Lenox Square/Phipps Plaza

[StevenRocks]

As Belk upgraded and Parisian expanded with larger stores and a home department in some locations, they started looking a lot alike, but they didn't start out very similar at all.

Parisian started out as more of a dress shop, while Belk was more of a small town dry-goods store. They also expanded a lot differently. Belk was a staple of small towns from Delaware to Texas, while Parisian mostly stayed in Alabama until the '80s.

[DigitalSky]

I was here in Buckhead last week for the first time. I must say.. the whole area is just awe-inspiring and it amazed me!! <3 for Atlanta...

[gs3]

As Belk upgraded and Parisian expanded with larger stores and a home department in some locations, they started looking a lot alike, but they didn't start out very similar at all.

Parisian started out as more of a dress shop, while Belk was more of a small town dry-goods store. They also expanded a lot differently. Belk was a staple of small towns from Delaware to Texas, while Parisian mostly stayed in Alabama until the '80s.

Yeah, Parisian started out as a dress shop by two women, and it was called The Parisian. Up until Hooker bought them in the 80's from the Hess family, they were Alabama and Florida panhandle. Once Hooker cobbled together his grouping (Sakowitz, B.Altman, Parisian, Bonwit Teller) he went about remodeling malls and opening malls with multiple anchors all from his collection. That's how Parisian wound up in Cincinatti and the far flung locations. The Hess family bought Parisian back after Hooker nearly ran them in the ground and kept them until they sold them to Saks Inc (who for most of the time treated them like a moderate department store). The original Parisian attitude and culture has been missing since the early 80's (pre Hooker). Since then, it's just been one less than stellar idea after another, but never anything resembling the orginal early 80's upper end Parisian. Interesting note.....people always equate Parisian with Nordstrom....there is a reason that people used to get that vibe....Parisian early 80's management wanted to emmulate Nordstrom and would send Store Planning, Marketing, Visual, Buyers, etc to Nordstrom stores for scouting trips and they would return with ideas from Nordstrom. Though never publicly admitting to copy catting, long term Parisian guys can definitely fill you in on the trips.

[krazeeboi]

I was here in Buckhead last week for the first time. I must say.. the whole area is just awe-inspiring and it amazed me!! <3 for Atlanta...

Wow, you're a late bloomer.

[StevenRocks]

Interesting note.....people always equate Parisian with Nordstrom....there is a reason that people used to get that vibe....Parisian early 80's management wanted to emmulate Nordstrom and would send Store Planning, Marketing, Visual, Buyers, etc to Nordstrom stores for scouting trips and they would return with ideas from Nordstrom. Though never publicly admitting to copy catting, long term Parisian guys can definitely fill you in on the trips.

Belk also did a lot to emulate Nordstrom, especially in its larger stores. The flagship Belk in Charlotte was remodeled in 1986 with some very Nordstrom-like details.

[Abe2M12]

Belk also did a lot to emulate Nordstrom, especially in its larger stores. The flagship Belk in Charlotte was remodeled in 1986 with some very Nordstrom-like details.

True but Belk was remodled again for the expansion in Southpark around 2004-2005. And Nordstrom has a lifestyle design to it that seperates it from most department stores, and belk still maintained its traditional derpartment store layout, plus with the addition of Nordstrom to Southpark, you can really tell the differences in design and layout. In my opinion the flagship Belk looks more like Parisians at Phipps.1

[StevenRocks]

I'm not exactly pleased with the latest Belk SouthPark remodel. But from a standpoint of comparing it to Nordstrom, it holds up reasonably well. There's a lot to like as well as dislike.

Anyway, nobody does exactly what Nordstrom does with the high level of service and merchandise selection, but everybody can't be Nordstrom either.

[Lacharm]

i dont see why yall look at belk's as such a high profile store, when i stopped there in monroe, la...........it was nothing but a downscale dillards.

[socaguy]

Who is looking at Belk as a high profile store? reread some of the posts and youll see the majority of posters are saying Belk is NOT a high profile department store and would NOT want it to come to Phipps Plaza or any other Upscale Atlanta mall.

[peaceloveunderstanding]

i dont see why yall look at belk's as such a high profile store, when i stopped there in monroe, la...........it was nothing but a downscale dillards.

Come visit the SouthPark Belk's and you may come away with a different perspective - it seems nicer to me anyways. It has been mentioned many times on this forum that there is a great deal of variation in the quality of Belk's by market.

