New Orleans and Baton Rouge Metropolitan Areas to Merge?

[JPKneworleans]

i think people mean will they merge more in a physical sense. True finding that many people too commute between the aras core parishes is unlikely, but it still wont change the fact there are this many people in an area. i think the census bureau statistics are skewed in favor of matro areas that have a large commute area. I think at some point St Tammany will be considered a core parish.

I agree with your assessment of the statistics. I believe St. Tammany will become a core parish, but not in time for the 2010 census. At one point, the NOLA and BR metro areas touched each other because St. James was considered part of the NOLA metro area. But when the commuting percentage requirements increased, the parish reverted to rural status. The only parish separating the two along I-12 Tangipahoa. I think there is a greater chance of Tangipahoa becoming part of NOLA than BR because the population increase was from New Orleans, not BR.

[tennis1400]

If st Tammany is added, Then even some parts of Mississippi could be added to the metro area. See that is what is so strange and misleading about statistics, is that either way you measure it still is really the same amount of people in an area. The measurements to me are somewhat arbitrary, unfair and misleading. Yet they are important when it comes to issues of funding. SO it is a big deal!

[JPKneworleans]

Definitely. Picayune and places north are BOOMING.

[nola17]

I dont think Baton Rouge would like the idea of no and br metros merging.

[fla_tiger]

I am intrigued by the idea of the two cities' metro areas merging. I feel that it will only benefit both nationally by creating a single larger market area population. I am surprised why the Houma/Thibodaux and Biloxi/Gulfport metro areas are not also included creating a mini megalopolis of some 3 million residents. These areas are all easily within an hours drive of New Orleans.

[UptownNewOrleans]

I like the idea of New Orleans & Baton Rouge merging.

[imaterry78247]

I like the idea of New Orleans & Baton Rouge merging.

I think it makes more economical sense to merge. This area would come a Southern powerhouse and rival anyone with univ like Tulane , Southern Univ, LSU, Xavier and UNO for knowledge.

[Puddinhead]

It's inconceivable to imagine a consolidation of even New Orleans, Jefferson, and St. Bernard government, with as much sense as that makes as far as supplying services, pooling revenue, etc....much less thinking of two city governments some eighty miles apart. We like to squabble amongst ourselves down here way too much for that. LOL

[tombarnes]

As you say. the temperaments of the two cities are too far apart for any sort of regional government to be conceivable- or advantageous to anyone. I just don't see this happening. Regional government wouldn't even be possible in the Washington metro area. Regional authorities and governments are almost always clumsy, bureaucratic things. I am a bit puzzled why anyone would pine for one.

[JPKneworleans]

I dont think Baton Rouge would like the idea of no and br metros merging.

It's not like the governmental structures would merge. Considering all of the politics (just as they exist everywhere in the country), it would never work.

[krazeeboi]

If the two cities/metro areas do merge, I would imagine it would be due to narrow strips of sprawling development primarily along (an) interstate corridor(s). Why would anyone want the beautiful Louisiana landscape tarnished in such a fashion?

[NCB]

Why would anyone want the beautiful Louisiana landscape tarnished in such a fashion?

You'll never have to worry about that happening directly around New Orleans, thanks too, Louisiana's beautiful landscape. Two interstate's connect Greater New Orleans and Greater Baton Rouge, Interstate 10 runs from New Orleans through Baton Rouge south of Lake Ponchartrain, and Interstate 12 runs about 85 miles from Slidell to Baton Rouge north of the lake. I-12 runs into I-10 just outside of downtown Baton Rouge.

Map of the area

Krazee, I don't know how familiar you are with the area between New Orleans and Baton Rouge, but south of Lake Ponchartrain and Lake Maurepas along I-10, it's pure swampland. That, is what keeps Baton Rouge, which has a serious sprawl problem, from continuing to expand towards New Orleans, and what keeps NOLA from expanding outwards towards Baton Rouge. Here's a Satelite view of the area, and you'll notice the area around Lake Ponchartrain where it looks like the development of New Orleans-Metairie-Kenner just suddenly ends, and the area around Lake Maurepas where the development of Baton Rouge suddenly ends. That is the natural barrier between the two area's south of the lake.

But north of the lake, along Interstate 12, there is really nothing keeping the New Orleans metro parish of Saint Tammany, along with Tangipahoa Parish, which will officialy become part of the metro in 2010, from eventually meeting with the metro Baton Rouge parish of Livingston. Saint Tammany Parish was already the fastest growing parish in the state pre-Katrina, and that has increased at an extremely high pace post-Katrina, especially in the western portion of the parish around Covington-Mandeville. The parish had a population of 191,000 in 2000, and now post-Katrina, the population could be as high as 296,000. Tangipahoa Parish, which is just west of Saint Tammany, has also seen a very large development and population gain, especially in the southern portion of the parish, closer to both New Orleans and Baton Rouge. Now there is still a long stretch of undeveloped land along I-12 in western Tangipahoa and Livingston Parish's, but at the current rate of growth along I-12, who know's how long it will stay that way.

