Illegal Immigration

[ShowMeKC]

What do you think of Illegal Immigration and how do you think they should deal with it?

Personally, I think we should extend the border patrol lines but, create special areas where illegal immigrants can enter the USA "legally" and be accepted as Americans. If a situation is bad enough in someones country that its people want to leave for another then why don't we allow them in? We don't have to be like the rest of the world where you have to have some sort of passport or something. As long as the immigrant doesn't have a criminal record in the USA or his/her former country.

And another detail would be that they wouldn't have to pay anything to enter.

[Scott]

I agree that people who are good citizens in their homeland should be allowed to enter this country easier, particularly if they have a job. Statistically immigration is very good for this country.

[M II A II R II K]

I don't how much the baby boomer phenomenon applies in the US. If in 20-30 years they start to take a toll on the healthcare system and leave

[M. Brown]

Its hard to say

[Wendell FOX]

I'm not sure I like the idea of a buffer zone for illegal immigrants to come in temporarily, as it would lead to greatly lower real estate prices in these zones. I agree that the financial burden of immigration should be lowered to encourage them from forcing themselves to come over illegally, but as much as I'd love to open borders being an immigrant (originally to the US) myself there has to be regulations to keep only the most willing to work in.

It's sort of interesting that open immigration is considered a "liberal" issue, yet most of the forumers at SSP are much against it whereas KCDevin supports it. Then again, when did the left-right spectrum ever make sense?

[bthomas]

Minefields.

[M. Brown]

Minefields.

funny

[Dan]

So what's everyone's opinion on this hot and controversial topic?

We all know that that ~ 1,000 people are entering the US illegally every day. Our government services, hospitals, and other resources funded with our tax dollars are being exploited. We've seen the rallies, the Mexican flags waving, we've even heard some people say that illegal aliens have a "right" to be here.

Today is May 1st and illegal aliens nationwide are being asked to take the day off from work or school, boycott businesses, and refrain from alcohol consumption and the use of computers and telephones. Some business owners have received threats of retaliatory action if they operate as usual on Monday. Do you believe this is right?

The politicians on both sides of the aisle have done nothing to improve the security of our country, and only amnesty is currently being considered.

What's your take on A Day Without Illegal Immigrants and how should the problem at the border be solved?

[monsoon]

Well, I find it interesting how much the corporations are behind letting the illegal immigrants stay in the USA. Case in point the media (local & national) Ever notice how they completely stay away from terms "illegal immigrant" and "illegal immigration" and instead prefer to simply refer to these people as "immigrants"? The only exception to this are the afternoon programs on CNN which rightfully call these protests what they are. Protests by Illegal immigrants, who are breaking the law, to get special rights to stay in this country. Pay attention to your local TV station and see how many actually have the nerve to say this.

[dimebag1980]

Well, I find it interesting how much the corporations are behind letting the illegal immigrants stay in the USA. Case in point the media (local & national) Ever notice how they completely stay away from terms "illegal immigrant" and "illegal immigration" and instead prefer to simply refer to these people as "immigrants"? The only exception to this are the afternoon programs on CNN which rightfully call these protests what they are. Protests by Illegal immigrants, who are breaking the law, to get special rights to stay in this country. Pay attention to your local TV station and see how many actually have the nerve to say this.

Well, they do benefit from the cheap labor. Regardless, it's inexcusable in my eyes.

They not only refer to them as "immigrants," but also as "undocumented workers." No one wants to admit it's a problem. And I would bet none of my local TV stations will call them illegals. On my way in this morning, even the radio news guy was calling them "immigrants."

[damus]

It's gonna be an ungodly problem in cities near the border such as LA. Here, hopefully it'll be a laughable turnout. What on Earth are we gonna do without someone to haul our garbage away at the end of the work day? These people feel entitled to citizenship and I take this whole May Day protest thing as a threat. If the government had any balls (or lack of business/potential voter interests) they'd send out the national guard to these things and round up as many as they can.

The Mexican government should be held responsible too. They "don't encourage" illegal immigration to the US, but they hand out supplies and give instructions for how to make a safe trip when they come across these people.

[hood]

I think that we should take much harsher measures to enforce our borders against illegals. We should begin a program to either deport illegals currently here or document them properly. I also think that illegals should not be allowed in our schools, social programs or hospitals (unless life or death situation). Either they can become documented and pay their taxes or they can get nothing and be deported.

[Dan]

I agree with monsoon.

I just watched WPRI 5:00 news and they're calling them immigrants, of course.

The thing that bothers me is the rallying in Spanish. I'm an American and I speak and read English, and illegal aliens who have come here want to be Americans. So that means while they protest, they are speaking to you and I, the people who will vote to determine their ultimate fate.

