South Carolina's Economic Engine

[goodbye]

It has been amazing to watch Mount Pleasant take off over the last decade to now. I always enjoy my trips to Isle of Palms, but the area is becoming almost too suburban.

[Charleston native]

^^If Mount Pleasant keep growing like it is then it will be the Charleston-North Charleston-Mount Pleasant MSA

If that happens, then I will truly be

[MikesLogic]

What's the criteria to be included in the MSA name?

[Spartan]

Bare minimum for an MSA is a central urban area with at least 50,000. So usually its each place over 50,000 that gets added to the name.

Thats how you get Greenville-Spartanburg-Anderson... each of those cities has an urban core of at least 50,000.

[goodbye]

Hasn't Mount Pleasant already reached that?

[Spartan]

It was something like 47,000 in the last census.

[teshadoh]

The issue with Mount Pleasant being added to 'Charleston - North Charleston' MSA is this - it would have to be a seperate Urbanized Area (which it isn't) or it would have to be a employment center (which I believe it isn't). As for Atlanta, Sandy Springs & Marietta have been added, due to the decentralized employment structure of Atlanta.

But residential suburbs can be added to the MSA title if they are big enough, as is the case with a few MSA's in Florida where the largest city is the suburb of the smaller city. That is also the case with Norfolk, where Virginia Beach is included, & the Urbanized Area is in fact named after.

[Charleston native]

Mt. P is definitely not an employment center, though it seems to have gained more businesses and will continue to do especially at the base of the Ravenel bridge. The town seems to have many residents commuting to the north area or DT for work, hence the reason for building the new bridge. The population stat is the only one that I feel could put the town's name into the MSA.

Here's a question to ponder: if Chas and the north city merged after Mt. P was added to the MSA, what would happen? Would Mt. P lose its designation or would it remain?

[Topher1]

Here's a question to ponder: if Chas and the north city merged after Mt. P was added to the MSA, what would happen? Would Mt. P lose its designation or would it remain?

Most likely Mt. P would be removed from the designation in this hypothetical case. I'll use the Augusta MSA for example. Prior to Augusta-Richmond county's consolidation, Augusta was a city of ~45,000 people. Since Aiken was a comparable sized city (~20,000 then), it was included in the MSA name: Augusta-Aiken GA-SC.

In the 2003 MSA designations, after Augusta had consolidated into a city of 200,000 people, Aiken was dropped from the MSA name: Augusta-Richmond County, GA-SC. However, since neighboring Columbia county is also considering consolidating into a 100,000+ city, my guess is that by 2010, the MSA will be known as Augusta-Evans, GA-SC.

[krazeeboi]

I think Aiken was dropped because of the city-county consolidation; I don't think it quite works the same way if two cities were to merge, but I could be wrong.

[Topher1]

^ It was basically because the population of Augusta was so much greater than Aiken's after the consolidation. When the two cities had comparable populations, both were included in the MSA name. Likewise if Chas and N. Chas were to merge, their combined population would dwarf Mt Pleasant, and they wouldn't need to share naming rights with Mt P.

[krazeeboi]

Well what about Charlotte-Gastonia-Concord MSA? Charlotte's municipal population is about 10 times as large as that of the next largest city, Gastonia. I know there are rules governing the naming process, I'm just not familiar with them.

[Spartan]

Its actually "Charlotte-Gastonia-Concord-Rock Hill, NC-SC.... I suspect that may have to do with them being in separate counties. Its usually obvious when there is a population center.

[krazeeboi]

When was Rock Hill re-added? According to what I've seen from the MSA listings from Census.gov, it's "Charlotte-Gastonia-Concord."

[Spartan]

Ah. I didn't know it had been removed. I didn't think that Concord had such a significant presence.

[teshadoh]

^ Based on population - Concord edged out Rock Hill in size.

[krazeeboi]

But Rock Hill has been adding people faster than Concord has since 2000--which leads me to believe that Rock Hill will regain its rightful place in the MSA designation in the 2010 census.

[teshadoh]

I think Rock Hill shouldn't settle itself as just being the number 3 boy for Charlotte - break away RH! Everyone including you & RHJames should quit your jobs for the yankee carpetbaggers & find a job at a mill that is still in operation, or at least walmart!

[krazeeboi]

Hey, with the way my job is going now, I just may end up employed in Rock Hill once again.

[monsoon]

I believe it is based on county population not city population. However when they choose the name, they always use the largest city in the county. I can believe that Cabarrus is growing faster than York. There is an enormous amount of development around the speedway & Concord Mills on I-85N where there really isn't anything comparable across the line on I-77 in N. York county.

[krazeeboi]

^The Census Bureau goes by municipal population, because York County is more populous than Cabarrus County. Also, I remember around the time that it happened, an article appeared in the Rock Hill Herald which criticized SC's annexation laws as one of the reasons why Concord edged out Rock Hill. I forget exactly when this happened, but both Rock Hill and York County have grown faster since 2000.

From census.gov:

Cabarrus County

2000: 131,063

2004: 146,135

Increase of 15,072 or 11.49%

Concord

2000: 55,977

2004: 59,960

Increase of 3,983 or 7.11%

York County

2000: 164,614

2004: 183,762

Increase of 19,148 or 11.63%

Rock Hill

2000: 49,765

2004: 57,902

Increase of 8,137 or 16.35%

[GvilleSC]

I just kind of thought these numbers were impressive, so I stole them from another thread. Look at the Growth that Greenville is experiencing...

YEAR BUILDING PERMITS

2001 2032

2002 2032

2003 2099

2004 2326

2005 2896

Source: Lee Polowczuk, Greenville County spokesperson & Greenville News

[goodbye]

This shows a dramatic snowball effect - much larger increases each year. That is tremendous economic success.

[GvilleSC]

Michelin announced that it will expand its Greenville plant. It's the third expansion announced in the past three months!

"We have an outstanding work force and our productivity continues to improve at Michelin North America's facilities, especially in South Carolina. The result of that is we continue to invest in our South Carolina facilities."

Jerry Howard, president of the Greenville Area Development Corp., agreed. The "very significant" Michelin announcement "says Michelin has a lot of confidence in South Carolina and a lot of confidence in the Upstate. It says to me this is long-term in nature."

[The_sandlapper]

Okay not tryin to start a fight here as far as I'm concerned I've buried the hatchet but I saw this article today in the "Greenville News" and thought it was worth mentioning. Appearantly the Greenville economy is not in as good shape as many believe.

Some quotes:

"Greenville's economy has not performed as well as many perceive," the report said.

Greenville's job growth is lower than the nation, region and comparable communities and its inflation-adjusted per capita income is dropping, according to the report prepared by an Atlanta-based consulting firm.

And "mistrust and tension" between city and county elected officials and questions about the Greater Greenville Chamber of Commerce's willingness to represent the entire county are barriers to a unified economic development strategy, the report said.

They also were concerned the split sent a powerful message to the world that if local government and the business community can't get along, this was not a good place to do business.

So is this because the city and the county are just unable to come together, are they still waring over territory?

Any thoughts protest or concerns?

Greenville Economy