That said, it wouldn't fit as a brand at Phipps - and that's coming from someone who doesn't know beans about retail but knows that Phipps is in a league of extraordinary malls.

EDIT:

haha, reading back it looks like everything I have said has been said before.

Edited June 20, 2006 by moonshield

[Temeteron]

Belk is different from other stores in the way that they have different 'scales' of stores....some carry more expensive items and others that are in the middle of nowhere carry low priced items......whereas stores like Nordstrom, Saks, and Neiman pretty much carry the same stuff from location to location, unless you go to the Manhattan stores...

[StevenRocks]

Belk operates in so many different kinds of towns that it can't afford to be totally upscale. Some stuff just won't sell in Mayberry, no matter how many urbanites salivate over it.

[micropundit]

Attention all fashionistas: Dior will be opening a boutique at Phipps Plaza this fall.

Edited July 3, 2006 by micropundit

[Lady Celeste]

Attention all fashionistas: Dior will be opening a boutique at Phipps Plaza this fall.

Is this in addition to the one already in Saks or are they moving to their own space?

[micropundit]

^ They will be a full service boutique ;Saks will retain their in house store.

[Lady Celeste]

^ They will be a full service boutique ;Saks will retain their in house store.

That is very good to know. Thank you for the update and welcome to Urbanplanet. We are glad to have you.

[micropundit]

That is very good to know. Thank you for the update and welcome to Urbanplanet. We are glad to have you.

Thank you. Look for some other major moves at the Lennox/Phipps complex: anchor stores leaving;new additions involving new to the market stores and existing stores being "repositioned". The gap between this complex and Bal Harbour will narrow considerably in the next few years.

Edited July 7, 2006 by micropundit

[JerseyBoy]

Thank you. Look for some other major moves at the Lennox/Phipps complex: anchor stores leaving;new additions involving new to the market stores and existing stores being "repositioned". The gap between this complex and Bal Harbour will narrowed considerably in the next few years.

I've heard that Parisian will be leaving but I assume alot of people know that but if you don't check a href="http://"www.urbanplanet.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=26227">this out.

[Temeteron]

Attention all fashionistas: Dior will be opening a boutique at Phipps Plaza this fall.

OMG!!!!!!!!! I'm hoping it'll be a full line, and not one like Tampa International Plaza, where there is only 4 items to choose from

[micropundit]

A source,The ATLANTAN magazine,lists Lennox Mall as the site of the DIOR store. The phone #-404.364.2210- has not been connected,so when and where are still unknown to me.

[VistaLakes01]

Hey Atlanta........it could be worse, your Parisian could be replaced by McCraes. We had two Parisian stores in Orlando (neither at a premier center) and for about 6 month's they became MCraes. Now they are Belk and they are halfway decent stores. Nothing like the Belk's that left Orlando in the 80's (Belk-Lindsey) they were horrible. Neiman Marcus would be the smallest sq ft. department store in Millenia, about 100,000 sq feet. Bloomingdale's in Millenia was actually built as a Bloomingdale's , is 3 levels with furniture dept. and was not converted from a Macy's. Also the Macy's in Millenia was built as Macy's before the Burdine's/Macy's conversion and is also quite large and 3 levels. We call it "the real Macy's." We have a Dior in Millenia as well as a Zara store and there is a spot with a sign that says Manolo Blahnik opening fall of 2006 (2 stores away from Jimmy Choo). We still have the only Lord & Taylor operating in the southeast at The Florida Mall. Florida Mall maintains a Sears and JCPenney, as well as L &T, Saks 5th Ave, Nordstrom, and Dillards. Ironically the Florida Mall location of Saks was originally a horrible Belk-Lindsey store when the mall opened. The Jacobson's chain has resurrected itself in Florida with a location in Winter Park and Naples. There was a rumor that the Florida Mall location of Lord & Taylor would become Jacobson's if it ever closes but it is beginning to sound like it may not close. For those of you who speak of shopping at International Plaza in Tampa, I hope you checked out Orlando's retail scene first! Interational Plaza now has Robb & Stucky furniture store as one of their anchors as well as Dillard's. Tampa has no Bloomies, either, and Orlando is finally getting Florida's second IKEA store. I'm sure when you mention Atlanta as the retail mecca of the southeast, you are not including Florida. Miami is a lot closer for us than Atlanta and is primo retail wise. And we get lots of Duval (Jacksonville) license tags here in Orlando at Millenia and Florida Mall and even Altamonte which has become quite a shopping destination. (Belk and Dillards are the best Jax has got, not even a Macy's conversion) Most of my friends in Tampa Bay drive over to Orlando to shop frequently, it really isn't that much of a drive, both metros are pretty much connected. Cityplace in West Palm and The Gardens Mall, and Wellington Green all in Palm Beach county on the north end of the Miami metro (as well as Worth Ave) are pretty awesome retail locations also. I do enjoy Lenox when I'm in Atlanta, I was only in Phipps once in the 80's. (We are hearing rumors here of a downtown department store, have heard Barney's mentioned as well as Jacobson's.) Anyways, hello in the ATL from the O!

