JCPenney - Hickory Hollow Mall

[memphian]

Okay so I'm sure you know that JCPenney is closing its Hickory Hollow Mall location. What should be courted to fill this anchor space? Even though I am not typically a fan of Belk I do feel they are a good choice. They've just bought Proffitt's in Knoxville and they're opening smaller stores all around Nashville. This might be a good place for them to become a solid anchor and establish themselves as true department store vs. being a smaller format store located in strip centers. If HHM doesn't fill that space quickly you may see a mass-exodus of stores from the mall.

What do you think? (and yes, I'd rather see one downtown but that ain't gonna happen - LOL)

[Lexy]

The mall is already crap IMO. It has begun to cater to the 'urban' crowd. The many stores that once filled its halls are gone, giving way to some local start-ups that will probably never get off the ground. I just get depressed every time I go there. CBL has dropped the ball when it comes to HHM. Look at Rivergate as case and point that CBL has most liekly given up on the place. I look for it to slowly go the same route that Bellvue has gone and eventually be sold to another, smaller managment company.

A Belk would be a good fit there. Dillards is also on the way out too. But, I think that plan has been put on hold for the time being.

[fieldmarshaldj]

As living fairly close to Hickory Hollow Mall, I became one of its greatest "haters" even as a teen in the 1980s (not for any other reason than its contributing to the death of downtown's old department stores) and I even went so far as to put a "curse" on the place and refused to step foot in it for an extremely long time (I won't say how long, but you'd be a might surprised). Odd to see that my curse on the joint is starting to take effect. I guess you guys can blame me if HHM goes belly-up.

[rocket9561]

It's odd how Hickory Hollow has gone down hill so much. Rivergate was so worried when Opry Mills opened but its sales have actually increased well since then. I don't know how the mall will do with the eventual Hendersonville, Gallatin, and Mount Juliet openings but it looks to be in good shape.

[Lexy]

I think CBL is about to sell it off. I seriously believe that. They spent a nominal amount to "renovate" it, and it just didn't help. The demographics have changed for that area so much that a mall of that calibur is hard to have in Antioch anymore. Just perhaps the curse is happening. Who knows. Whatever it is, when the mall goes, so does all that is around it.

[fieldmarshaldj]

I think CBL is about to sell it off. I seriously believe that. They spent a nominal amount to "renovate" it, and it just didn't help. The demographics have changed for that area so much that a mall of that calibur is hard to have in Antioch anymore. Just perhaps the curse is happening. Who knows. Whatever it is, when the mall goes, so does all that is around it.

I'm probably one of only a handful of people who can claim to being a lifelong resident in transient Antioch, and you are certainly right about the demographics. This area was, in the '70s, still semi-rural in nature and almost entirely Caucasian (when HHM was built in '78). After not having stepped in the mall (as I pointed out earlier) until this past year, my jaw almost dropped upon entering into it. Looking at the various folks I walked by, I surmised it was about 50% Black, 30% Hispanic, and 20% Caucasian (surely not a technical breakdown, as there were some Asians in the mix, but probably no more so than there were in the '80s). My ex-fiancee, a Chicago native, worked at HHM at Sears (she herself was hired because she filled several racial quotas, racially mixed to the point to give a Census Bureau worker the dry-heaves) until 2003, and she said she could see daily the shifting demographics (and that fewer and fewer Whites were shopping at the mall), and it wasn't a positive development from a financial standpoint (she was also having to deal with a chronic problem with shoplifting). A lot of the folks that frequent HHM now, too, seem more content to either walk around, hang out, or the like -- everything but purchase items (which is what doomed the infamous Fountain Square mall in MetroCenter).

I contrasted HHM vs. Cool Springs, and CSM is very much what HHM was pre-early 1990s from a demographic standpoint. The simple fact remains that unless HHM can attract a lot of the wealthier Caucasian shoppers that have fled elsewhere (and I can't forsee how that is even possible - it's not the mall's fault, it's the situation in Antioch itself, they are going to continue to slide). It may not be PC to say, but then, I'm anything but (since PC is used as an axe to silence those that speak truths that others don't wish to hear), but this is one of the downsides to diversity.

[rocket9561]

I think CBL is about to sell it off. I seriously believe that. They spent a nominal amount to "renovate" it, and it just didn't help. The demographics have changed for that area so much that a mall of that calibur is hard to have in Antioch anymore. Just perhaps the curse is happening. Who knows. Whatever it is, when the mall goes, so does all that is around it.

