All Saints

[poonther]

just don't beat us developers up too much....its the pioneers (like us) who take the arrows so the settlers (like you'all) can come in later.....LOL

With a quote like this, your ego maybe approaching that of T.K.'s And don't under estimate the group from this forum, you have no idea who we are yet. We are all on an equal playing field here. You guys absolutely do great work here in Tally, but "taking arrows" might be blowing it up just a tad.

[Florida]

With a quote like this, your ego maybe approaching that of T.K.'s And don't under estimate the group from this forum, you have no idea who we are yet. We are all on an equal playing field here. You guys absolutely do great work here in Tally, but "taking arrows" might be blowing it up just a tad.

LOL! taking arrows!!! I'm normally a sheild for developers around here... especailly when it comes to the controversial items... ask ADAR or the Fallschase people... I'll get in front of a commission and risk taking a few "arrows" too!

[Florida]

Here's an update on those All-Saints Lofts under contruction

Also... I met a very nice couple while in the area, and they allowed me to take a picture of their lovely kitchen... here's a look at the good quality materials being used for the interior of these buildings.

[csmurphy8885]

Tj. u r such a trustworthy looking guy apearently!!! lol! you get in to everything....

I do say that developers are my friend when it ocmes to the DT area.. however, get into the woods too much and i am bitting at your valuables with distaste for destructive development!

I like the way the cloisters will be a buffer for fam! I like the power the mid-rise campus has while upon its hill... i owuldnt want a 30 story popping up on the RR tracks, casting a shadow on the campus every morning.

[Florida]

LOL! Thats funny... there was a young man and a young lady and they were very nice. They came out to speak to me when they saw me taking pictures of the building above and they wanted to know if I knew if any of the units were for sale because they'd like to purchase as they are currently renting their two bedroom unit on the ground floor of the building for $900 monthly. I told them Benchmark was the builder and I pointed to the house of the owners of Benchmark. I told them maybe they should get over there and speak to him about these projects.

They seemed to think it was neat that the developer is living in the middle of the community along with them.

[cobyguy]

LOL! I'm glad you like those pictures! Feels good to know they still serve a purpose. You didn't by any chance get the guys name did you? Was it Commissioner Winchester? I'm very excited about the work that Benchmark is doing over in the area and I personally think they are one of the best development companies in town right now. If I'm ever given the opportunity after I get my degree I'd like to apply to work for them, as well as K2, and St. Joe to see if I stand a chance at getting a job.

Anywho, the development next door that you refer to are The Cloisters right? Or is there something else that I'm not familar with. Also, is your father here in Tallahassee?

Peter and I also own the building you are working in. Our offices- Cornerstone Realty are in unit 108. I tend to work out of home though. 423 #1 All Saints. Cobyguy We have tentative plans to demolish it and build a "tennisen" style mixed use tower- it won't happen for about 5 years though.

[cobyguy]

LOL! Thats funny... there was a young man and a young lady and they were very nice. They came out to speak to me when they saw me taking pictures of the building above and they wanted to know if I knew if any of the units were for sale because they'd like to purchase as they are currently renting their two bedroom unit on the ground floor of the building for $900 monthly. I told them Benchmark was the builder and I pointed to the house of the owners of Benchmark. I told them maybe they should get over there and speak to him about these projects.

They seemed to think it was neat that the developer is living in the middle of the community along with them.

We are using much better amenities in the "cloisters" and the 812 St. Micheals units- stainless appliances, granite counters, same tall cabinets cause of the high ceilings, more hardwood, ungraded tile, parking garages. Those rental units you looked at were never meant to be sold off as induvidual units...so we installed a standard package.

I responce to an above comment- Yes I've been accused of being an egoist....I've gotten better as I grow up.... (blushing outloud) BOL

A thousand story building would never cast a shadow on Famu....not from the Allsaints side anyway. We are due north of the campus- the sun shines from a southerly direction- northward. at least in this hemisphere. Its plain physics ma'am- What's is a "buffer" between FAMU suppose to mean anyway?

The whole southerly view across "Whanish Valley" is very attractive from AllSaints- FAMU has alot of attractive architecture. You should see it from my 4th floor rooftop terrace-( and a braggard too). Even the electrical station has a certain sculptural look. We don't even notice the train anymore. My attitude is that if you can't do anything about it then put a bow on it and celebrate it.

I don't appreciate the taggers though. If those guys really had any social responsiblity- they'de help do something productive for the community. Some do... I've gotten to know quite a few of them. So the locals don't TAG me...Its the drifters who jump the trains who cause a problem. Its not usually personal- And we eliminate it emediately after the 2 times I have been tagged...in 7 years....

