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Encore has to wait...

it's just dave

By it's just dave
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bzorch Whistle-Stop

bzorch

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I should have clarified that not every building must offer a plaza or park, but we need public space. The two examples of downtown parks are the results of their circumstances. Hilton Park is surrounded by uses that do not help populate it nor are there many residences within walking distances (at least not the critical mass we are talking about). The park is not programmed continually by the Parks Department in order to attract a constant stream of users. I do wish they would add tables and chairs in some areas and prevent the hotel from parking along the edge.

As for the park across from the library, it has some of the same problems of a lack of potential users, but it has design flaws that exasperate the problems. The park creates places that you can easily hide and it is difficult to see into.

The timing of this issues is interesting because the film tonight at the Civic Design Center mentioned by MississippiYuppie http://www.civicdesigncenter.org/Events-filmvideo.html does a great job of addressing this issue. Here is a quote by William H. Whyte:

"So-called 'undesirables are not the problem. It is the measures taken to combat them that is the problem... The best way to handle the problem of undesirebles is to make the place attractive to everyone else."

--William H. Whyte

He goes on to prove through meticulous observation what make parks successful and unsuccessful. I highly recommend the film or the book of the same name.

Do we agree that public space is important to a successful urban mixed-use neighborhood? I hope so. We should not throw the baby out with the bath water just because of some problems that we are having. We should learn from out mistakes in hopes of not repeating them again.

Guidelines are necessary to guide development, but I was pointing out that they sometimes can be a hindrance to creating a successful project. Ultimately, when this happen, you must make your case and participate in the democratic process to change the guidelines. I do not think the SoBro charrette publication has produces binding guidelines. So only the zoning is in place. I do not think there is an Urban Design Overlay.

I read the article from the BizJournal, I did not see anything about a 40story tower on Broadway. I did see they were refurbishing the old Heilig-Meyers Furniture Building.

This topic has gone in many directions. What got this really going was trying to understand the benefits of high-rises/towers. As far as I can surmise from the post, they are important to the success of urban mixed-use neighborhood for the following reasons:

1. They are a marvel of engineering.

2. They reflect the success of a city by creating a great skyline.

3. They add more people to downtown.

4. They offer a product that is desirable to future homebuyers

Does that sum it up?

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NewTowner Hamlet

NewTowner

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This topic has gone in many directions. What got this really going was trying to understand the benefits of high-rises/towers. As far as I can surmise from the post, they are important to the success of urban mixed-use neighborhood for the following reasons:

1. They are a marvel of engineering.

2. They reflect the success of a city by creating a great skyline.

3. They add more people to downtown.

4. They offer a product that is desirable to future homebuyers

Let's not forget this ridiculous little motivator:

5. They provide "Big City" feelings due to Picturesque associations established via film and television (think "Stourhead", but starring Will Smith)

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smeagolsfree Gigalopolis

smeagolsfree

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By the way, this is a little off topic, but the lot on 4th just before you get to the new Hampton Inn going up is fenced off. Is this for the Hampton Inn as well or do we have something else under construction there too? I ask because it is across the street from the Hampton Inn site and there are a couple of construction trailers there .

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ATLBrain Burg

ATLBrain

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By the way, this is a little off topic, but the lot on 4th just before you get to the new Hampton Inn going up is fenced off. Is this for the Hampton Inn as well or do we have something else under construction there too? I ask because it is across the street from the Hampton Inn site and there are a couple of construction trailers there .

Check out IJDave's thread on the SoBro Perspective. I think he has a pic of that site. If it's the same one you're talking about, then it's the site of Encore I. Which brings me to my question: When is Encore going before the BZA again? I thought I had heard sometime in March.

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smeagolsfree Gigalopolis

smeagolsfree

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Thanks< I just saw the thread. I had surgery yesterday and I am trying to catch up on everything. I don't think these trailers are for the Encore because it will be located on third and Demonbreun and this is on further south. I think maybe it could be for the Hampton Inn, but I am not for sure.

Just remember guys, from what I have read in this thread Metro is only disputing some 30 odd feet of the Encore. So there is a 80 to 90 % chance this baby is going up. I am glad this has sparked one of the best threads I have ever seen on here and no one has gotten their feathers ruffled. Congratulation's to a civil constructive thread and know one was banned for something they said.

I don't think you guys will be upset when the Encore breaks ground and maybe some of the insight shown here can guide future development in Nashville. We can make a difference.

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ATLBrain Burg

ATLBrain

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I am glad this has sparked one of the best threads I have ever seen on here and no one has gotten their feathers ruffled. Congratulation's to a civil constructive thread and know one was banned for something they said.