Its too bad most of us aren't getting the message. All we see are Mexican flags and angry people getting a free ride on our dime who don't care to embrace our culture.

[GRCentro]

I hope HR 4437 fully fails. It is a huge, expensive mess.

Very few Americans seem to realize how much damage this proposal is creating between the U.S. and Latin America. Most don't care to know, unfortunately.

It amazes me how pompous some Americans can get. We get hung up on our own created definitions, emphasizing that they're illegal and not good citizens like us! We say, speak my language or get out and they don't care about my culture! Are we really that afraid?

I'd suggest we re-evaluate our attitudes. Hispanic America is growing and here to stay.

[damus]

I hope HR 4437 fully fails. It is a huge, expensive mess.

Very few Americans seem to realize how much damage this proposal is creating between the U.S. and Latin America. Most don't care to know, unfortunately.

It amazes me how pompous some Americans can get. We get hung up on our own created definitions, emphasizing that they're illegal and not good citizens like us! We say, speak my language or get out and they don't care about my culture! Are we really that afraid?

I'd suggest we re-evaluate our attitudes. Hispanic America is growing and here to stay.

Umm.. they aren't good citizens. They're illegal immigrants. I'm not afraid, I'm mad. How do you figure that being against Illegal Immigration means you're afraid of Latin Americans? How is being against people breaking the law being pompous? They came into the country, breaking the law. They show so little respect for America's laws that they broke the law to come in here, and are now demanding that we give them citizenship. Don't compare this to the race problem this country had. This is completely different, now we have a group of people who came here to exploit our system. A lot of them are making no effort to assimilate. F*ck them.

Wages for low paying, low skilled jobs have become artificially lower because of these people.They put a huge strain on our hospitals and schools. California is so pathetic they allow for illegals to get drivers licenses. Speaking of cars, there are cars stolen by people crossing the border every night. How stupid would you feel if you were an immigrant who came in here the right way and then all these people had to do to get amnesty was take May Day, a communist holiday btw, off?

We are one of the most accepting societies in the world, but this is just plain wrong and I'm glad most Americans are against this crap. I'm pretty sure there's no famine in Mexico, why not work to make that country better while you wait to come in here legally? This problem isn't going away soon, even if we cut off all the jobs for illegals I'm sure a lot of them would stay. Some would probably become homeless.

In my opinion we also need to get rid of that policy that makes you an instant citizen if you're born here. How about at least one of your parents is a citizen?

[GRCentro]

Umm.. they aren't good citizens. They're illegal immigrants...A lot of them are making no effort to assimilate. F*ck them.

As I said, this is definition we've created and some, at least, seem intent on using it foster division. Why are they "illegal?" Because we make laws that prevent appropriate access to legal immigration.

And what is assimilation? Not speaking Spanish? Not eating burritos? Why aren't they "good citizens like the rest of us?" Is it because they don't have national pride, aren't actively involved in their communities, and don't wish to participate in and contribute to American society? No. It's only because they don't have a special little piece of paper typed out in English.

The best solution now is to provide oppurtunity for proper legal documentation, if not citizenship. That will ensure fair wages and provide a system for taxes, among other things. Then, instead of building a $2.2 billion physical and political wall between the U.S. and Latin America, the money could be used to free up the backlogs in processing legal immigration. Or, it could be used to increase the U.S. government's investment in the economic development of Latin America so that more jobs are created and poverty doesn't force Latinos out of their countries in order to find work.

It is ridiculous to claim that Latinos don't make effort to assimilate when you don't even want to give them the chance. "F*ck them"? I'll take that personally, because that's what you meant to say.

signed,

a proud Hispanic American

[damus]

I'm sorry if you took that personally. My comment was aimed towards the people who should not be here but are exploiting our system for all its worth, the illegal immigrants. Why should it be the US's job to provide jobs with Latin Americans? You are right that "Illegal Immigrant" is a definition. There are something called laws in this country, specifically immigration laws. If you think we are being unfair with our laws, bring it up with your congressman. When you have millions of people who are lucky that this country has let them stay so far by turning a blind eye coming out and demanding citizenship, that is wrong. I'll say it again, there are people who come to the USA through the legal process, and it would be a slap in the face to them if illegals were granted citizenship.

I believe Mexico, part of NAFTA and oil rich, has a government that doesn't seem to do anything to build a middle class and has given the "wink and nod" approach to people migrating to the USA illegally.

from dictionary.com

as

[Snowguy716]

Damus.. are you a Native American?

