Restaurant Development in NW Arkansas

[DickSonstreetDFW]

It doesn't make sense to me why some people are so against chains.

All chains were once local stores. They just expanded. Any local store that

is successful will branch out and become a chain. We are already seeing several

local stores in NWA that have become chains. Wal-mart was once a mom & pop store.

Now it's a huge chain store. I wouldn't live in a town without a wal-mart.

If it weren't for chain stores, NWA's population wouldn't be growing at all.

Not to mention the fact that there wouldn't be enough local stores to go around.

It's nice to have both local and chain stores. But to curse all chain stores just because

they are "chain" is rediculous. Without them, we'd be in bad shape.

I don't need a lesson in franchsing as its something I've worked in early in my career. I know how it works.

I'm not strictly anti-chain as much as I seriously don't give a rat's patootie if NWA gets another TGIFridays, or any similar restaurants. The prospect doesn't interest me. I'm more neutral than opposed.

I find them bland contrivances and sit-down versions of fast food with generally poor service and cartoon-like settings. I don't get excited about them because I really don't believe they bring much to the city other than tax revenues. They contribute very little to the community fabric and by defnition are generic, standard copies which can be found in just about any small town in America.

You believe they enhance quality of life for some reason. I don't think that they do.

There are certain chains that I find to be enjoyable places which truly offer quality and atmosphere, great food, above and beyond chains like Applebee's and TGIFridays.

PF Changs, Texas de Brazil, etc I don't mind.

I disagree that NWA would be in bad shape without chains, but that is a subjective notion (opinion) with which I can't argue.

Edited March 28, 2006 by DickSonstreetDFW

[dimebag1980]

If it makes you feel any better there are only 2 in Mississsippi, 3 in Alabama, and NONE in Louisiana!

Yes and that bites. We used to have 3 locations in Shreveport before the big bust of the 80s and now there are NO locations in Louisiana.

I want Fuddrucker's and Red Robin, too, so I'm very jealous of NW Arkansas. We were supposed to get either a Fuddrucker's or Johnny Rockets, but they decided not to build.

Woe is me...

[DickSonstreetDFW]

Yes and that bites. We used to have 3 locations in Shreveport before the big bust of the 80s and now there are NO locations in Louisiana.

I want Fuddrucker's and Red Robin, too, so I'm very jealous of NW Arkansas. We were supposed to get either a Fuddrucker's or Johnny Rockets, but they decided not to build.

Woe is me...

Here's another woe.

Fayetteville, Springdale, Rogers MSA is larger than Shreveport now.

Sorry, had to do it.

[masons_dad1]

Yes and that bites. We used to have 3 locations in Shreveport before the big bust of the 80s and now there are NO locations in Louisiana.

I want Fuddrucker's and Red Robin, too, so I'm very jealous of NW Arkansas. We were supposed to get either a Fuddrucker's or Johnny Rockets, but they decided not to build.

Woe is me...

Not sure if this was rubbed in yet but Northwest Arkansas actually has 2 Fuddrucker's.

[Mith242]

Sorry this is a bit off topic but I did see a PF Chang's out in Albuquerque when I was out there. Didn't stop by though, when I'm out there I have to enjoy the New Mexican food while I have the chance.

[strmchsr77]

Sorry this is a bit off topic but I did see a PF Chang's out in Albuquerque when I was out there. Didn't stop by though, when I'm out there I have to enjoy the New Mexican food while I have the chance.

If you haven't been to a PF Changs, you are missing out. Until the one in NWA gets built, the nearest is in Tulsa at Utica Square. I've found that it is about the only thing Tulsa has to offer that is not in NWA.

[dimebag1980]

Not sure if this was rubbed in yet but Northwest Arkansas actually has 2 Fuddrucker's.

Yes, I read that already......

I love Fuddrucker's and the closest one to me is in Dallas.

[dimebag1980]

Here's another woe.

Fayetteville, Springdale, Rogers MSA is larger than Shreveport now.

Sorry, had to do it.

Yeah, rub it in... rub it in... I remember when there wasn't much in that area, but it's definitely come a long way since. When I went up there about 5 years ago, for the first time in many years, I knew it was only a matter of time before that area outgrew the Shreveport-Bossier MSA. I'd like to get back up there soon, but with it being a 6-7 hour drive, it's hard to find the time.

Oh well, when I need a fix, we did recently get two cool burger chains.

Cheeburger Cheeburger

and

Fatburger

As far as the burger goes, Cheeburger Cheeburger compares very well to Fuddrucker's, but they don't have the condiment bar or the ice cream parlor. They do have over 70 different shake flavors, though. Fatburger has a cool diner atmosphere, but their burgers are just a bit too dry for me.

Edited March 29, 2006 by supkof

[slyder1]

I could bbe wrong but I thought the Fay MSA was at 390,000 and Shreveport MSA was at 396,000. Did all the cities in NWA that were doing their own census get finished yet? I thought someone mentioned that earlier.