[mallguy]

Hey Atlanta........it could be worse, your Parisian could be replaced by McCraes.

Agreed- Proffitt's and those other low-end Saks Inc. chains were worse than Belk's. The Parisian at Greenville Mall in SC became a Proffitt's, which was a slightly better version of JC Penney, which accelerated that mall's death. Some Belk stores are OK/nice, so I expect the Phipps Plaza one to be OK.

There is a very high-end mall in Honolulu with a Prada, Louis Vuitton, Burberry, etc., anchored by Neiman Marcus and...Sears, and Belk is better than that, so hopefully the in-line tenants at Phipps won't be affected.

But still, Parisian is a nicer chain than Belk's, and I'm bummed to see it vanish. Maybe a big Barney's could take the space?

Edited July 28, 2006 by mallguy

[VistaLakes01]

Agreed- Proffitt's and those other low-end Saks Inc. chains were worse than Belk's. The Parisian at Greenville Mall in SC became a Proffitt's, which was a slightly better version of JC Penney, which accelerated that mall's death. Some Belk stores are OK/nice, so I expect the Phipps Plaza one to be OK.

There is a very high-end mall in Honolulu with a Prada, Louis Vuitton, Burberry, etc., anchored by Neiman Marcus and...Sears, and Belk is better than that, so hopefully the in-line tenants at Phipps won't be affected.

But still, Parisian is a nicer chain than Belk's, and I'm bummed to see it vanish. Maybe a big Barney's could take the space?

So far the new Belk's in West Oaks Mall is identical to Parisian, but that's mainly because they haven't really changed anything, same look and same merchandise. I haven't been to the Belk's in Seminole Town Center but that's way on the north end of the metro. I've always considered that mall a little more "redneckish" since it gets a lot of business from the Western Volusia suburbs (Deltona) which is known for it's cheaper home prices. There is an upscale lifestyle center about a mile from that mall called Colonial Town Park that attracts more of the upscale shoppers from Lake Mary and Heathrow. West Oaks Mall lost their upper element when Mall at Millenia opened, the Gap left the mall and a lot of mom & pop "hip hop" stores have opened, although a Hollister opened there recently. Since you are a "mallguy" as well as myself, I was wondering if we have any stores here in Orlando @ Millenia or Florida Mall that are not in the Atlanta market? Think you could research that for me? Florida Mall is a simon property and Millenia is a Taubman mall. Thanks!!

[mallguy]

No clue; I have not been to Orlando in about 30 years and am not up on the Florida mall scene. really.

[shrek05]

But still, Parisian is a nicer chain than Belk's, and I'm bummed to see it vanish. Maybe a big Barney's could take the space?

How much square feet is it? Barneys usually has rather small department stores (opening under 100,000). Main reason they chose not to open at the dead Robinsons-May in Scottsdale and are instead opting to open a freestanding, smaller store.

Since you are a "mallguy" as well as myself, I was wondering if we have any stores here in Orlando @ Millenia or Florida Mall that are not in the Atlanta market?

No, I dont think there is anything Orlando has that Atlanta doesnt. In fact, most of the stores in Orlando dont have as wide a collection as the ones in Atlanta, but Atlanta stores arent as stocked as Miami, where most Florida retail goes. Atlanta is Georgia's hub so it would only be natural that it has more retail than Orland. Though Atlanta has many things Orlando doesn't have, Florida in general has much more than Georgia.

There is a very high-end mall in Honolulu with a Prada, Louis Vuitton, Burberry, etc., anchored by Neiman Marcus and...Sears, and Belk is better than that, so hopefully the in-line tenants at Phipps won't be affected.

It shouldn't affect Phipps too much. Granted, Ala Moana Center is a much bigger hub for luxury retail (every store there has the brand's entire line). But seeing Phipps already has a collection of boutiques, thats all that it really needs now.

Edited July 28, 2006 by shrek05