If so, rock on. If not, I'll ignore everything you just said and throw it in the burn barrel.

I guess that's a little harsh, but:

If this country (especially right winged America) wasn't fostering such an atmosphere of low wages and cut throat business, we wouldn't have a problem of immigrants pouring in looking for jobs. This is a lose-lose situation:

The democrats want liveable wages and lots of immigrants: Not feasible.

The Republicans want cheap labor and are split about the immigration issue: One side sees that they need immigrants to keep the status quo and the other side is just pissed off and ready to stand at the border with a gun. I personally do not understand this.. but then again I come from northern Minnesota and frankly there aren't many Canadians rushing over the border.

I think we should make the immigration process much easier. Allow them to "register" with the government once they have employment and then they can stay indefinitely as long as they are in the process of gaining a greencard/citizenship. The illegal immigrants already here should be able to seek citizenship immediately.

Those that do not have the will to work, etc. should be sent back. Children born in the U.S, however, should have the right to citizenship and the right to an education and healthcare just like the rest of us. The problem is: Often it happens that they are born here and their home country will not grant them citizenship and they are then essentially homeless. The U.S has the heart to say, hey.. you were brought forth from the womb on our soil, on our soil you shall stay. I think that's very generous of our country and it's one of the things that makes me proud to be an American.

This is about peoples' lives. If they really want to come here to make a better life and want to become Americans, then we should be standing with arms wide open. If not, then you're right. Send them back. But building a massive wall won't do anything but create more divisions.

Remember how much we hated the Iron Curtain? We're essentially doing the whole process in reverse. If Republicans are so free-trade and borderless world as they claim to be, then another wall is completely counter-productive to their ideology.

[Dan]

First, I'd like to point out that the mainstream liberal media has equated this to a civil rights rally which could not be further from the truth. Immigrants have no problem with our laws. Illegal immigrants are the problem here.

Why are they "illegal?" Because we make laws that prevent appropriate access to legal immigration.

So if you don't like the laws of the land, just break them? These aliens are lucky the US doesn't enforce its laws during these ridiculous demonstrations. They'd all be going back to Mexico.

instead of building a $2.2 billion physical and political wall between the U.S. and Latin America, the money could be used to free up the backlogs in processing legal immigration. Or, it could be used to increase the U.S. government's investment in the economic development of Latin America so that more jobs are created and poverty doesn't force Latinos out of their countries in order to find work.

It isn't the job of the US to stimulate economic growth in depressed areas of the world for the benefit of people in other countries. This is the people's job.

You basically just pointed out the single biggest problem which these rallies demonstrate. 12 million people are breaking the law and they believe that if they unite and protest and demand rights which as aliens they obviously are not entitled to, they can strongarm the gov into giving them what they want after taking the American taxpayers for a ride.

It is ridiculous to claim that Latinos don't make effort to assimilate when you don't even want to give them the chance.

This is their chance, and they are going about it horribly wrong. In fact, immigrants who have attained citizenship are more fired up about these protests than the rest of America, and they ought to be. There are millions of Latino-Americans who came here legally, learned our language, obey our laws, pay taxes, vote, and work hard to achieve the American dream. This is the same chance my grandparents were given when they came to this country. And now the gov is being compelled to allow 12 million people to cut the line.

What kind of a message does this send?

[damus]

Damus.. are you a Native American?

If so, rock on. If not, I'll ignore everything you just said and throw it in the burn barrel.

I guess that's a little harsh, but:

If this country (especially right winged America) wasn't fostering such an atmosphere of low wages and cut throat business, we wouldn't have a problem of immigrants pouring in looking for jobs. This is a lose-lose situation:

The democrats want liveable wages and lots of immigrants: Not feasible.

The Republicans want cheap labor and are split about the immigration issue: One side sees that they need immigrants to keep the status quo and the other side is just pissed off and ready to stand at the border with a gun. I personally do not understand this.. but then again I come from northern Minnesota and frankly there aren't many Canadians rushing over the border.

I think we should make the immigration process much easier. Allow them to "register" with the government once they have employment and then they can stay indefinitely as long as they are in the process of gaining a greencard/citizenship. The illegal immigrants already here should be able to seek citizenship immediately.

Those that do not have the will to work, etc. should be sent back. Children born in the U.S, however, should have the right to citizenship and the right to an education and healthcare just like the rest of us. The problem is: Often it happens that they are born here and their home country will not grant them citizenship and they are then essentially homeless. The U.S has the heart to say, hey.. you were brought forth from the womb on our soil, on our soil you shall stay. I think that's very generous of our country and it's one of the things that makes me proud to be an American.

