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Dick Cheney shoots a man!


cityboi

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I ask folks that all the time: First it was spun as to eliminate the threat of WMDs, then it was spun as the frontline of the 'War on Terror', and now it has evolved into 'bringing democracy' to the Middle East. Um then again, my memory of the sequence is failling...

Maybe after we all take a breath and digest whats before us we can lead the way to an era of humility. Anybody want to start the War on Arrogance!

It was said that Dick Cheney was the one that was pushing for this war and well before 911. 911 was used as an excuse to go over there. But was for the oil? or was the administration trying to get revenge because Saddam Hussein tried to kill George Bush Sr? Maybe it was for political purposes. If it had not been for the war on terror/Iraq Bush probabally would not have been re-elected because of his poor approval ratings on domestic issues. Polls show that.

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A further outrage that is being buried in the press is the proposal in the 2007 Bush budget to start selling off the National Forests to private developers. Thousands of acres in some of the most popular parks are on the block, and the resulting amount of the sale, $800M will pay for about 1/2 week's federal spending in Iraq.

This is an absolute outrage. Once this land is lost to development, it is lost forever.

politicians are very good at getting people to support them even when they are screwing up. What kills me is that when you disagree with the president you are called "anti-american". But what makes America great is that you have the freedom to have and express your opinions, not suppress them. Its sad that Bush wants to sell off this land, but that not the only thing he is doing, he wants to start drilling in Alaska for oil and further wreck the environment. If our government takes the initiative to impose new technologies for energy, we wouldnt even need oil and there would be no reason for us to even have a presence in the middle east.
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politicians are very good at getting people to support them even when they are screwing up. What kills me is that when you disagree with the president you are called "anti-american". But what makes America great is that you have the freedom to have and express your opinions, not suppress them. Its sad that Bush wants to sell off this land, but that not the only thing he is doing, he wants to start drilling in Alaska for oil and further wreck the environment. If our government takes the initiative to impose new technologies for energy, we wouldnt even need oil and there would be no reason for us to even have a presence in the middle east.

That's funny. Didn't Bush say in the State of the Union Address that America was addicted to oil and we needed to push forward with alternative technologies? Are you driving a hybrid or an all-electric? And when the Republicans have issues with Dems. like Clinton, it's suddenly a Right Wing Conspiracy. Don't know which side is suppressing opinions in this country.....seems like the ranters on the left have no problems spewing through the major media outlets.....

So we are a country of anti-Americans and conspirists, with those fe, scattered independents. Hmmm.

As long as there are Israeli-Haters in the ME, there will be a need to be there, irregardless of the oil.

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That's funny. Didn't Bush say in the State of the Union Address that America was addicted to oil and we needed to push forward with alternative technologies? Are you driving a hybrid or an all-electric? And when the Republicans have issues with Dems. like Clinton, it's suddenly a Right Wing Conspiracy. Don't know which side is suppressing opinions in this country.....seems like the ranters on the left have no problems spewing through the major media outlets.....

Millions of taxpayer dollars were wasted investigating Clinton's sex life, of all things, in an effort to bring him down. Sounds like a conspiracy to me. Otherwise, please explain why the appearance of personal impropriety was enough to warrant an investigation then, while the appearance of any number of professional improprieties now can be overlooked. If Clinton deserved impeachment, Bush certainly does.

As for Cheney, I'd like to see you or I get away with shooting a man, then blocking law enforcement from investigating (as the Secret Service did) for hours after the fact.

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You know... this "anti-American" anti-Patriotism stuff smacks way too much of Adolf Hitler and his Nazi vision in Germany. You were either for Hitler, or dead.

Hitler used the same tactics on Germans to get the Germans to elect his party to power. He used fear (If you vote democrat, the terrorists are gonna blow up your house and probably your parents' too) and expanding the "Vaterland" (bringing democracy to the world). He used a group of people as the central core of this fear, the Jews. Bush uses North Korea, Iraq, and Iran. And he won. He got 50.9% of America to believe his campaign: "Fear, smear, and queers" Scare 'em into believing that only he can fight the war on terror, smear the other guy with insults and lies, and detract everyone by pushing irrelevant high emotion social issues (gay marriage).