I don't think you guys will be upset when the Encore breaks ground and maybe some of the insight shown here can guide future development in Nashville. We can make a difference.

Right on... this thread took on a life of its own and reminded me of the very good discussions I've seen in the Arkansas forum. Too many of the threads on UP are "Rah... rah... rah..." garbage and offer little food for thought, but this one I liked a lot.

Hope you have a speedy recovery, Smeagolsfree.

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bzorch Whistle-Stop

bzorch

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Did anyone notice the new design guidelines for SoBRo that are up for approval today at the Planning Commission? There was an article in the City Paper.

Link to City Paper Article

Link to Staff Report fro 2/23 Planning Commission

Here is an excerpt:

The proposed amendment consists of changes to the Downtown Community Plan,

...by adding the paragraphs under

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smeagolsfree Gigalopolis

smeagolsfree

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I am not real sure about this but I think that is why the Encore had to be scaled back from 23 to 20 stories and will be within the 220' range. From what I understand the Encore will be given approval on March 2nd planning commission meeting. I agree there needs to be a guideline for the SO-Bro area. I am curious to know if they will change the guidelines for the new convention HQ hotel if the CC is built. They will have to have a minimum of 1000 rooms and parking for as well.

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Hankster Town

Hankster

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I am not real sure about this but I think that is why the Encore had to be scaled back from 23 to 20 stories and will be within the 220' range. From what I understand the Encore will be given approval on March 2nd planning commission meeting. I agree there needs to be a guideline for the SO-Bro area. I am curious to know if they will change the guidelines for the new convention HQ hotel if the CC is built. They will have to have a minimum of 1000 rooms and parking for as well.

My sentiments exactly! I was thinking the same thing when I was reading the proposed guidelines. I would expect a mega-Hotel to accompany the new Convention Center if it is built. I would not be surprised if the SoBro guidelines aren't rewitten again should that project get the go ahead.

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ATLBrain Burg

ATLBrain

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OK, I'm going to assume that Nashville is pretty much like Atlanta here. As I understand the situation with Tony and the Encore, he has taken this to the Board of Zoning Appeals (BZA) meaning that he's appealing the recommendations that are in place at the moment. So he's trying to get his permit to go up to 23 floors. With their blessing, he'll get the zoning variance.

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ATLBrain Burg

ATLBrain

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No, he's going to drop to 20. That explains the new configuration of the rendering and why there's already construction trailers on the lot. He's worked really hard on this and it'll be all the better for it.

The next hearing is March 2. Things will get cooking then. Not a problem.

Aah... then I guess it's a shoe-in. Thanks for the correction.

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Hankster Town

Hankster

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Is this ENCORE on Bidclerk?

It's a 23 story building with 600 units!!!!!!!!!!

http://www.bidclerk.com/projects/projectDe...be-780d039ea7bb

Doesn't it go before BZA tomorrow?

I guess it could be, but I was thinking that the project will be only 20 Stories and no more than 220 Ft high due to the new zoning regulations for SoBro. Also, that's quite a bit more units than have been planned for Encore. The Encore is listed at 21 stories and only 300 units on giarratana.com. We now know that there will not be another equally sized Encore II.

If it's not, I'm very puzzled as to what it could be? 23 Floors....600Units....Construction starting in April 2006! Wow! How about the West End Summit project....mmmm....I doubt that though. Does anyone have any ideas?

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Guest

Guest

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Sounds like it but what is that 26ish units per floor plate avg unit sq ft 1500 (maybe high) plus common area (+10%) 43000 sq ft per level. No way that would make this development around 2 1/2 times larger than the new SunTrust Plaza.

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MidTenn1 Town

MidTenn1

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The maps on the Bid Clerk site seem to show the location of the proposed building as being on Second Avenue at Union Street across from the new Metro Courthouse Square. Such a building would look good there. However, there has not even been a rumor of such a project.

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smeagolsfree Gigalopolis

smeagolsfree

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This may be the mystery tower that I think AtlBrain spoke about earlier in the year. The difference here between the ICON and The Encore is that number one this is 23 stories and number 2 it is 600 units. The Encore in both phases were only suppose to have 600 and the Icon is 430 approx. This may be a new proposal or a misplaced old one. Very interesting.

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smeagolsfree Gigalopolis

smeagolsfree

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Just spoke to William and this bid is for both phase of the Encore. We dont know if there are immediate plans to build the second phase right away, but they are both being bid at one time and on a side note to this project is that it goes in front of the board of zoning appeals today.

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