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Charlotte MLB Team Speculation

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In typical Charlotte fashion though we hope a cheap, imho crappy, solution of a football stadium for mls is the answer. Dream small!

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BTW, I hear you on Jordan but isn't that just rumor? I know he made draft decisions at the wizards but who actually knows of his actions at the hornets? I don't deny it, just don't know. Another likely rumor is Charlotte as a city is not attractive to live 6+ months in vs. la, NYC, Boston etc. Obviously there are counterpoints. Never been impressed by San Antonio for example.

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21 hours ago, cltheel.sdl said:

I'm holding out for MLS over MLB.  Way more entertaining sport and has a much brighter future.

To be clear, I'm a proponent of either (or both) league landing here. If we're talking about what's a more entertaining sport, it's certainly subjective. But to say the MLS product is more entertaining than MLB is debatable at best. The quality of MLS versus some of the top leagues in the world (e.g. EPL, La Liga) is apples to oranges. I watched the MLS All Star game last week where they played Athletico Madrid. We're not even in the same stratosphere as them.  MLS got owned. My biggest concern with the the massive MLS expansion is 1) a league that's struggling to get the games best talents adding more teams and 2) adding more teams only because of the massive bloated expansion fees. I question if that's sustainable. With MLB, you're getting the best baseball players in the world. Does the game have issues? Could the games go faster? Sure. But the quality is top notch. You're getting the top 1% of pitching, hitting, fielding etc. October is the best month of the year. I'll be there supporting MLS and/or MLB if it comes to Charlotte, but lets not get ahead of ourselves over which would be most successful. 

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4 hours ago, jednc said:

I think just about any time I hear someone say "typical Charlotte" or "in Charlotte fashion" I think what a jaded, lazy minded comment. What sort of person chooses to move to a city and then constantly bashes it? Someone I'm glad I don't know in person. What sort of points does someone think they are scoring here? This is NOT what constructive criticism looks like.

And I think that not talking about how how we could improve much more quickly is lazy and jaded. I'll admit to being a tad abrasive about it. Sometimes it just becomes too much to take. The public transit thread seems to be the rare one where people can complain and suggest improvement is needed without others getting all upset. Wonder why.

There are things I like about Charlotte, such as hitting above it's weight regarding business development, and things that drive me nuts. Such as a constant can't do attitude about developing leading infrastructure. Instead taking half measures. Perhaps it's inevitable given the states purple status but I thought Charlotte would be a lot more progressive when I moved here. Btw, I don't particularly want to hang with someone who whines about their commute from lake Norman either. See how that goes? In person I relish those discussions. You don't. Ok just move on.

I suspect if we hung out we'd probably find a lot in common. If you want to take this personally I'm not sure you should read forums. I can't imagine what Reddit would do to you. (•‿•)

Edited by elrodvt
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I threw up a little jyst now, when I read someones opinion that Charlotte is still 2 decades away from being able to support an MLB team. 

 I've been hearing that very thing since 1990. But back then it was 1 decade.

Charlotte should be awarded an MLB team asap and could be playing in a new stadium by 2026. If not, MLB is brain dead and is ignoring the 10.5 million people in NC, and almost 6 million IN SC. 

  In Response to empty seats.

 Seats during weekday games, are very often 25% occupied in most markets. But as someone posted, a certain % are owned by individuals. So they are sold seats weither occupied or empty. 

 The thing with MLB is that it has such a rich loyal fan base, especially in the rust belt cities, because those cities have lost so much economically. They have been forced to grasp tightly, especially their sports teams. Philadelphia would literally burn to the ground if say the Eagles moved to Raleigh.  They would probably burn Raleigh to the ground as well. Of coursethe Eagles will never leave Philly.  Just an example.

Charlotte has sent an NBA team packing and had a new one the next year. We night back the hornets name. 

Charlotte is loyal as well, and not to be messed with. (George Shinn).

  Why CLT doesn't have an MLB team.

It's not fan base. It's not demographics.  It's not lack of money in Charlotte. The only reason Charlotte doesn't have an MLB team is because noone with the $$$$ and prestige has stepped forward to make it happen. 

So, step forward Michael Jordan, Felix Sabates,  Dale Earnhardt Jr. , Jeff Gordon etc... MAKE IT HAPPEN!!

Edited by Skyybutter
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On 8/4/2019 at 2:06 AM, elrodvt said:

BTW, I hear you on Jordan but isn't that just rumor? I know he made draft decisions at the wizards but who actually knows of his actions at the hornets? I don't deny it, just don't know. Another likely rumor is Charlotte as a city is not attractive to live 6+ months in vs. la, NYC, Boston etc. Obviously there are counterpoints. Never been impressed by San Antonio for example.