George Bush is probably the worst president we've ever had. I've never seen such a disgrace to this nation. The man is a hypocrite, a master of spin, and an idiot to boot. Selling national forest land to private developers? I don't care if it's a rumor. It's something he would do. And it's not like he hasn't already sold the environment out to line his pockets and the pockets of his friends.

This man needs to be removed from office. But what's it gonna be? Breaching the constitution for his little spy program? The torture? The secret prisons? Lying about sending us to war? Pitiful response to Katrina? Connections to Jack Abramoff?

Or are the Republicans gonna continue to tape their balls back and bend over backwards for their incompetant, hypocritical, good-for-nothing leader?

The Republicans won a sizable majority in congress in 1994 based on the "Contract with America" in order to get rid of the corruption that plagued the democratic party at that time. I think it's time we got rid of the Republicans like a bad hangover and brought this country back to something worth being proud of.

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At least Cheney is owing up to it. It would be terrible to shoot one's friend.

Unlike Teddy Kennedy and his murder a while back.

------------------

As for the political current of this thread, I agree Bush is a terrible leader and the administration will go down as one of the worst in history. The neocons have corrupted the mission established by Reagan and Goldwater, the goal was within reach and Bush and crew have thrown every gain away. The country is headed down a road where we have no idea what tomorrow will bring.

It's certainly a sad day when the 'conservative' government does nothing to protect its own country. Issues like illegal immigration, extreme deficit spending, and preemptive intervention in foreign affairs would have not occurred had we a real conservative administration.

The worst part is that most people don't seem to care that America is dying. It

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I am convinced the Administration is so opposed to Iran having an atomic bomb is because that means we won't be able to invade that country. Of course it was our policies in Iraq that caused N. Korea to go ahead and develop the bomb and now Iran. Remember it was Bush himself that referred to all three countries as the Axis of Evil. A great way, of course to influence and win friends.

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Millions of taxpayer dollars were wasted investigating Clinton's sex life, of all things, in an effort to bring him down. Sounds like a conspiracy to me. Otherwise, please explain why the appearance of personal impropriety was enough to warrant an investigation then, while the appearance of any number of professional improprieties now can be overlooked. If Clinton deserved impeachment, Bush certainly does.

As for Cheney, I'd like to see you or I get away with shooting a man, then blocking law enforcement from investigating (as the Secret Service did) for hours after the fact.

Well, this is a bit of a special case. Neither you nor I are the VP! (Probably a good thing, at least in my case! :P )

We'll forget that Clinton lied about his situation too. And a tad bit to cozy with the Russians and the Chinese for my liking.

I am convinced the Administration is so opposed to Iran having an atomic bomb is because that means we won't be able to invade that country. Of course it was our policies in Iraq that caused N. Korea to go ahead and develop the bomb and now Iran. Remember it was Bush himself that referred to all three countries as the Axis of Evil. A great way, of course to influence and win friends.

Yes, North Korea and Iran were our closest allies afterall. There was no way they would have developed weapons without the threat of G. Dubyah. Iran has never wanted to annihilate Israel (until now). And the Clinton admin. clearly convinced North Korea to not even consider building a bomb. That wasn't sarcasm, was it? :silly::silly::silly:

I guess I shouldn't have said all Republicans. There are some very good Republicans out there.. especially the more moderate ones. It's the Neo-con power loving corrupted ones I can't stand. (Along with any democrat in the same mindset)

Absolutely agree!!

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We'll forget that Clinton lied about his situation too. And a tad bit to cozy with the Russians and the Chinese for my liking.

Bush said he would bring back honesty, integrity and morals to the whitehouse in a reference to his predecessor. Obviously this was something else that he said that hasn't come true. Remember, When Clinton lied, nobody died. I am always amused the Clinton is often used as a qualification for Bush's horrible presidency. If the Republicans did a $90 million taxpayer funded witchhunt on Bush as they did with Clinton, no doubt they would turn up more dirt than a lie about cheating on a marriage.