The cities of Baton Rouge and New Orleans are two very different cities, especially considering they are only about an hour apart. Very different people, culture's, cityscape's, etc. and they will never become extremely similar, just like no city in this world will ever become very similar to New Orleans. But Katrina has brought the two cities closer together in many ways, and while we'll never see the two cities connected through developments and such, I think that someday soon we will see commuter rail connecting NOLA with B.R. along with, who knows, maybe a New Orleans-Baton Rouge Internation Airport someday. However, I do expect that someday not too far in the future, the northern suburbs of New Orleans will most definately be connected with metro Baton Rouge, and that will be something interesting to watch, IMO.

[krazeeboi]

^Thanks for the visuals and other info.

[imaterry78247]

I disagree-I think the two cities SMSA could become 1-Look at SF and Oakland-Two different cities, I mean different. As far as the beautiful landscape I think it will be preservesd to the extent of development. From the satellite pic , I see huge condos been develop around the lake area and city like Gonzales and River Road booming. all that area need is one big project to kick it off and i think a share airport wouldbe such the thing. But man the cab fare-so a rail service would have to be built. Lets start getting our oil royalties and make LA the state it should be. Pound for pound -LA and New Orleans have more natural resources thant any other state in the union. And culturally speaking-The food is the best in the country. And best of all it is very exotic. Is Louisiana the Sicily of the America-where all its native sons and daughters are elsewhere but have a love for it like no other. Lets develop and preserve the natural environment and BR and NO will be the new mecca of the South

[Rardy]

I disagree-I think the two cities SMSA could become 1-Look at SF and Oakland-Two different cities, I mean different. As far as the beautiful landscape I think it will be preservesd to the extent of development. From the satellite pic , I see huge condos been develop around the lake area and city like Gonzales and River Road booming. all that area need is one big project to kick it off and i think a share airport wouldbe such the thing. But man the cab fare-so a rail service would have to be built. Lets start getting our oil royalties and make LA the state it should be. Pound for pound -LA and New Orleans have more natural resources thant any other state in the union. And culturally speaking-The food is the best in the country. And best of all it is very exotic. Is Louisiana the Sicily of the America-where all its native sons and daughters are elsewhere but have a love for it like no other. Lets develop and preserve the natural environment and BR and NO will be the new mecca of the South

A couple of ideas:

If you look at pre-Katrina growth rates, Livingston and Ascension were the 2 fastest growing parishes in the state (St. Tammany was a distant third). Both of those parishes are on the "New Orleans side" of Baton Rouge.

When someone speaks of MSA's merging, they're not suggesting that everything between the 2 cities become a suburbanized wasteland. MSA's are defined by commuting patterns - when 25% of commuters travel into a core parish, the commuters' parish gets added to the MSA. I don't think Tangipahoa will be added to New Orleans in the near future primarily because it is already self-sufficient in terms of employment, and even more so now, post-Katrina.

I also don't think 25% of E. Baton Rouge residents will ever be trekking down to Jefferson or Orleans because of the exact same reason.

More feasibly, it is entirely possible that 25% of Ascension commuters end up in Jefferson, and 25% of Livingston commuters end up in Tangipahoa. That would, IMO, be the most likely way for the 2 MSA's to become joined. But even then, a New Orleans-Baton Rouge MSA would never work. There'd be too much disagreement over whose name gets listed first!

Also, I agree with everyone who said that Baton Rouge would fight the idea. They're already recognized as one of the wealthiest, smartest MSA's in state, and they'd probably resent the encumbrances being joined with New Orleans would naturally bring.

[krazeeboi]

I disagree-I think the two cities SMSA could become 1-Look at SF and Oakland-Two different cities, I mean different.

Louisiana doesn't have a comparable economic engine to make NO and BR merge as the Bay Area has (Silicon Valley).

[NCB]

Louisiana doesn't have a comparable economic engine to make NO and BR merge as the Bay Area has (Silicon Valley).

That is indeed very true, we don't have an ecomomic engine comparable to something like the Silicon Valley. However, with Louisiana now 3rd in the country in terms of movie production(behind only California and New York), and the majority of the new and extremely large film industry related developments, i.e. production studios, sound stages, offices, etc. planned for metro New Orleans and metro Baton Rouge, could the film industry be that major economic engine that brings the two metro's together? Louisiana has been dubbed the new "Hollywood South" by the major movie producers themselves, not by their own state government or officials like so many other states in the South. And the center of "Hollywood South," the fastest growing area in the country in terms of movie production, is right smack dab in the middle of the area between New Orleans and Baton Rouge. Could it do for the NOBR what the Silicon Valley has done for the Bay Area?