I also think a factor could be that retail has been polarized in Nashville between Rivergate and Cool Springs. The Major stores used to be Rivergate-Hickory Hollow-Cool Springs and maybe some other area around town like White Bridge Road or Bellevue but increasingly we are seeing just Rivergate and Cool Springs expansions.

[it's just dave]

I was inside HHM yesterday for the first time in 7 or 8 years. It was the closest Radio Shack on a lunch break. It didn't look so bad mainly because it wasn't crowded at all. I didn't find the salespeople much help or very knowledgeable, but I didn't expect to, either. The only mall I frequent is Green Hills because it's just a nice place to be, usually too expensive for my budget, but I always seem to do okay.

I remember when HHM was built, and yesterday I witnessed its demise. I was somewhat shocked by the closing of J.C. Penney, but it really doesn't matter to me one way or another. I went in thinking I could find some extraordinary bargains. Not. 10 percent does not a store closing make. I finished my business and left. Outside of Sear Automotive, the mall is part of my past, definately not my present.

It's unfortunate what is happening to Antioch with regard to crime and the overall image and perceptions of the area. There are still some very nice things I could say about portions of the place, but some of the old Antioch has taken on the look of a third world country.

And when you see "Jolene" selling Dodges in the recent commercials, you just KNOW the SHE doesn't live there. I bet the commercials are the first time the word "Antioch" ever crossed her pretty lips.

[fieldmarshaldj]

I was inside HHM yesterday for the first time in 7 or 8 years. It was the closest Radio Shack on a lunch break. It didn't look so bad mainly because it wasn't crowded at all.

You point out another problem with HHM. I have been there during the day (anywhere from the 9-5 range) and sometimes it is nearly like a ghost town. Years ago, that used to not be the case. Middle class White women (from younger housewives to older retired types) were often the mainstay, but they have almost fled to the last (again, due to neighborhood demographics - but also partly because of an assumption that they would be "uncomfortable" going to the mall, perceptions of crime, etc., even if in a lot of cases, it is unfounded). My ex used to work the late shift at Sears and said even then that it would often be like a ghost town at night (and she'd be the only one working an entire section of the store, and even on more than a couple occasions was the sole person on an entire FLOOR), and the folks at the corporate office would insist on the local store remaining open until very late even when there were no customers. Makes me wonder how long Sears is going to last.

[DigitalSky]

Belk should!

[memphian]

Yeah so everyone brings up some good points. Sounds to me like the mall will be a lot less like we used to know it in just a few years. I think Macy's will do fine there when they take over Hecht's. We have Macy's in a couple of "depressed" areas here in Memphis and those stores do quite well. Maybe they should just demolish about half of the mall - no reason to keep a big empty shell there (Bellevue should consider the same thing).

[Lexy]

(Bellevue should consider the same thing).

Poor Bellevue. Its a nice place, just forgotten. Now they have this glorious idea that a Wal-Mart Supercenter next door will regenerate the mall. HA! Keep telling yourself that Bellevue.

[memphian]

Poor Bellevue. Its a nice place, just forgotten. Now they have this glorious idea that a Wal-Mart Supercenter next door will regenerate the mall. HA! Keep telling yourself that Bellevue.

word.

[cdarr]

Wow. I can't believe Hickory Hollow has gone down that much. Sad to hear some of the comments. I lived about 10 minutes away in Preist Lake as a teenager, so I was in that place constantly.

HHM's predicament sounds like Hickory Ridge in Memphis. Built in 1981, it was the place to go until Wolfchase opened in 1997. Now it is in the middle of an almost totally black neighborhood, and even though many national chains are still there and its occupancy rate remains healthy, you'll be hard pressed to find a white person who has been there since 2000. People say that the opening of the Carriage Crossing in Collierville will be the death of Hickory Ridge, but why? None of the G'town/C'ville people were shopping at Hickory Ridge, anyway.

Is there still a Harding Mall? What shape is 100 Oaks Mall in? Both malls were in decline when I lived there 17 years ago.

[GaTechGuy]

Is there still a Harding Mall? What shape is 100 Oaks Mall in? Both malls were in decline when I lived there 17 years ago.