I would choose to live in CLT over LAX all day. I could do a month in NYC and BOS.  But then I would be ready for Charlotte.  

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10 hours ago, elrodvt said:

And I think that not talking about how how we could improve much more quickly is lazy and jaded. I'll admit to being a tad abrasive about it. Sometimes it just becomes too much to take. The public transit thread seems to be the rare one where people can complain and suggest improvement is needed without others getting all upset. Wonder why.

There are things I like about Charlotte, such as hitting above it's weight regarding business development, and things that drive me nuts. Such as a constant can't do attitude about developing leading infrastructure. Instead taking half measures. Perhaps it's inevitable given the states purple status but I thought Charlotte would be a lot more progressive when I moved here. Btw, I don't particularly want to hang with someone who whines about their commute from lake Norman either. See how that goes? In person I relish those discussions. You don't. Ok just move on.

I suspect if we hung out we'd probably find a lot in common. If you want to take this personally I'm not sure you should read forums. I can't imagine what Reddit would do to you. (•‿•)

As I said in my post, taking the short cut that some problem you perceive is "typical Charlotte" is NOT constructive criticism. I take no offense to someone discussing a problem and offering solutions.

Not that it really matters, but you've never heard me once complain about my commute from Lake Norman. I live and WORK in Lake Norman. I do not commute to Charlotte. I do not have a problem with those who do. What you've heard me complain about is the lack of equity in the number of free lanes that pass through northern Mecklenburg and southern Iredell Cos. I think I have a right to complain about something the state and Charlotte have decided that isn't fair. You'll find me also complaining about the lack of a RAIL solution to north Meck. Nowhere will you ever see me say "in typical NC or Charlotte fashion". If you can't do any better than making your arguments with those phrases, I wish you'd take the negativity elsewhere. You are NOT the only one who does this by the way. That is why I did not post that as a direct response to you.

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3 hours ago, Skyybutter said:

I threw up a little jyst now, when I read someones opinion that Charlotte is still 2 decades away from being able to support an MLB team. 

 I've been hearing that very thing since 1990. But back then it was 1 decade.

Charlotte should be awarded an MLB team asap and could be playing in a new stadium by 2026. If not, MLB is brain dead and is ignoring the 10.5 million people in NC, and almost 6 million IN SC. 

  In Response to empty seats.

 Seats during weekday games, are very often 25% occupied in most markets. But as someone posted, a certain % are owned by individuals. So they are sold seats weither occupied or empty. 

 The thing with MLB is that it has such a rich loyal fan base, especially in the rust belt cities, because those cities have lost so much economically. They have been forced to grasp tightly, especially their sports teams. Philadelphia would literally burn to the ground if say the Eagles moved to Raleigh.  They would probably burn Raleigh to the ground as well. Of coursethe Eagles will never leave Philly.  Just an example.

Charlotte has sent an NBA team packing and had a new one the next year. We night back the hornets name. 

Charlotte is loyal as well, and not to be messed with. (George Shinn).

  Why CLT doesn't have an MLB team.

It's not fan base. It's not demographics.  It's not lack of money in Charlotte. The only reason Charlotte doesn't have an MLB team is because noone with the $$$$ and prestige has stepped forward to make it happen. 

So, step forward Michael Jordan, Felix Sabates,  Dale Earnhardt Jr. , Jeff Gordon etc... MAKE IT HAPPEN!!

I agree with almost everything you've said here. I would add that baseball hasn't expanded since Charlotte emerged as a major U.S. metro and moving any professional sports team is tricky (certainly not impossible, but it's not simple). I do agree with you that our best bet to get an MLB Team is for someone with the money, vision, and the will to step forward and pursue one. Look no further than the current MLS push by Tepper. Our bid went nowhere under Marcus Smith because he wouldn't put up enough of his own money and lacked the proper vision to navigate the hurdles he faced.

When someone steps forward, I think Charlotte will get a team one way or another. Not in a decade or decades!

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@jednc, my thought is this. They should prioritize 4-5 projects per cycle. Of those 1 or 2 should be put on the "these are high visibility, let's be iconic" path. Those should be done in a world class fashion. I see nothing, zip, nada being done world class here. I could point to projects all over the country that made their communities proud and were in the direction of "we're going to be great at x or y".  Look at Union station in Denver for one example. It's so obvious to me. We're great at nothing. Mediocrity rules. I would like to see that changed. Perhaps others prefer the more projects even if mediocre approach. I don't. Do you? Comments?

My perception is our leaders are floating along without any long term strategy. I think I've said this all before and I hope this dispels your idea I'm making lazy comments. It's frustrating and I, for one, have no idea how to change the culture. Why do they benchmark against other cities then do nothing? They don't needed to invent anything. Just copy BoB.