Yes, North Korea and Iran were our closest allies afterall. There was no way they would have developed weapons without the threat of G. Dubyah. Iran has never wanted to annihilate Israel (until now). And the Clinton admin. clearly convinced North Korea to not even consider building a bomb. That wasn't sarcasm, was it?
I have no doubt they will develop the weapons and there is nothing we can do to stop it. It is our very bad foreign policy that is accelerating it and excluding us from any dialog that might otherwise make it a bad situation. I don't see where Clinton's relations with Russian and N. Korea were bad at all. In fact the world was a much more stable place due to his engagement of these people instead of threats of conquering anyone the President and his cronies don't like.
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Remember, When Clinton lied, nobody died. I am always amused the Clinton is often used as a qualification for Bush's horrible presidency. If the Republicans did a $90 million taxpayer funded witchhunt on Bush as they did with Clinton, no doubt they would turn up more dirt than a lie about cheating on a marriage.

I have no doubt they will develop the weapons and there is nothing we can do to stop it. It is our very bad foreign policy that is accelerating it and excluding us from any dialog that might otherwise make it a bad situation. I don't see where Clinton's relations with Russian and N. Korea were bad at all. In fact the world was a much more stable place due to his engagement of these people instead of threats of conquering anyone the President and his cronies don't like.

Ah yes! The mantra; When CLinton Lied, Nobody Died. very popular here on the left-coast! And I doubt they would turn up more on Bush - if that was the case, they'd be a tryin'.

Yes, there is something we could do to stop it. And if we don't the Israelis will. Even the Europeans are seeing the light on the Iranian situation. They're giving the finger to everyone.

Exactly. The relations with Russia, China, and North Korea were perhaps a bit too good...so much for Carter's trip of appeasement in 1994. That worked.

See:

Arms for China

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And I doubt they would turn up more on Bush - if that was the case, they'd be a tryin'.

Right. The Republicans in control of Congress want to dig up dirt on their own man. How many times, on how many different subjects, have Democrats in congress called for investigations of the Bush administration? How many of those investigations went forward?

Yes Clinton lied. So what? The fact that he was put into a position where his extramarital affair was an issue at all proves that there was a concerted effort to attack him, on any grounds possible.

Anyone in Congress who supported Clinton's impeachment and isn't at least calling for inquiries now is a hypocrite, plain and simple.

As for foreign relations, are you seriously suggesting that we should be more hawkish with China? If this administration can't manage a conflict with a loosely organized band of criminals, how do you expect them to take on a nuclear-armed rising superpower?

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While the rest of the country is debating the finer points of going to war with China and Iran.. we're all sitting up here in the frozen north going "That George Bush musta ate somethin' real rotten cuz he's been leadin' this country like he got a sour stomach."

and "Ya know.. we'd be doin' a lot better if he'd just raise the taxes... I hate to say it, but ya gotta do whatcha gotta do.. don'tcha know." "Oh You bet, Harold." "Say, how about a sticky caramel roll-me-over bar?" "Nah.. wife's got me cuttin' down." "Hey... dja hear the vice president shot some guy huntin?" "Oh yaahh? Huntin's dangerous." "You bet."

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I am convinced the Administration is so opposed to Iran having an atomic bomb is because that means we won't be able to invade that country. Of course it was our policies in Iraq that caused N. Korea to go ahead and develop the bomb and now Iran. Remember it was Bush himself that referred to all three countries as the Axis of Evil. A great way, of course to influence and win friends.

I also believe its not our job to police to world and play God. If we demand that Iran doesnt develope nuclear technology, then we should get rid of all our nuclear weapons. Its like telling your little brother not to smoke pot when you are a pot smoker yourself. We just need to keep our nose out of other country's business. How would we like if some nation came over here occupying our land and telling us what to do and restructuring our entire government? We shouldnt force our beliefs and way of life on other nations. One day our arrogance is going to get us into alot of trouble.