[skirby]

I would like to see a Fuddrucker's in LR. The last time I ate at one was when I lived in Chicago. And while we're making wishes before the food fairy how about a Portillios and Gino's East and for Mexican food lets go with Xochimilco Restaurant from Detroit. Is it time to eat?.

[dimebag1980]

I would like to see a Fuddrucker's in LR. The last time I ate at one was when I lived in Chicago. And while we're making wishes before the food fairy how about a Portillios and Gino's East and for Mexican food lets go with Xochimilco Restaurant from Detroit. Is it time to eat?.

Oooh Chicago... my favorite place to stop in and eat in Chicago, for the fun of it, is Ed Dibivic's (I hope I spelled that right.) Ever been there?

[tim2462]

^

We also wouldn't be much of a community without chains. People would gaulk and say, you don't have a mcdonalds, or a walmart?

lol A lot of people are like that. You'll also have those that say, "My city has 3 TGI Friday's." "Your city only has 1." Whether it's a good thing or not, people compare cities by what chains it has.

[DickSonstreetDFW]

I could bbe wrong but I thought the Fay MSA was at 390,000 and Shreveport MSA was at 396,000. Did all the cities in NWA that were doing their own census get finished yet? I thought someone mentioned that earlier.

I said it. They were basically the same last time I looked at estimates. I'm assuming a higher growth rate in NWA since it was in the top ten nationally percentage wise, therefore it makes sense that NWA has surpassed Shreveport in the past year or so.

[DickSonstreetDFW]

lol A lot of people are like that. You'll also have those that say, "My city has 3 TGI Friday's." "Your city only has 1." Whether it's a good thing or not, people compare cities by what chains it has.

I guess some people do.

Springdale rocks. It has Cracker Barrel. It must be better than Fayetteville.

Quantifying your city's value, or position in the world based on which chain restaurants it has is a very very small town mindset.

We done got us TWO TGIFridays! Whatchu think about that, Fort Smith??

It depends on how impressed you are by chains like TGIFridays. I drive by probably six a day and I haven't gone to a single one of them because I think TGIFridays, quite frankly, sucks.

If EVERY SINGLE franchise restaurant in Fayetteville were to burn down tomorrow and be replaced by local eateries, I would not think it a tragedy or a decrease in the value of Fayetteville. Quite the contrary.

The franchising of America means that every place is the same. Your opinion on that being a good thing or bad thing depends on your perspective.

Yeah, rub it in... rub it in... I remember when there wasn't much in that area, but it's definitely come a long way since. When I went up there about 5 years ago, for the first time in many years, I knew it was only a matter of time before that area outgrew the Shreveport-Bossier MSA. I'd like to get back up there soon, but with it being a 6-7 hour drive, it's hard to find the time.

Oh well, when I need a fix, we did recently get two cool burger chains.

Cheeburger Cheeburger

and

Fatburger

As far as the burger goes, Cheeburger Cheeburger compares very well to Fuddrucker's, but they don't have the condiment bar or the ice cream parlor. They do have over 70 different shake flavors, though. Fatburger has a cool diner atmosphere, but their burgers are just a bit too dry for me.

NWA had a couple of Cheeburger Cheeburgers a few years ago but they went bye bye.

Fatburger is good. Mostly a west coast thing. Surprised to see them in Louisiana. I've not even seen them in Texas.

[Aporkalypse]

I would like to see a Fuddrucker's in LR. The last time I ate at one was when I lived in Chicago. And while we're making wishes before the food fairy how about a Portillios and Gino's East and for Mexican food lets go with Xochimilco Restaurant from Detroit. Is it time to eat?.

I like Fuddrucker's pretty well as well and I'm not really a chain guy.

Fuddrucker's is no Cotham's though. DFW has a lot of great burger joints but I'm not sure I've had one yet that could compete with Cotham's or Buffalo Grill.

[Aporkalypse]

I said it. They were basically the same last time I looked at estimates. I'm assuming a higher growth rate in NWA since it was in the top ten nationally percentage wise, therefore it makes sense that NWA has surpassed Shreveport in the past year or so.

Is NWA in the top ten nationally percentage-wise? I knew Benton Co was #79 amonst counties and that Wash Co was unranked and I thought while their growth rate was impressive it wasn't quite that high. Interesting. There are several higher on this chart of growth from 2000 to 2003 but I'm assuming you're using a different one?

Census data

In 2003 Shreveport was listed at 419k and NWA at 378k, though I know 390k is the latest estimate.

Edited March 29, 2006 by Aporkalypse

[dimebag1980]

I said it. They were basically the same last time I looked at estimates. I'm assuming a higher growth rate in NWA since it was in the top ten nationally percentage wise, therefore it makes sense that NWA has surpassed Shreveport in the past year or so.

That's the way I looked at it as well. Last time I looked, they were almost identical, and the way that area is growing, it's a no-brainer.