 

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3 hours ago, Skyybutter said:

I like the 

I like rwhe idea of 4-5 prioritised projects per cycle.

  I dont know how long you and others on the site have lived in Charlotte. I moved to Concord in 1994 and have followed thw business scene since.

  There are some things that thw city has done very well. And then some that went nowhere.

  Charlotte talked about building an Aquarium uptown. Beforw Atlanta wver mentioned it. We all know how that story played out. Atlanta has the largest Aq. In the World. Charlotte has a chain Aquarium way out at Concord Mills. Im glad we at least have it though.

  The Charlotte Zoo. Still hasnt happened. 

 I-77... blame the NCDOT for that nightmare. 

  Regarding infrastructure, We have 20 miles of light rail running N-S. Thwe gold line has begun delivery of the first of five new trolleys. 

  Within a few years The Knight, Mint Museum Uptown, Nascar HoF, Knights ballpark, African-American museum, and a modern art museum have come to pass in uptown alone.

   I dont know that the end result plan for charlotte is one of flashy, "World Class" status.

  Im ok with that because attention has shifted to making the city more densely populated and Millennial centric. Im gen x myself.

  New fortune 500 companies seem to be arriving monthly.

 The focus will also be on the RNC. 

  Having said all of this, the exciting thing is that when she puts her mind to the grind, Charlotte makes things happen.

Just a quick note. ATL is no longer the world's largest aquarium. It lost that spot to an aquarium in China, so it is the 2nd largest in the world. In ATL, they advertise the aquarium as the largest aquarium in NA. 

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4 hours ago, Skyybutter said:

I like the 

I like rwhe idea of 4-5 prioritised projects per cycle.

  I dont know how long you and others on the site have lived in Charlotte. I moved to Concord in 1994 and have followed thw business scene since.

  There are some things that thw city has done very well. And then some that went nowhere.

  Charlotte talked about building an Aquarium uptown. Beforw Atlanta wver mentioned it. We all know how that story played out. Atlanta has the largest Aq. In the World. Charlotte has a chain Aquarium way out at Concord Mills. Im glad we at least have it though.

  The Charlotte Zoo. Still hasnt happened. 

 I-77... blame the NCDOT for that nightmare. 

  Regarding infrastructure, We have 20 miles of light rail running N-S. Thwe gold line has begun delivery of the first of five new trolleys. 

  Within a few years The Knight, Mint Museum Uptown, Nascar HoF, Knights ballpark, African-American museum, and a modern art museum have come to pass in uptown alone.

   I dont know that the end result plan for charlotte is one of flashy, "World Class" status.

  Im ok with that because attention has shifted to making the city more densely populated and Millennial centric. Im gen x myself.

  New fortune 500 companies seem to be arriving monthly.

 The focus will also be on the RNC. 

  Having said all of this, the exciting thing is that when she puts her mind to the grind, Charlotte makes things happen.

The light rail falls in the get 'er done mediocre class for me. At least they got if running (somewhat) though!

 

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4 hours ago, Ric0_0 said:

Just a quick note. ATL is no longer the world's largest aquarium. It lost that spot to an aquarium in China, so it is the 2nd largest in the world. In ATL, they advertise the aquarium as the largest aquarium in NA. 

ATL is 4th largest in the world, behind China, Singapore, and Spain.

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Lighten up. If you read my posts I am not  bashing Charlotte without purpose. I'm trying to make the point we should pick 1 or two projects every cycle that will inspire awe... You evidently don't like that concept? 

I use the LRT all the time. It took forever to get electronic payments right. We  still don't know when trains will arrive. Trains are always late. We planned obsolescence with the max 3 train lengths and platform designs. 

I totally agree it's a great achievement in this environment but I don't see what that has to do with whether the result is world class or not.  Do we have to grade on a southern curve or something? The product itself is not great, it's middle of the road. Now, maybe it was a good call on that project or it never would have been built. I think we should also do 1-2 mediocre projects each cycle.

Im curious, do you ride the train every day? Doesn't the low speed and inconsistent timing bother you too? 

Evidently no one wishes to discuss this so moving on.

I  personally would love me some MLB but there are a lot of things working against it happening anytime soon. Tampa was a slight possibility but they appear headed for Montreal. I don't expect the league to expand. The southeast is also not a great place to watch a game without an expensive dome due to the humidity and heat which is only going to get worse. Only ATL has had continued success in this environment. And that's cause they won a lot and established a rabid (and extremely annoying!!) fan base. It would be tough to replicate that and if the investment would not be successful without winning early on I sure would not put my money into it.  That said, the owners seem to come out on top in that scenario anyway by just moving on and sticking it to the city that built them their shiny new park. It's not the same draw but I think a combination of MLR and MLS would be fantastic and is much more doable. I love the purpose built facilities they built in Denver for both sports (although the mls location stinks) and the games are very fun. Given how football nuts people here are MLR seems like a no brainer.