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I also believe its not our job to police to world and play God. If we demand that Iran doesnt develope nuclear technology, then we should get rid of all our nuclear weapons. Its like telling your little brother not to smoke pot when you are a pot smoker yourself. We just need to keep our nose out of other country's business. How would we like if some nation came over here occupying our land and telling us what to do and restructuring our entire government? We shouldnt force our beliefs and way of life on other nations. One day our arrogance is going to get us into alot of trouble.

Whatever happened to the idea of building "an empire of liberty"...an idea several American politicans and thinkers have waxed upon throughout history.

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It just not our place to impose liberty on other nations. We should respect other nations customs and way of life even if we dont approve of it. imposing our beliefs on others only leads to conflict and thats not good at all. Notice that no one hates Canada and you dont hear about terrorist threats in Canada. Thats because they mind their own business. We could learn alot from them.

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Whatever happened to the idea of building "an empire of liberty"...an idea several American politicans and thinkers have waxed upon throughout history.

Actually I have never heard the word "empire" used in regards to the USA. If you will review your history "empires" are always advertized as being great but the reality is they are very painful to the common person. And the end result, they either collapse on themselves or are overthrown by revolution. The USA Constitution says nothing about creating an empire. It is disgusting to me that GW Bush and his cronies have little regard for this document.

The USA was formed as the first anti-empire. Its a shame that many of today's generation don't know anything about this, but maybe that is part of the plan. The Hitler Youth worshiped Hitler, and at the time, that was the most technologically advanced country on the planet.

Lady Liberty, who seems to be long forgotten, is now doubt crying now.

"Weep for the future, weep for us all"

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As for foreign relations, are you seriously suggesting that we should be more hawkish with China? If this administration can't manage a conflict with a loosely organized band of criminals, how do you expect them to take on a nuclear-armed rising superpower?

That "band of criminals" is not as loosely organized as you might like to believe. This is the most difficult type of warfare to wage. Not suggesting being more hawkish with China, just suggesting that we shouldn't HELP our enemies.

While the rest of the country is debating the finer points of going to war with China and Iran.. we're all sitting up here in the frozen north going "That George Bush musta ate somethin' real rotten cuz he's been leadin' this country like he got a sour stomach."

Didn't know we were debating the finer points of going to war with China......

It just not our place to impose liberty on other nations. We should respect other nations customs and way of life even if we dont approve of it. imposing our beliefs on others only leads to conflict and thats not good at all. Notice that no one hates Canada and you dont hear about terrorist threats in Canada. Thats because they mind their own business. We could learn alot from them.

The Canadians by their own admission are concerned with terrorists/groups currently residing in Canada. Almost a safe-haven if you will. I'm not sayin Canada supports terrorism, it clearly doesn't, but the very open policies of both Canada and the U.S. have not been conducive. Both countries are doing a better job on this now and working somewhat closer than we were. The would-be LA bomber originated in Canada. No threats, huh? I'm sure the Canadian government would not agree with you.

We should the lead the world by humble example, not by force. North Dakota has more millionaires per capita than any other state (or at least did recently).. and how many of you knew that? See? Sometimes success is wrought by minding your own business.. literally. :)

North Dakota? Where's that? :lol: Yep, leading by example (U.S., South Korea, Japan, the West in general) has done wonders for the starving millions in North Korea. Would you justify force here. I would. And letting Iran develop a nuke weapon, sure!! Why not? No threat there, I don't see a problem. Besides diplomacy will prevail here...... :sick: Don't get me wrong, if diplomacy works, great!! But if it doesn't, force is necessary. So if we disarm our nukes, that would be an invitation to nuts like Ahmadinejad and Kim. It would read something like; "Please NUKE us! We can't retaliate.", no?

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Diplomocy was working with N. Korea, Iraq and Iran before Bush showed up. Relations where thawing with Tehran, N. Korea had given up bomb development, and Iraq had completely given up all WMD and Nuclear development.

