Brikyaat Development Project

[twoshort]

This sounds VERY cool. Quick question, as I know nothing about any of these kinds of things, who pays for this? Is this done though grants and stuff?

[GrandRiverCityKid]

Include a way to get rid of Spike and Mike's and I'm in.

[twoshort]

Include a way to get rid of Spike and Mike's and I'm in.

OK, I'll ask, what's wrong w/ Spike and Mikes?

[MAU]

I live one hood over (Hillcrest/FH) and i think some changes made would be great, although i'd still like to hear exactly what changes are discussing being made. That article didn't really say anything.

This might seem minor, but the biggest thing i'd like to see happen is a light at Fuller and Fountain to be used only during market hours, especially on Saturdays. It gets downright dangerous there - especially when you're trying to cross there on foot.

[Rizzo]

GridGirl, You actually call yourselves "beotches?" Holly politically incorrect batman!

[GRGridGirl]

Yes, we are an upcoming community-based social organization of women between the ages of 23-40+ who live along Fountain Street, her intersecting avenues, and her immediate parallel sisters streets. We either go by FSB's or Fancy B's. We give a new positive meaning to the B-word when used in context of the FSB's or Fancy B's.

[Rizzo]

Well, I hope you Beotches are sucessful in whatever you do. I am assuming this is a woman's issue organization. With the growing number of social organizations what sets yours apart from the rest? Is this mostly community activism just in the general area bounded by thoes streets?

[Mark Miller]

I will try to answer some of GRGuy's questions. I appreciate your convictions and desire to have urban places.

Is knocking over blocks of low income housing (populated with many immigrants and members of minority communities) the best idea to improve this neighborhood?

The short answer to your question is no.

This has been an ongoing concern during our process and we have been very cognizant of it during our planning efforts. The entire reason for doing the charrette and the neighborhood plan was to avoid the wholesale demolition of this neighborhood akin to what happened on Michigan Street, when 40 homes were acquired and knocked down for a medical complex. This development on Michigan displaced many lower income people and destroyed some pretty decent urban housing stock. In creating the Brickyaat neighborhood plan, the long term hope is that a high percentage of the people currently living there can stay...if they so desire. The plan is to preserve many current single family lots and homes. We have an infill plan that shows the amount of new fabric that is being planned along with the existing fabric that is to remain. Surprisingly there is a lot of existing stuff that is remaining.

In addition to preserving housing stock, our plan also adds a big variety of housing, including apartments above the retail, townhouses, two-family units, small cottage units and larger single family homes. Hopefully this variety will allow for a broader socio-economic spectrum of citizens.

I say hopefully, because we as planners can not guarantee what the free market will do as this neighborhood changes. We can only plan for the best circumstances creating a framework that will allow for variety of housing units.

Seaside, the poster child for New Urbanism, was originally platted in the early 1980s and the lots sold for around $40,000 to $60,000. Houses now sell for millions of dollars. This change is not so much the fault of DPZ, the designers, but rather a strong desire of people with lots of money to live in Seaside. In fact, there is currently strong pressure to tear down some of the existing housing and replace it with bigger houses. (A similar phenomenon is happening in EGR.) In Seaside there were many accessory units, like apartments above garages, even these have become out of sight as far as their price. This has happened in almost every NU community. Kentlands, outside of Washington DC has had similar issues, despite the best attempts of the planners who designed the community. NU has gotten the label as being elitist, but that was not the original intent, it is just that there is currently not enough supply to meet demand and the cost is reflective of that.

The midtown neighborhood has many qualities that middle class and even upper class people are beginning to desire. Urban, walk-able, connected, uniqueness, character, and its proximity to downtown, the farmer

[GRGridGirl]

GRguy,

The next planning meeting is on February 13th at the Salvation Army, off of Fuller, at 7pm.

-FSB

"Although not everyone has a big yard or off street parking...your neighborhood is amazing. In what other area of Grand Rapids can someone find an affordable home with charm and character? How many of your friends or co-workers live in a home that is within walking distance of the grocery store, a bakery, a football stadium, the farmers market, a historic cemetery, thriving businesses; and is also a 2 minute drive from downtown, the theater, the arena, the river, festivals and the many of the museums?" -MNA

[CHM]

This sounds VERY cool. Quick question, as I know nothing about any of these kinds of things, who pays for this? Is this done though grants and stuff?

