Boylan/Hillsborough/Glenwood area project rumors

[pack-man]

I always thought that would be a great spot for a bar, but I never thought it would work with the residential across the street. It will be interesting how this will play out.

[BoylanHghts]

Greetings all, I have just discovered this board and have been spending the last few days scouring the old posts and catching up on all the great info. It

[capitalapts]

Thanks for the info.

I am really, really glad the owner is keeping the character of the building. I love the styling on it, particularly the beams extended from the building over the larger, nearly floor-to-ceiling windows.

Very much looking foward to getting drunk there!

I also wanted to pass along an article from our neighborhood website about the Sidetrack Brewpub that will be opening in the coming months. There are some renderings of the interior space and the outdoor patio overlooking downtown. I can

[Transplant]

Can i call the area Boylborough?

[Jones_]

Can i call the area Boylborough?

Good god, that sounds like its inhabited by a bunch of acne stricken teenage kids

[BoylanHghts]

Can i call the area Boylborough?

Uh, no. Anything that conjures up images of bad skin rash or skurvy is not a good thing.

[bdp]

how bout Hillsboyle?

[ncwebguy]

With CharGrill and Snoopys, there may be already be a decent amount of acne in the area...

A walk from my house (east of Moore Square) along Hargett all the way to Boylan, and it was interesting, even with the street torn up around Fayetville and the asphalt sea by legends.

Anyway, HillsBoylan would be a cool name. Hopefully Sidecar, Moonlight, CharGrill and Snoopys will have more neighbors soon... there is Dive bar and some new jazz place coming in on Glenwood, and the Hillsborough/Glenwood/Morgan/Boylan block is ripe for redevlopment into a downtown/NC State/Glenwood/Boylan Heights intersection/linchpin.

[BoylanHghts]

There are several condo projects either under construction or in the planning stages for this area:

[ChiefJoJo]

some new jazz place coming in on Glenwood

Amra's--should be opening soon.

Proposed condos on the Tao Auto and NC Cancer Society sites on Boylan Ave between Hillsborough St & Morgan St

This property is owned by the Boulevard Company (Clt). They must wait for the NC Cancer Society lease to expire--then they can fully develop it. Ann-Cabell told me recently that they are on hold right now, but maybe in the coming year, we'll hear something.

[Damien]

The building that Osceola Recording Studio (is that still what that is?) is in would be a great place for a grocery store with condos or apartments on top.

[dmccall]

I have to admit that it has probably been two years since I've gone out drinking in the glenwood south area. Back then I was really impressed with how busy it was. It was as busy as Franklin St, but they even had a hot dog cart at 11:00pm, a true sign of safety and free flowing money!

Last night, though, WHOA! I am mega-impressed. FIVE hotdog carts - all throwing distance from each other! People galore. We had to park 3 blocks from Vin (where we ate) it was so crowded. It has grown into something that Bourbon St. in N.O. hasn't been in 40 years, at least, and far supercedes Franklin St. as far as nightlife experiences go.

I wonder if there are any plans for expanding the hybrid trolley to connect City Market/F-St with Glenwood South. That would really tie downtown and kindadowntown into one fabulous experience, especially if the trolley is free and frequent.

[BoylanHghts]

The building that Osceola Recording Studio (is that still what that is?) is in would be a great place for a grocery store with condos or apartments on top.

I think that building is a little small for a full-on grocery store, but it might be big enough for a neighborhood shop similar to Conti's Market over at Oakwood/Mordecai.

By the way, there use to be a neighborhood store in Boylan Heights on Cutler Street. It was converted into a single family residence back in the 90's. Check it out.....

http://www.boylanheights.org/gallery/album...r_Street?full=1

http://msweb01.co.wake.nc.us/realestate/Ph...&pin=1703362500

[Damien]

I think that building is a little small for a full-on grocery store, but it might be big enough for a neighborhood shop similar to Conti's Market over at Oakwood/Mordecai.

By the way, there use to be a neighborhood store in Boylan Heights on Cutler Street. It was converted into a single family residence back in the 90's. Check it out.....

http://www.boylanheights.org/gallery/album...r_Street?full=1

http://msweb01.co.wake.nc.us/realestate/Ph...&pin=1703362500

I was actually thinking of someting more like tearing down the existing structure and building new. Maybe 3 or 4 floors. Bring the building up to the street and put a small parking deck around the backside of the building. Obviously a grocery store doesnt need 3 or 4 floors, so the top 2 or 3 floors would be residential.

[willrusso]

I know this is slightly off-subject, but what are they putting in the bottom of the Dawson? I drove by there the other day and saw some type of construction going on inside.

[ncwebguy]

The topography in the block bounded by Boylan, Morgan, Glenwood and Hillsborough seems to have a low point half way along Morgan, and rises in every direction. This could be used to hide underground parking (a la State employees credit union) if the different land owners cooperated and/or combined parcels. Between this and the streets themselves, a lot of cars could fit in and still not ruin the pedestrian experience.

I used to work with the current owner of the "grocery house". He has done quite well for himself!

[orulz]

A big problem with the Boylan / Wye area is the loss of connectivity where the railroad tracks interrupt the street grid.

The city and CAMPO have had a plan on the books for decades for a connector between Glenwood Avenue and South Saunders Street. This would be a large viaduct over the railroad wye. In addition, I'd like to see a plus-shaped bridge that intersects with Hargett rather than flying over it. That would knit the grid back together. Perhaps it could be built as part of the future Raleigh multimodal station, since it would presumably occupy one or two of these blocks.