We were told Iraq was an immediate threat to the USA by Bush, we went to war and found that wasn't the case. It was a big lie.

Now we are told that Iran is a big threat. Why should I believe a President that has already lied about this?

And co-incidently we are also told by this President that N. Korea is not a threat to the USA despite having the bomb now. Why is that? Because we won't invade them as that will put us up against his banker, China. And the Chinese won't have an invasion by the USA on the Korean penn.

The rhetoric about fighting a war now that is completely different is just that, rhetoric. A war on terror, which is nothing because you can't have a war on against an emotion, is really just a license to do anything including violating the constitution. If it is infact a war on Terrorists then lets see some numbers on how many terrorists have been captured, how many real plans that have been stopped, how many masterminds have been captured. etc etc. In otherwords declare war against something real, have some real measurable objectives, and a plan for meeting them.

The Bush administration has done none of this. Instead we are occupying a country that we illegally conquered, we have no plan for getting out, we are wasting $240,000,000/day there, and we are killing both americans and innocent Iraqis in the process. And we are beginning the 4th year of this madness next month. All in a country that has been proven, prior to the war, to not only not have any connection to the 9/11 terrorists, but also was never a threat to the USA or its allies. The Iraqi war (which Bush never mentions by name now) is all about War Profits, Vendettas, and Insane Neo-Conservative ideals.

Bush, and the Republican congress behind him are negligent of their duties to the people who elected them and should be expelled from office. And some should go to jail for lying to the people because the result were that lives were lost. Lives were Lost.

dpbaker, read the rules on quoting posts

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With all jokes and laughing aside.. people should try not to politicize this issue. As much as I hate Dick Cheney (and believe me, I do.. and hate is a strong word), this was an accident.

And while this was pretty much setting the birds free to be shot.. it's still more humane to kill the animal yourself and eat it than to watch it get hung on a line with 4000 other birds and get their heads sawed off by saw covered in blood and other innards.

I like meat best when I know who killed and prepared the animal. (that's why a fried walleye supper when you're camping is so gratifying.)

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Id like to ask why are we in Iraq, It couldn't have been for terrorism because there were no terrorist or weapons of mass destruction there. Ironically when we invaded Iraq there was no order and the terrorist came to Iraq. I still dont know what the objective was. Why are we there? Our govermnet still hasnt answered that question.

I guess you think the Government should tell you everything they do and don't do... :shades: ......huh? There are vasts amounts of information that WE (meaning average joes) should never know anything about. It kills me everytime I hear people wanting to know everything. True, you have a god given and very american right to ask! They have a right in national security to not answer! Not giving you a hard time...just a different perspective.

P.S. I can tell you are not Pro Bush by the question and comments. Thats your perogative. You are given that freedom by the blood, sweat and tears of your fellow man. (non gender specific) ;)

Remember 9-11 Never Forget

War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse. The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself.

John Stuart Mill

English economist & philosopher (1806 - 1873)

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Yes. 9/11 happened, so gol-darnit.. we're gonna run around the world invading countries that had nothing to do with it in the name of democracy and commit 2,500 of our brave men and women to death in a pointless war that was based on a lie in order to line the pockets of the execs at Halliburton.

There's a hell of a lot I'm willing to fight for. The financial security of Halliburton execs is NOT one of them.

So, I counter with this statement:

War is an ugly thing, but it is also big business. The decayed and degraded state of moral standards held by our hawks, administration, and defense companies are bringing our nation to a new low. The president who has no other excuse to invade another country other than a packet full of lies and nothing to fight for but his own personal betterment is a disgusting, vile, and miserable person who should have no chance of being free except by the very document that he chooses not to abide by.

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^ Keep getting your information from the liberal spun media. I find it pointless to argue with you as You apparently have Your mind already made! You choose your informational outlets and i will choose mine and that IS what are country is all about. I respectfully disagree with your disdain abd opinion of current events. :w00t::w00t::w00t:

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