If you know your neighbors then you can't hate 'em. Even if they piss you off from time to time... Oh the students and employees of FAMU do drive way too FAST down AllSaints. Like when the train comes through and blocks RR ave. Anyone have any advice here? Yeah I know its life in the big city etc......we are looking into putting a 4 way stop sign at Saint Michael and at MLK. That will probably cuase them to drive even faster between the signs to make up time.... I don't really think traffic calming works well unless you have it every few feet. Then you get that "kachunk-kachunk" sound everytime the cars hit the devices. And then a very rapid acceleration to the next one... chicanes seem to work- and so do raised intersections with 4 way stops. OOOH and big pretty planters with crepe murtles and juniper- (did I mention smart-ass)

[Florida]

I sure enjoyed the part where you mentioned a "Tennyson Styled" tower coming online in a few years. It would be awesome if we had a little more height and density on that side of the downtown. I've been counting on the O'Connel tract to go Highrise, but I'd sure support any help from the All-Saints area. I'll sure be around in 5 years to celebrate it!

As far as the traffic calming is concerened... had you or any of your neighbors thought of doing a round-about to slow things down. One would look neat with a big fountain in the middle of it.

[csmurphy8885]

ohhhh a big one. one you have to slow down to make it around.

[Florida]

ohhhh a big one. one you have to slow down to make it around.

Murphy... did you catch that... CobyGuy is bascially telling us they are proposing another tower within the next 5 years similiar in size to the Tennyson!!

[csmurphy8885]

lol..oh yes i did... i am invisioning its mastery.

[Florida]

I'm envisioning that also... and hoping that it can match or beat the creative design that went into the Turlington Building.

[cobyguy]

Murphy... did you catch that... CobyGuy is bascially telling us they are proposing another tower within the next 5 years similiar in size to the Tennyson!!

I LOVE round abouts!!!!! They are efficient in moving traffic- and yes they have to be large enough to actually go round in. We are assuming that folks will figure out how to merge properly. Its different rules in Europe- I don't care for the fountain idea...but a really cool peice of local art would do nicely....

I don't have much info on the O'connell parcel(s). I did inquire to purchace a couple of the non-articulated sites. They weren't sure what they were going to do with them at the time. This was about a year ago. I need to call them again.

We are still watching the condo market very closely....I really think the genie's out of the bottle though. These mixed use loft towers are poping up all over the country- especially in 1st tier cities but also in smaller cities like Tallahassee. We have a very stable ecomomy- and citizens who want a vibrant urban core. With oil prices going up people are looking for arternatives to the suburbs. I can't predict with certainty what life will be like in ten years. But you guys can expect more development of condos- either row houses or loft style over the next 5 years. Its an exciting time to live in Tallahassee. Also expect new improvements from the city as well. Cascades, Gaines Street, Comp-plan adjustments to allow for better infill etc....

I would like to see all the state parking garages with condos built on top of them. The parking could be shared- they are basically empty at night and weekends etc.... My company would sure love to do the building.

[cobyguy]

I'm envisioning that also... and hoping that it can match or beat the creative design that went into the Turlington Building.

Was that sarcasm? I personally like modern style buildings (international style)- It just has to be well planned- not some warmed over design that someone saw when they were in vegas or miami- scale, proportions, future infill paterns all play important roles in a buildings look.

[Florida]

Was that sarcasm? I personally like modern style buildings (international style)- It just has to be well planned- not some warmed over design that someone saw when they were in vegas or miami- scale, proportions, future infill paterns all play important roles in a buildings look.

NEVER! I don't use sarcasm

The Education Building is my favorite building in Tallahassee... I can't count the number of times I've said that in these threads. I'd just hate to see all of the good land go for projects that won't allow for us to showcase a more elaborate skyline. Right now I think its rather sad we don't have more buildings of similar size and design to the Education building and Highpoint center.

That said I totally agree with you, and think its a shame, that the state used up entire blocks soley for parking and did nothing else with the properties. I've been afriad that it may be impossible to build anything above these parking structures as their foundation might not be strong enough to support much more.

I keep hearing people say, we're watching the condo market very closely... well what about apartments... something a person could pay $700-$1000 monthly to live in? We have many people who come here short term for different little projects while working with the government, international exchange employees and students, grad students seeking to move up to something more characteristic of the big city life, and various other people who may not be from outside the community, but are currently spending nearly the same amount or more renting in a location where they would rather live in a vibrant downtown. I'm just saying....

And what about additional Class A office space. Why not tear down that ol' colorful box thing that thetoolman works in and build up a nice office building... 12-13 stories? I've seen tons of associations downtown... scattered about, and many throughout the city who might find interest in moving back into the central core. This would also allow for redevelopmen opportunities (hopefully of the high-rise nature) of their vacated downtown land... where now a small little house might sit.