Thoughts?

[UptownNewOrleans]

We already have Mardi Gras, conventions, tourism, and the N.O. Saints as major economic engines for the state, so I see no reason why the film industry wouldn't generate major revenue for the state It makes good sense.

[NCB]

We already have Mardi Gras, conventions, tourism, and the N.O. Saints as major economic engines for the state, so I see no reason why the film industry wouldn't generate major revenue for the state It makes good sense.

I agree about the other things you listed, however one thing that the film industry could do differently in SE Louisiana is connect and benefit both New Orleans and Baton Rouge. The New Orleans Saints are exactly that, the New Orleans Saints, Mardi Gras, also New Orleans, and the conventions, also New Orleans. But the film industry in SE Louisiana is something that could really bring metro New Orleans and metro Baton Rouge together economically, as it could benefit the entire metro region, not just one individual city.

[dan326]

I think that the two metros merging could turn out well, but I would hope that Baton Rouge could make a name for it's self. New Orleans is a great city, but I don't want B.R. to end like Fort Worth as "the other city".

[NCB]

I don't think Baton Rouge has ever had a better chance to make a name for itself than it does right now. Bring in and create more business, keep the population growing, beef up the skyline, improve the city core in terms of infill and density, and create a way to bring in more day and night activity to that area, and get your name out into the national ranks. But one thing that Baton Rouge really needs to work on is the traffic situation. Baton Rouge is well known for having the worst traffic in the South outside of Atlanta and Houston, and it's only getting worse now after Katrina. Slow down some of the sprawl, bring some of the major projects into the city core from the suburbs, improve the mass transit system, and develop a serious plan to build new roads, and improve the old one's. Baton Rouge is high in many national rankings, but for the wrong reasons. Baton Rouge is towards the top of the national list of cities with sprawl problems, traffic problems, polution problems, and in some categories, crime problems for a city of its size. Baton Rouge has an excellent opportunity right now to really move forward and make a name for itself, but it will require some very strong leadership, and I'm hoping that the current and future city government is able to govern up to that standard.

I do think that Baton Rouge will always be under the shadow of New Orleans to some degree, but it's hard not to be when you're dealing with a city that gets as much national and global attention as New Orleans, whether it concerns Katrina or not. That being said however, if Baton Rouge wants to step out into the national limelight and make a name for itself, then it will have to do so under its own leadership, which then goes back to some of the things I listed above.

[dan326]

Well, Kip Holden has been a good mayor so far. A lot of things have happened, so I guess it will be interesting to see things progress.

[dan326]

I think we're on the way to better transit. We were supposed to have rapid transit bus by 2010, but the man in charge of the transit sysytem went back to San Diego to be with his sick mother, so hopefully we can still pull it off. But maybe they will reopen the commuter line between New Orleans and Baton Rouge, or New Orleans will develop some kind of fancy transit system and B.R. will follow.

[richyb83]

The Green Light Plan is a "BIG" step in the right direction; it even has it's own thread in BR. We finally do have some forward thinking leaders. LSU is an economic engine and supposed to be Louisiana's "flagship" university; but Blank-o feels otherwise. Louisiana is a joke to the rest of the country when it come's to $funding LSU. LSU will get a new "University Hospital" in the emerging medical corridor. Pennington Biomedical Research Center has national acclaim; is also not funded properly; This too is an economic engine. The growing Louisiana Technology Park is the largest of it's kind between Houston and Atlanta. That's been HUGE for BR. The RiverCenter just held a BizTech Expo; they are serious about research/technology sector. Sprawl will always be a problem; Ascension and Livingston are growing like(very close) St.Tammany. I never see that going away.

Light-rail connection would be ideal. The airport situation is another matter. Folks at the BR Metro probably do not want to see a NOBR International Airport. And people in Slidell probably would not want to drive to the other-side of La Place either, if that's where it would go?

[NCB]

And people in Slidell probably would not want to drive to the other-side of La Place either, if that's where it would go?

Well, that's where the beauty of having high speed light or commuter rail connecting the entire region would come in. People all over the NOBR would do many more things in parts of the area if they knew that they could simply drive a few miles, get on a train, and be at any place within NOBR in less than an hour, and wouldn't have to deal with traffic. Folks in Slidell would be much less opposed to the idea of going to an airport somewhere around Hammond if they knew that they could be there in only about 30 minutes, without even seeing any traffic.