Harding Mall limped along forever until last year when it was decided to tear the thing down and build a great big super Walmart there. 100 Oaks Mall basically died I guess back in the 80s? The only store that was open there for a long time was the Burlington Coat Factory and it could only be accessed from the outside (you couldn't go into the mall). Then sometime in the mid 90's someone bought it a redid it. It did all right for a few years and is on another slow decline from what I hear. I suppose the only thing keeping it alive is the great big movie theater next to it. I haven't been there in a few years so I don't know the exact state of it.

[satalac]

they should put a police station in it's place. i'm just kidding. it makes me sad to see it like this. i used to go there a lot when i was younger. it was always packed. same thing with harding mall. now harding is gone and hickory hollow is getting there.

[cdarr]

I was stopped in Nashville last month on the way to the Memphis-UT football game and had lunch at Rivergate Mall. Now, that place has really held on nicely. I was impressed.

Who would have thunk it...Rivergate still doing well while Hickory Hollow and Bellevue are struggling?

[Rural King]

^ I've always like Rivergate. I know it has had a bad reputation at times, but I've always found the mall and surrounding retail to be more of my liking than alot of the other malls in the city. Maybe its the combination of outlets or something.

[it's just dave]

I have to admit I survived a trip to Rivergate on Christmas Eve. I usually go to Rivergate peripheral retail and hit the mall for Sears at their back door. It had been a long, long time since I've actually entered the mall. It looked fine, much better than I'd expected. Dillard's looked good, Hecht's actually looked good, didn't hit Penney's and just walked the various corridors hoping I could eventually find my way out. The place looked full. Not a vacant space in sight and every extra spot occupied by a kiosk of some sort. I can attest to the fact that the people looked a bit different from those I encounter at Green Hills, wait, no, nevermind. Anyway, the trip worked for me just fine. I hope RiverGate continues to do well.

[ohb]

A small observation, one mall in Nashville begins to cater to the urban crowd and now it is considered rundown. Nashville still has a long way to go before the shopping in this city can be diversified. I guess the urban crowd should stay where we belong huh.

[memphian]

I don't agree with you completely. Rivergate is a very good example of diversified retail in Nashville. The mall caters to many different demographics and does so remarkebly well. Whatever formula Rivergate is using is commendable because it has keot the center in business for many years.

In the cases of Bellevue and Hickory Hollow - these two malls are being squeezed by other malls in close proximity (and in Bellevue's case, many ownership changes that have left it with no real identity).

Church Street Centre was just way too far ahead of itself. Fountain Square was a victim of a badly planned area (one that never reached the potential of the original vision).

Just my opinion though.

[satalac]

A small observation, one mall in Nashville begins to cater to the urban crowd and now it is considered rundown. Nashville still has a long way to go before the shopping in this city can be diversified. I guess the urban crowd should stay where we belong huh.

it's considered rundown because nobody goes there anymore. it's not an "urban crowd" issue. take a look at opry mills. it caters to the urban crowd and it's not rundown. nashville has a lot of diverse shopping if you actually look.

[fieldmarshaldj]

In the cases of Bellevue and Hickory Hollow - these two malls are being squeezed by other malls in close proximity (and in Bellevue's case, many ownership changes that have left it with no real identity).

Church Street Centre was just way too far ahead of itself. Fountain Square was a victim of a badly planned area (one that never reached the potential of the original vision).

Just my opinion though.

Living not too far from Hickory Hollow, I don't know what other nearby mall is causing it to be squeezed. Cool Springs is not exactly next door and Rivergate is clear on the other side of town. In HH's case, it is the demographics problem as of late. That was the same with Fountain Square (AKA "The Mistake by the Lake"), although common-sense could've halted its wasteful construction in the first place (plopping a mall in a low-income, high-crime neighborhood rarely ever works - one lady I knew who lived just across the river in East Nashville was terrified to go there and would come all the way out to Hickory Hollow instead).

I personally liked Church Street Centre and the "idea" behind it, but it had the toughest road of all to hoe, aside from the lunchtime workers nearby, there were no people there. It came right during the dark ages of downtown development (the 1987-1995 period). Downtown won't be able to sustain such a project for perhaps another decade or so until we have a critical mass of residents, so you definitely nailed it with its being too far ahead of its time.

[ohb]

Are you kidding me about Rivergate Mall. I live five minutes from it and the only place I can shop is GQ and Ninos, two stores. I have to drive to Hickory Hollow for some variety.

[satalac]

Are you kidding me about Rivergate Mall. I live five minutes from it and the only place I can shop is GQ and Ninos, two stores. I have to drive to Hickory Hollow for some variety.

that doesn't mean that rivergate isn't diverse.