[dimebag1980]

NWA had a couple of Cheeburger Cheeburgers a few years ago but they went bye bye.

Fatburger is good. Mostly a west coast thing. Surprised to see them in Louisiana. I've not even seen them in Texas.

I certainly hope Cheeburger Cheeburger didn't close due to lack of business... man, I love that place. Of course, not everyone has the same taste, but people I know from the Texarkana area, as well as Illinois, always want to eat at Cheeburger Cheeburger when they visit.

As far as Fatburger goes, I was a little surprised as well, basically because Louisiana is so often overlooked by many of the larger chains, let alone a west coast chain. A franchisee decided to open one in New Orleans and one in Shreveport shortly thereafter. The one in New Orleans, for whatever reason, doesn't appear to have reopened since Katrina. It was in the French Quarter, which fared the storm remarkably well.

[dimebag1980]

Is NWA in the top ten nationally percentage-wise? I knew Benton Co was #79 amonst counties and that Wash Co was unranked and I thought while their growth rate was impressive it wasn't quite that high. Interesting. There are several higher on this chart of growth from 2000 to 2003 but I'm assuming you're using a different one?

Census data

In 2003 Shreveport was listed at 419k and NWA at 378k, though I know 390k is the latest estimate.

In the data sheet you posted, Shreveport-Bossier is listed at 378,331 for 2003 and Fayetteville-Springdale-Rogers at 378,013. I've never seen Shreveport-Bossier listed at over 400,000 but I'd like to.

[skirby]

Oooh Chicago... my favorite place to stop in and eat in Chicago, for the fun of it, is Ed Dibivic's (I hope I spelled that right.) Ever been there?

Doesn't matter how you spell it as long as you eat get to eat there.

[dimebag1980]

Doesn't matter how you spell it as long as you eat get to eat there.

I'm going to take that as a yes... you have been there. Awesome place... I love it. Now that my father-in-law has moved from Champaign to the Chicago 'burbs, I should be able to eat there more.

[DickSonstreetDFW]

Is NWA in the top ten nationally percentage-wise? I knew Benton Co was #79 amonst counties and that Wash Co was unranked and I thought while their growth rate was impressive it wasn't quite that high. Interesting. There are several higher on this chart of growth from 2000 to 2003 but I'm assuming you're using a different one?

Census data

In 2003 Shreveport was listed at 419k and NWA at 378k, though I know 390k is the latest estimate.

I can't find my source. I may have pulled it out of my a##, or maybe I was remembering a ranking related to job growth that put NWA in the top ten category last year.

On the table provided, NWA ranked 24th in population percentage growth '02-'03, while ShV was 290th I think. Their pops were bascially the same at the time.

I think its a safe bet that in 2005-06, NWA has a slight advantage in pop.

[Mith242]

Yeah, rub it in... rub it in... I remember when there wasn't much in that area, but it's definitely come a long way since. When I went up there about 5 years ago, for the first time in many years, I knew it was only a matter of time before that area outgrew the Shreveport-Bossier MSA. I'd like to get back up there soon, but with it being a 6-7 hour drive, it's hard to find the time.

Oh well, when I need a fix, we did recently get two cool burger chains.

Cheeburger Cheeburger

and

Fatburger

As far as the burger goes, Cheeburger Cheeburger compares very well to Fuddrucker's, but they don't have the condiment bar or the ice cream parlor. They do have over 70 different shake flavors, though. Fatburger has a cool diner atmosphere, but their burgers are just a bit too dry for me.

We used to have a Cheeburger Cheeburger on Dickson St here in Fayetteville. Guess it didn't do too well, it closed probably around 5 years ago.

Oops looks like someone already mentioned that. I guess that's what I get for not reading everything first before I start posting responses.

Edited March 29, 2006 by Mith242

[Mith242]

Is NWA in the top ten nationally percentage-wise? I knew Benton Co was #79 amonst counties and that Wash Co was unranked and I thought while their growth rate was impressive it wasn't quite that high. Interesting. There are several higher on this chart of growth from 2000 to 2003 but I'm assuming you're using a different one?

Census data

In 2003 Shreveport was listed at 419k and NWA at 378k, though I know 390k is the latest estimate.

I'm not sure if NWA is still in the top ten now or not. It was back in the 90's but I haven't heard where we are exactly so far this decade.

[Aporkalypse]

I can't find my source. I may have pulled it out of my a##, or maybe I was remembering a ranking related to job growth that put NWA in the top ten category last year.

On the table provided, NWA ranked 24th in population percentage growth '02-'03, while ShV was 290th I think. Their pops were bascially the same at the time.

I think its a safe bet that in 2005-06, NWA has a slight advantage in pop.

I can see that. Be warned though that by adding neighboring counties Shreveport's MSA could add a whole lot of population. There are a lot of populous communities nearby. The same could happen in LR at some point - addition of Jefferson, Garland, and maybe even White Cos could really boost the MSA population substantially.