This project is funded by grants from the Grand Rapids Community Foundation, the Steelcase Foundation, the Frey Foundation, MSHDA and the Dyer Ives Foundation. The Midtown Neighborhood Association has allocated funds from dues and donations and a small portion of proceeds from the Fulton Street Farmers Market.

The Neighborhood Association considers the process of the project to be as important as the outcome. There have been public meetings every month since the project began in October. Our staff has made a herculean effort to involve residents of the Brikyaat (phone calls, emails, personal visits). The MNA encourages everyone to share their views about the plan, whether favorable or unfavorable. That's why we're doing it the way we're doing it. We know you can't please all the people all the time, but we believe all the people who want to speak about this project should be heard. Unfortunately, we can only hear you if you speak to us.

MNA members have been concerned from the beginning about displacement and housing affordability and environmental impact. We are in the process of meeting with local non-profit developers and community development corporations to address these issues, and we've spoken about them at length in both board and design team meetings. Revitalization does not have to mean gentrification. I would consider us to have failed in our endeavor, if rising property values caused people to move out of the Brikyaat.

Please keep in mind that the plan which we've been talking about is preliminary. The next phase of the plan will incorporate a current conditions assessment. There is no sense in wiping out a street that consists of predominantly viable housing stock. We expect there will be changes to the existing plan that take into account the actual situation on the ground. So we encourage everyone who has something to say (especially MrGRGuy, who's views are absolutely relevant and should be made known to the community at large, and not just this forum) to get involved and stay involved.

By the way, our consultants kick butt. And they are worth every penny.

--MNA Prez

[GRguy]

Thanks for answering the questions. I can rest (a little) easier now.

[GRDadof3]

So we encourage everyone who has something to say (especially MrGRGuy, who's views are absolutely relevant and should be made known to the community at large, and not just this forum) to get involved and stay involved.

--MNA Prez

Welcome to UP CHM! Thanks for the background info. Yes, hopefully this forum is just a springboard to get people more involved in their local communities

[GRDadof3]

This is pretty exciting! Even comparatively speaking

A nice rundown from someone working on this would much appreciated

[PBJ]

This is pretty exciting! Even comparatively speaking

A nice rundown from someone working on this would much appreciated

What? Theres other things going on in GR? Who'd a thunk..

[twoshort]

Wow this is REALLY cool. Where's the GridGirl or Ted?

[grcitydog]

I REALLY like it! I have some questions though: is this something that is just a dream of what could happen or is there a real probability that it will happen? If so, is there any timeline on it? Also, it looks like there are quite a few houses and even big stuff like Valley City Linen that will have to go if this is going to work; is an attempt being made to purchase all of these properties and rebuild the area? Wow, if this gets pulled off, what a gem we will have!!

[MAU]

I REALLY like it! I have some questions though: is this something that is just a dream of what could happen or is there a real probability that it will happen? If so, is there any timeline on it? Also, it looks like there are quite a few houses and even big stuff like Valley City Linen that will have to go if this is going to work; is an attempt being made to purchase all of these properties and rebuild the area? Wow, if this gets pulled off, what a gem we will have!!

Ya, i'd like to know how this is going to work. And how big is the proposed community garden? Just don't want it to steal gardeners away from my community garden.

I do like the fact that they're trying to enlarge the farmers market - i think that's the most important thing to that whole project. But how much will they be expanding the parking for the market? Is the market going to be enclosed?

[Ted]

I REALLY like it! I have some questions though: is this something that is just a dream of what could happen or is there a real probability that it will happen? If so, is there any timeline on it? Also, it looks like there are quite a few houses and even big stuff like Valley City Linen that will have to go if this is going to work; is an attempt being made to purchase all of these properties and rebuild the area? Wow, if this gets pulled off, what a gem we will have!!

Well, ultimately we are trying to communicate the wants and needs of the neighborhood. We are not developers or landowners in the neighborhood - we work for the Midtown Neighborhood Association. Also, what GRDad posted here represents about 50% of the work of the project. This is not the final plan, it will continue to evolve over the next few months. We're anticipating rolling out the final planning documents in the early fall. That said, there is no time line. I think some things proposed here could happen within the next few years while other parts may be much farther out - 10-20 years. One of the goal of the plan is to allow for incremental change. So, as market (real estate, economic - not Farmer's) conditions change over time the plan could be implemented in pieces to suit demand.

Ya, i'd like to know how this is going to work. And how big is the proposed community garden? Just don't want it to steal gardeners away from my community garden.