Air rights over the station and railroad could then be sold, and buildings developed that address the bridges as if they were ground-level (existing ones at Morgan, Hillsborough, and Boylan, plus new ones at Hargett and Glenwood.) This would have the effect of decking over the entire wye. I wonder if any of the existing bridges could be reused like that? This could get expensive in a hurry, but it might be possible with an infusion of state and federal cash for building the transit station.

[Subway Scoundrel]

I have to admit that it has probably been two years since I've gone out drinking in the glenwood south area. Back then I was really impressed with how busy it was. It was as busy as Franklin St, but they even had a hot dog cart at 11:00pm, a true sign of safety and free flowing money!

Last night, though, WHOA! I am mega-impressed. FIVE hotdog carts - all throwing distance from each other! People galore. We had to park 3 blocks from Vin (where we ate) it was so crowded. It has grown into something that Bourbon St. in N.O. hasn't been in 40 years, at least, and far supercedes Franklin St. as far as nightlife experiences go.

I wonder if there are any plans for expanding the hybrid trolley to connect City Market/F-St with Glenwood South. That would really tie downtown and kindadowntown into one fabulous experience, especially if the trolley is free and frequent.

A while back I was on a travel board site and answering a question about Raleigh nightlife and all the Charlotte people were coming in talking about their nightlife and how Raleigh was nothing but a bunch of college kids.

A older woman who lives here in the Burbs somewhere around Raleigh was pushing Charlotte because her nieces were from Charlotte and they said DT Charlotte was great.

I mentioned the words "hopping nightlife

[citiboi27610]

I've thought of that too. Glenwood ends looking at Morgan looking out at the tracks. That would open up some valuable land/space on the edge of downtown and would help the gradual merge between residential boylan heights and more mixed devlopment downtown towards the central commercial cooridor.

Also, are there any forums or websites on how air rights work?

[Jones_]

Glenwood used to be called Saunders Street as far back as the 1870's so teh assumption has always been that at some point the two would be connected. At one time a viaduct connected Martin Street to Boylan Heights so the concept is not unheard of for the wye. The TTA plan had Glenwood only going as far as the station itself but not all the way to South Saunders.

[Transplant]

It seems logical to me that these deadends would be connected. If these were connected only by BRTs as part of the TTA metro station, it would be good.

DT Raleigh needs, or will need, as much access as possible. With the explosion of Glenwood South, easy access to the south is important.

[ChiefJoJo]

The Dix Plan mentions this possibility as well to provide better connectivity from there to DT.

Remember all those great ideas are very cost prohibitive. Kinda like that guy who came to the Hillsborough partnership meeting on Sat talking about ped tunnels and bridges!

[BoylanHghts]

Glenwood used to be called Saunders Street as far back as the 1870's so teh assumption has always been that at some point the two would be connected. At one time a viaduct connected Martin Street to Boylan Heights so the concept is not unheard of for the wye. The TTA plan had Glenwood only going as far as the station itself but not all the way to South Saunders.

I may be wrong, but I think they were connected at one time before the rail yard became the massive empty wasteland that it is now. I know that the white folks that lived up in the Five Points area (which was Bloomsbury at the time I believe) didn't want to live on the same street name as the black folks to the south of downtown, hence N Saunders became Glenwood Ave.

At least that's the story I've heard.....could be urban legend. Just like you should never drink Coke and eat PopRocks at the same time.

[Jones_]

I may be wrong, but I think they were connected at one time before the rail yard became the massive empty wasteland that it is now. I know that the white folks that lived up in the Five Points area (which was Bloomsbury at the time I believe) didn't want to live on the same street name as the black folks to the south of downtown, hence N Saunders became Glenwood Ave.

At least that's the story I've heard.....could be urban legend. Just like you should never drink Coke and eat PopRocks at the same time.

Here is what I do know

Raleigh's city limits did not expand beyond North/South/East and West Street until 1857. (Read Saunders did not exist before then) around the time the railroad was built.

C.N. Dries map. of Raleigh clearly shows a North Saunders Street (Future Glenwood) but not a south Saunders. This pretty much assures that they were never connected as the railroad tracks are already in existance (the full wye) before the southern portion of Saunders.

The Glenwood neighborhood was established in 1905.

South Saunders came into existance sometime after 1872 and the name Glenwood not likely sooner than 1905. Since both stretches at one time had the name Saunders it is assumed that for some time they shared the name.

The reasons for the name change are unknown to me.

[ncwebguy]

I could see Glenwood being extended over the wye and then down to street level at Davie or Cabarrus. East Hargett could end at it's current elevation at West street, and then continue "raised" from the "new Glenwood" east towards Boylan. This would leave remove the only grade level crossing for the tracks till Jones street to the north and Cabarrus to the south. It would create a row of bridges -- Boylan, Hargett, Morgan, and Hillsborough.

If this was to tie in with South Saunders, a lot of houses would have to go between south and cabarrus, but they are in pretty sad shape as they are now... This area is getting pinched by Downtown from the east and Boyland Heights to the west, yet still looks untouched since the 60s or 70s. PSNC doesn't help things either -- it has the rotten eggs smell to it. Either C&T or PSNC gas would have to be taken out, but I don't think this is a deal killer.