This group, Cornerstone Premier Communities LLC presented to the city last July, an RFQ for Gaines Street Redevelopment titled The Cityview Project. It had a subtitle along the lines of A Vision for a Special Place in Tallahassee. They were most interested in the O'Connell Property. This company had assembled a respectable group of planning, design, development and construction partners with the "passion, creativity, and commitment to create a community that will help redefine the City of Tallahassee and Gaines Street" Team members would have included Alliance Construction, Huffman/Tarmey Architects, Mateo Design Group, Moore Bass Consulting, Salazar Architectural Group, Jim Murley Associates, and the Capitol Alliance group as their community liaison. I would have been thrilled to see a real proposal come in, unfortunately this was one of the 10 interested parties that failed to return an RFP.

The city is hoping for a developer who will come in and develop a large piece of land at once, similar to what Mr. Michael Wright, helped to accomplish in Palm Beach, FL.

[cobyguy]

NEVER! I don't use sarcasm

The Education Building is my favorite building in Tallahassee... I can't count the number of times I've said that in these threads. I'd just hate to see all of the good land go for projects that won't allow for us to showcase a more elaborate skyline. Right now I think its rather sad we don't have more buildings of similar size and design to the Education building and Highpoint center.

That said I totally agree with you, and think its a shame, that the state used up entire blocks soley for parking and did nothing else with the properties. I've been afriad that it may be impossible to build anything above these parking structures as their foundation might not be strong enough to support much more.

I keep hearing people say, we're watching the condo market very closely... well what about apartments... something a person could pay $700-$1000 monthly to live in? We have many people who come here short term for different little projects while working with the government, international exchange employees and students, grad students seeking to move up to something more characteristic of the big city life, and various other people who may not be from outside the community, but are currently spending nearly the same amount or more renting in a location where they would rather live in a vibrant downtown. I'm just saying....

And what about additional Class A office space. Why not tear down that ol' colorful box thing that thetoolman works in and build up a nice office building... 12-13 stories? I've seen tons of associations downtown... scattered about, and many throughout the city who might find interest in moving back into the central core. This would also allow for redevelopmen opportunities (hopefully of the high-rise nature) of their vacated downtown land... where now a small little house might sit.

This group, Cornerstone Premier Communities LLC presented to the city last July, an RFQ for Gaines Street Redevelopment titled The Cityview Project. It had a subtitle along the lines of A Vision for a Special Place in Tallahassee. They were most interested in the O'Connell Property. This company had assembled a respectable group of planning, design, development and construction partners with the "passion, creativity, and commitment to create a community that will help redefine the City of Tallahassee and Gaines Street" Team members would have included Alliance Construction, Huffman/Tarmey Architects, Mateo Design Group, Moore Bass Consulting, Salazar Architectural Group, Jim Murley Associates, and the Capitol Alliance group as their community liaison. I would have been thrilled to see a real proposal come in, unfortunately this was one of the 10 interested parties that failed to return an RFP.

The city is hoping for a developer who will come in and develop a large piece of land at once, similar to what Mr. Michael Wright, helped to accomplish in Palm Beach, FL.

The office market is soft for rental space...evryone wants their own building. We are looking into office condos to mix with residential ones- again it makes economic sence to own instead of rent.

The rental market for appartments is also at capacity.

Its highly unlikely a private investor will build an "affordable" development. Not with out help from the government. They do try but no developer is going to build a top end dev. with an "affordable" wing. It just wont happen. ut I guest we really need to clearify "affordable"...There is no such thing as affordable building costs, labor, materials etc...And there's an expected rate of return on our investment. If we can't get it we don't build. Affordable has a certain stigma. The main target market for affordable usually translates to upwardly mobile minorities at least in the south. But they want what non-minorities have already got- house in the suburbs with a new car to park in front. You won't see minorities moving into an "affordable" condo when they can still get a small house/townhouse, with more sq. footage in the burbs. SOME people think cars are a symbol of wealth- They actually like theirs cars and like spending hours sitting in them.

Our company has discussed building small 600 sq.ft. base line condos that would sell for around $120K. Technically affordable- but you won't get a parking space with that. That would be about $200/sq.ft. But I'm not convinced they would sell as well as the bigger units....Its not a model I've seen anywhere...please enlighten me. You can get an a small house or townhouse for that.

[AlaninTally]

I think a lot has to do with getting the mindset straight for downtown living. In larger cities, people don't mind living in cramped smaller units because their downtown is their playground. Coffeeshops, lounges, bars,etc... are their second living rooms.

The suburban mindset says get in your car and haul yer butt outta the downtown and into your two car garage McMansion. (Btw, there is now the term McLoft which is being seen all over the West Coast.)