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On August 5, 2019 at 7:30 AM, Skyybutter said:

I threw up a little jyst now, when I read someones opinion that Charlotte is still 2 decades away from being able to support an MLB team. 

 I've been hearing that very thing since 1990. But back then it was 1 decade.

Charlotte should be awarded an MLB team asap and could be playing in a new stadium by 2026. If not, MLB is brain dead and is ignoring the 10.5 million people in NC, and almost 6 million IN SC. 

  In Response to empty seats.

 Seats during weekday games, are very often 25% occupied in most markets. But as someone posted, a certain % are owned by individuals. So they are sold seats weither occupied or empty. 

 The thing with MLB is that it has such a rich loyal fan base, especially in the rust belt cities, because those cities have lost so much economically. They have been forced to grasp tightly, especially their sports teams. Philadelphia would literally burn to the ground if say the Eagles moved to Raleigh.  They would probably burn Raleigh to the ground as well. Of coursethe Eagles will never leave Philly.  Just an example.

Charlotte has sent an NBA team packing and had a new one the next year. We night back the hornets name. 

Charlotte is loyal as well, and not to be messed with. (George Shinn).

  Why CLT doesn't have an MLB team.

It's not fan base. It's not demographics.  It's not lack of money in Charlotte. The only reason Charlotte doesn't have an MLB team is because noone with the $$$$ and prestige has stepped forward to make it happen. 

So, step forward Michael Jordan, Felix Sabates,  Dale Earnhardt Jr. , Jeff Gordon etc... MAKE IT HAPPEN!!

I totally agree with you here. No offense to him but I don't think Michael Jordon would do anything like that haha.

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Chicago Magazine has a nice, history-oriented article on ‘Should the Sox Leave Chicago?’ 

Its all speculation, no where does it say that Reisndorf is looking to move,  but its an interesting read. Charlotte does get a sentence at the end:

Quote

Where would the Sox go? Charlotte is a good option. That’s the home of the Sox’s AAA affiliate, the Knights, so the team already has a connection there.

http://www.chicagomag.com/city-life/August-2019/Should-the-White-Sox-Leave-Chicago/

Changing subjects slightly, Michael Jordan (who played in the White Sox organization during his 'break from the NBA ) would be a better MLB owner than NBA owner....

 

Edited by kermit
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^I read up on that yesterday too. Never say never, but I just don't see a scenario where the Orioles would leave Baltimore. Especially when you have the Rays, A's and to some degree the White Sox as more viable candidates for relocation. The city of Baltimore does catch flack, but Camden Yards stadium is a gem. Outside of a few seasons since the late 1990's , where they made the post season, they've been a losing franchise so it's hard to blame fan apathy. I think it's mostly just a bunch of speculation to generate clicks. 

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Story time: I know a man who, through a series of family connections and coincidences, came to have private transportation by air to Baltimore and tickets in the owners box at Orioles Park for a weekend series with the Yankees. Owners box has a chef who creates to your wish and also an open bar with all the top shelf choices. My friend is a Crown Royal man and he requested same from the tender. Tender said "Sorry we are out of Crown Royal". My friend Jim said "I certainly want to be polite, however I see a bottle of Crown Royal right there behind you." Tender: "Yes, you are right, but owner Peter Angelos is a Crown Royal man and that is the only bottle we have and it is near the bottom. He is not here but could arrive at any time. And you are not going to drink all of his Crown Royal."  

Jimmy said it was a fun trip and great experience. Angelos never appeared.

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1 hour ago, HopHead said:

^I read up on that yesterday too. Never say never, but I just don't see a scenario where the Orioles would leave Baltimore. Especially when you have the Rays, A's and to some degree the White Sox as more viable candidates for relocation. The city of Baltimore does catch flack, but Camden Yards stadium is a gem. Outside of a few seasons since the late 1990's , where they made the post season, they've been a losing franchise so it's hard to blame fan apathy. I think it's mostly just a bunch of speculation to generate clicks. 

Similar can be said about article when the Panthers had an aging owner and the team was going to sell to an outsider.  Generate clicks by fear mongering the fans into thinking the team is leaving.  Though to be fair the NFL has shown more willingness to allow this in recent years.

Just funny when it's an outsider perception in this instance vs our home team where we all have dozens of pages of deliberation on these click bait articles.

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Can a city the size of Nashville support 4 major league teams in a state with almost 4 million fewer people than North Carolina?  I have always taken with a grain of salt the explanations for why a state with as many people as NC, with three of the biggest TV markets in the country, and a conurban area of over 7 million people doesn't have an MLB team.  

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