I do like the fact that they're trying to enlarge the farmers market - i think that's the most important thing to that whole project. But how much will they be expanding the parking for the market? Is the market going to be enclosed?

Expansion of the Farmer's Market is something that almost everyone involved in the project identified as a need. The unanimity of opinion in our design meetings and charrettes, frankly, surprised us. The intent is to move the Market to a year round venture that will include both enclosed and open spaces. The plan an renderings are more suggestive here than anything else because the architectural form of an expanded Market could be many different things.

Parking is an issue throughout the neighborhood - with the business district, Houseman Field, and the Market. Parking is one issue where there is no way to make everyone happy. With regards to the Market, we still want the priority on the expansion to be the Market itself. One of the biggest problems with the way the Market works today is the bottleneck for the parking parade that you encounter at the entrances on Fulton and Fountain. Our approach has been to deversify the access to the Market around the perimeter of the site while creating a public plaza/pedestrian entrance at Fulton. The hope is that while we expand parking and car access we avoid the proverbial anti-urban sea of asphalt.

We are just starting the second Phase of our work and detailed work on the Farmer's Market is at the top of the list. It is very possible that what you see today in the plan for the Farmer's Market will look very different by this summer.

What else?

[grandmabetty78]

Whose set to build this? Anyone know?

[twoshort]

Whose set to build this? Anyone know?

I think some things proposed here could happen within the next few years while other parts may be much farther out - 10-20 years.

[Mark Miller]

Keep in mind that there is currently no developer for any part of this project. There is no scheduled time to begin any part of the bricks and mortar portion of this project. There is "only" a very progressive and proactive neighborhood organization, some great stakeholders and a team of consultants who are working together to create a plan for what COULD happen, but may never happen.

We as a team have taken the approach that something will happen and we need to be prepared for it, when it does.

As Ted mentioned, the plan that has been presented is not final, it is only a snapshot of our progress to date. It will continue to evolve as more information is gathered and taken during public process. Ultimately we need to have a plan in place that can act as a guidebook or roadmap to a developer(s) who decides that this place is the place to invest in. This roadmap will help to insure that the neighborhood's ideals and goals are kept in mind when and if development pressure comes.

Our team's goal is to have a plan that will be put into city masterplan documents as an area specific plan. We also intend to codify the plan in some capacity so that it has some legs when (and if) a developer comes into play.

Ideally this will be a project that happens over time, in hopefully many different hands of developers, so that the organic feel of true urbanism can come to the top. There is no doubt that there probably will be a catalyst of some type here, it may be something large (like the farmers market) but it could be something small like a new cemetery wall along Fountain or even a few new buildings inserted along Fulton.

[MAU]

As a resident of the neighborhood to the east of this, i think you guys should sneak in a Saturday morning stop light at Fuller and Fountain for the summer when the market is at it's busiest. I'm tired of playing Frogger there Saturday mornings. Or if i'm just in my car trying to leave the neighborhood.

[CHM]

As a resident of the neighborhood to the east of this, i think you guys should sneak in a Saturday morning stop light at Fuller and Fountain for the summer when the market is at it's busiest. I'm tired of playing Frogger there Saturday mornings. Or if i'm just in my car trying to leave the neighborhood.

It's certainly on our radar at Midtown. We've spoken to GR Traffic Safety about the need for some kind of traffic-calming device on Fuller between Michigan and Fulton. According to their most recent study, 23,000 cars pass through there in a 24 hour period, and we all know the 30 mph speed limit is mostly disregarded .

The response from Traffic Safety was basically that we would have to establish that there is enough pedestrian traffic to warrant a light, or even a crosswalk there. With the major construction due to take place on Fuller this spring and summer, a traffic study would probably have to wait until fall, at the earliest. However, we can certainly make the recommendation in the plan . . . .

[GRGridGirl]

I volunteer for the Midtown Neighborhood Association at the Farmer's Market on Saturdays. The Market was slammin' today. I'm organizing a group of folks to volunteer as exit counters to try to get a "number" of people that visit the Market on Saturday. I hope to find that more people are at the Market on Saturday mornings then at Woodland Mall.

How many people do you think patron the Fulton ST Farmer's Market on Saturdays?

-TripleG

[MAU]

Are you thinking about counting carloads coming in the entrances or people coming through? Your numbers will probably be way off right now if you're counting cars since so many people are illegally parking on Fuller right now. I also noticed a ton more people than usual walking down the streets into the market.

I've got to say, i like the construction though because i don't feel like Frogger trying to cross Fuller!