This is about peoples' lives. If they really want to come here to make a better life and want to become Americans, then we should be standing with arms wide open. If not, then you're right. Send them back. But building a massive wall won't do anything but create more divisions.

Remember how much we hated the Iron Curtain? We're essentially doing the whole process in reverse. If Republicans are so free-trade and borderless world as they claim to be, then another wall is completely counter-productive to their ideology.

I never said anything about a wall. And I didn't say anything about being a Republican. I've said on this board many times already that I am a Libertarian who leans Republican only when voting (even with the retard in office now, we really need alternatives). No, I'm not a Native American, but my ancestors came here legally. The laws were different then and I'm not arguing with anyone who thinks it should be changed. My beef is with people coming into this country by breaking the law, then demanding citizenship. I would love to see business weaned off illegal immigrant employment. I recognize that it's hard to round up all these people, and the impact on the ecomony wouldn't be pleasant. If there was a way we could absolutely guarantee that illegals will not be employed in the country ever again then I'd happily concede to let the illegals in the country now to stay. At least the problem would be solved.

I think "cut throat" business is fine, though not ethical, when they follow the laws. Let the courts decide when the company has overstepped its bounds. Our companies need a competitive spirit to thrive. I also said before, with the fact that these immigrants even if they become illegal are putting a huge strain on our schools and hospitals. Their tax dollars do not usually add up to pay for their own kids' education, and even if they become legal most of them would probably not have health insurance. If we gave 12 million people amnesty I'd be the number of people coming over would increase dramatically. The burden will fall on the middle class and the "top 5%" types to pay for the services that these people would require.

This border is also a national security issue. Why do we have so much security at our airports when our borders are so pourous?

[monsoon]

If they make it a felony to employ illegals the problem will be solved. The so called "immigrants", aka illegal aliens, will simply go home on their own when the jobs dry up. Nobody would need to be deported. People who want them here for cheap labor don't like to mention this alternative.

BTW, keep in mind that every one of these illegals is using stolen social security #'s to get work.

[damus]

If they make it a felony to employ illegals the problem will be solved. The so called "immigrants", aka illegal aliens, will simply go home on their own when the jobs dry up. Nobody would need to be deported. People who want them here for cheap labor don't like to mention this alternative.

BTW, keep in mind that every one of these illegals is using stolen social security #'s to get work.

I can't help but wonder if this will only make the homeless problem worse. Imagine if 1/10 of the people who can no longer work stay.... it'll be like de-institutionalization all over again.

[GRCentro]

should it be the US's job to provide jobs for Latin Americans?

It isn't the job of the US to stimulate economic growth in depressed areas of the world for the benefit of people in other countries.

Yes, it is.

U.S. Agency for International Development

[Miesian Corners]

I used to know where I stood on the issue, but now I know people who are here legally and am acutely aware at how difficult it has been for them to get residency. It is not fair to those who go through all the bureaucratic hell to be here legally and then have our government suddenly grant amnesty to all who came here illegally (without even trying to go through the legal process).

That said, we must have a new way to allow low-skilled labor the ability to come and work in the United States. Currently, only 5,000 low-skilled people are granted work visas per year. 5,000 doesn't begin to cover the amount of low-wage, low-skilled workers who come to my little part of the universe on an annual basis, much less the entire country. We need a guest worker program like most western European and wealthy Middle Eastern countries.

[CtownMikey]

I didnt bother to read anything about this strike/march that took place yesterday. All i know is that the topic is ILLEGAL immigrants. Illegals. Illegal immigrantion.... illegal. so where is the argument? we have laws.. if something is illegal in this country, you pay a price. PERIOD

Yes, this country is a melting pot and was "founded" on 99.9% LEGAL immigration from Europe way back when.. key word being legal. We all became citizens and paid our taxes.

If I understand correctly. Illegal immigrants pay no taxes.. because how can you pay a tax if the goverment doesnt know who you are or that you exist? According to wikipedia.. U.S. public school have to accept a child with no question of citizenship as well as hosptial being forced to accept any human being in need of hospitalization. Hospitals have shut down due to a deficit for paying those costs that immigrants cannot cover.. and WE PAY TAXES for the schooling of people who have no right YET to be here..

SO HOW CAN ANYONE ARGUE THAT THESE ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS have ANY rights? Become legal or get the hell out. This economy will be fine without them... those estimated 11 million will leave, and we'll replace their jobs with people who are out of work and LEGAL (hoping we would want those crap jobs )

so what should be done? Come up with a system to find these illegals.. give them two options. Stay and become a citizen who pays taxes or get out. Imagine this country with 12 million more people paying taxes... that is a lot of money for us