurants is opening this Friday inside the RTP. 40 of the 41 containers or boxes are leased.

Boxyard RTP, with restaurants and retail stores in shipping containers, to open on Saturday | WRAL TechWire

News 11 bit about it 

Sneak Peek: Boxyard RTP, a dining and retail space constructed from shipping containers - ABC11 Raleigh-Durham

Edited by KJHburg
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