Affordable housing is always a prickly issue it seems(thank you Jeb for bringing in so many low paying jobs!). Usually, the younger hipper crowd (Generation Debt) doesn't yet have the funds to support the true downtown living experience. But our downtown needs that crowd (as well as the "upwardly mobile minorities" ) in many ways to make the downtown an 18hour playground just as much as we need the affluent people who can now afford the condos being developed. The folks that need affordable housing can visit but can't live and truly participate(contribute) to our downtown. And downtown needs diversity to be vibrant, enjoyable, fun, relevant, etc...

[stjoe]

"Affordable housing is always a prickly issue it seems(thank you Jeb for bringing in so many low paying jobs!). "

Are you serious? Florida and Tally have ALWAYS had low paying jobs...WELL before Jeb Bush. Hell, I would argue there is more money in tally since Jeb has been Gov (now whether he is reasponsible is debatable) I can't even believe this was attempted.

Low paying jobs in Tally is due, and always has been, to a local government that has always been satisfied with state jobs...which regardless of the state are traditionally low paying.

The city did a study and it showed that the best economies have high tech. The COT just doesn't know how to attract high tech. Nothing to do with Jeb.

[DaiDreamer5]

"Affordable housing is always a prickly issue it seems(thank you Jeb for bringing in so many low paying jobs!). "

Are you serious? Florida and Tally have ALWAYS had low paying jobs...WELL before Jeb Bush. Hell, I would argue there is more money in tally since Jeb has been Gov (now whether he is reasponsible is debatable) I can't even believe this was attempted.

Low paying jobs in Tally is due, and always has been, to a local government that has always been satisfied with state jobs...which regardless of the state are traditionally low paying.

The city did a study and it showed that the best economies have high tech. The COT just doesn't know how to attract high tech. Nothing to do with Jeb.

I'm going to have to agree with this one: it's not Gov. Bush's fault. Florida is king of low paying jobs thanks to the tourist industry. The tourist industry is great for bringing in more money but that money is spread out into lots of low paying service jobs.

[AlaninTally]

No I definitely agree the fault does not lay completely on Jeb's shoulders (I guess sarcasm is hard to read on these things ) But he is the figurehead (unfortunately) for our state, so he is gonna take the arrows.

So I hold him accountable nonetheless. His PR machine will spin out that Florida has wonderful job growth, but you barely hear mention that its all low paying service jobs.

I agree our COT needs to be very active in getting high tech jobs to Tally but I think we are slowly but surely on our way.

[poonther]

But he is the figurehead (unfortunately) for our state, so he is gonna take the arrows.

I thought TJ said he "took the arrows" in another post.

Yeah ole JEB! says we add tons and tons of new jobs in FL every year......but he never says that the majority of them are all for hotel maids and fast food workers.

The below table I got from the Leon County Planning 2005 Statistical Digest. Based on it, I'd say St. Joe that there really isn't that much more money in Tally or Florida since JEB!'s been gov. especially when you factor in the inflation rate.

[Florida]

Good work there Poonther. I love evidence that proves a good point.

[cobyguy]

"Affordable housing is always a prickly issue it seems(thank you Jeb for bringing in so many low paying jobs!). "

Are you serious? Florida and Tally have ALWAYS had low paying jobs...WELL before Jeb Bush. Hell, I would argue there is more money in tally since Jeb has been Gov (now whether he is reasponsible is debatable) I can't even believe this was attempted.

Low paying jobs in Tally is due, and always has been, to a local government that has always been satisfied with state jobs...which regardless of the state are traditionally low paying.

The city did a study and it showed that the best economies have high tech. The COT just doesn't know how to attract high tech. Nothing to do with Jeb.

I have to agree on a certain level- with "stjoe" if ol' jeb can find a way for some of his buddies to make a healthy profit he'll jump on it. I hope some of his fellow devs. can figure out how to build residential space on top of the state parking garages.

Being in the "will work for profit" catagory myself.....I happen to currently enjoy a little of the trickle down privatization blessing from the current administration- and his supporters. I only wish I where more closely aligned so I could enjoy the direct effects... Maybe I should have given more.

[Florida]

I hope some of his fellow devs. can figure out how to build residential space on top of the state parking garages.

I second that Cobyguy!

[stjoe]

"I'd say St. Joe that there really isn't that much more money in Tally or Florida since JEB!'s been gov. especially when you factor in the inflation rate."

Yet there is still MORE...not less like some might have implied. Taurean, the evidence proves MY point. Jeb Bush is NOT responsible for low paying jobs in Tallahassee. I think everyone here knows that....but some get caught up in politics and thus emotion.

The lack of high paying jobs is do to Tally and it's long history of not being able to attract high paying jobs. We can debate why, but it has been that way for a LONG while