Berry Farms Development, the Cool Springs of South Williamson County

[cheeriokid61]

The area 'around' Cool Springs has not been fully developed yet they are allowing a new development in a different area already? Unless this is to cater to a different type of Class A office space users, then it should not be allowed IMO. This will hinder Cool Springs development.

I completely agree. I don't think that it is right that so much office space is being built in Williamson County. It will not all be filled for years, so it will be sucking development out of Nashville for years. The good thing, though, is that eventually it will be all built out, and there will be nowhere to go but Nashville, but that might not be for years.

I guess the broader question (and I'll throw this out to everyone) in light of this thread is: what role do you think that Franklin/Williamson County and Murfreesboro/Rutherford county should play in regards to Nashville?

Franklin and Williamson County should always take a small chunk of Davidson's stuff. For example, take a little of Nashville's business to keep them going, and take some people away from Nashville. Nashville's metro might grow by more than 100,000 people by 2010. Nashville could not take all of these people at once. It would be overwhelmed. I think we are adding the right amount of people to Nashville, not to much, but enough. We'd rather overwhelm the suburbs than the city itself.

I'll reiterate that my position is that these entities should be far more concerned with the interests of their own people above the direct interests of Nashville. When something is good for both Nashville and these cities/counties that's fine too, but I can't see how creating higher density in Nashville's urban core is typically in the best interests of these outlying areas.

As I mentioned above, I think that these outlying counties need to have some businesses, otherwise there would be no economy, and would be relying on Nashville to stay alive, and we don't want that either. However, at the moment, the suburbs are taking more than they need. I think there's a line somewhere in the middle of where the businesses should go.

Whoops, I forgot to add this next part with LA_TN's other post. These last two quotes were by relient J if you haven't noticed.

Goose Creek exit - have they communicated with TDOT on this? And since this is the last exit before 840, are they going to start building new exits next?

Yes, in fact, there are currently long term plans about widening I-65 to four lanes all the way down to 840. I'm not sure about extra exits. All this development is going up around the one Goose Creek Exit. This could be bad.

EDIT: I guess I had to many quotes in one post. Sorry about that. How many are we allowed to have, RK?

[cheeriokid61]

http://www.2dimes.com/gallery/site.html

Here is a video of Berry Farms done by the same people who have made the renderings for the Signature Tower. Now I can see that this is not like Cool Springs, but more like New Urbanism on steroids. Think Westhaven times 10. It's huge. This isn't what I was expecting. I guess it's a little better, but not much. It will be interesting to see how this turns out.

[Relient J]

It looks like a beautiful proposal!

[cheeriokid61]

It really does. I doubt it will turn out like Cool Springs. The problem, though, is that there will be mega neighborhoods around the project, which will look like Cool Springs.

And I drove around the site today. And I was wrong. It isn't that big. The difference between this and regular New Urbanism, though, is I think that this will focus of office and retail, with a little residential around the edges. But I'm not sure.

[BnaBreaker]

Well, perhaps I jumped the gun and blew this one out of proportion a little bit, but some of our complaints are still valid. Especially the office space.

[cheeriokid61]

I'm not saying this is good. But it's not horrible either.

[LA_TN]

Williamson Co. is the result of Nashville sprawling out while Rutherford is growing toward metro. Smyrna/LaVergne could be viewed as sprawl, but they are in no different position than Goodlettsville. IMO most people have always viewed Murf., Gallatin, and Lebanon as cities in their own light. Franklin and Brentwood were nothing until sprawl occurred. With that said, their whole existence is dependent on Nashville. Ok, but developers and now their city leaders have evolved to the point of offering incentives to lure companies from Davidson Co. As far as I know to date, Rutherford Co. has not exhibited this behavior.

Any city/county should put its citizens' needs first. What is the difference between Brentwood and, let's say, Lexington recruiting a company from Nashville? Both would be offering lower taxes/incentives etc. but the difference is Brentwood blows a double whammy because they are taking people too. This erodes Nashville's tax base. Positioned <15 miles from downtown allows them to go to the Coliseum/Area/etc. without having to pay for them. Ever try to go to the library in Brentwood? Unless you're a Brentwood/Williamson Co. citizen, YOU CAN'T!! Some might call that a bit selfish.

The role that any outlying metro area should serve is simple: promote growth. Overcome the greed and jealousy for Davidson Co. companies/residents; progress on your own merits. Being in metro is your residential/commercial incentive for growth.

Davidson Co. needs to build an office park to serve this sector of growth. One has been proposed by the airport area, it is needed. Now would be a good time. Not all companies can afford DT office space.

Something has got to change, there is a lot of available area in Davidson Co. for Class A office space. Yet developers are not jumping at the opportunity. Whatever reasons prevent this need to be fixed - ASAP.

[Relient J]

Ok, but developers and now their city leaders have evolved to the point of offering incentives to lure companies from Davidson Co. As far as I know to date, Rutherford Co. has not exhibited this behavior.

I think that's changing, at least in Murfreesboro. The Gateway Overlay District will eventually be ready to attract companies to the city. We've seen some progress toward that goal so far. The first phase of the Stone Gate Coporate Center looks to be relatively near completion. There's also a new office building next to it, and another nearby as well. Also, it looks as if things are progressing on the conference center front. I have mixed feelings about that one (and voted against it being funded by property taxes), but now that it's going forward I just hope for the best. I think in a few short years Murfreesboro is going to be an attractive place indeed for businesses to locate.

[Lexy]

I hate Murfreesboro. It is a city that has grown too fast, with poor leadership, no vision, and no pride in itself. Just drive down Old Fort Parkway and tell me that the CONSTANT stop and go, and weaving through pathetic traffic, and the views of unorganized sprawl (that continue to get worse with the "Gateway" project is something to be proud of. Any other city in the US that is the size of Murfreesboro has already got public transportation in place, and a vision for more urban enviroments in the city itself. Both of which, are nonexsistent in this town. Pathetic. The quality of life in this city will reach a point to where it will decline in an almost....Hickory Hollw kind of way. I liken the city government to that in LaVergne. Still from the farm, and still thinking like a small town bunch of good 'ol boys with all their good 'ol boys network in plce. You know how hard it was to get a Publix to come to town don't you? Very hard, considering that one of the councilmen is a former district manager for Kroger. You can see the conflict of intrest he had with the project (which is more sprawl further out from town). The only thing that will make me proud of this place is when I move back into the CITY of Nashville. That day will be 24 hours of nonstop celebration at my place!!!! Drinks on me.

Williamson County isn't any higher on my list of "likes" either.

[linclink]

Hey ReliantJ

I agree with you 100%

I am not from the area, but I think I can compare Nashville and Murfreesboro/Franklin to Miami and Fort Lauderdale. For years and years we heard Miami complaining about Ft. Laud. That we were just a sleepy beach town, That we were sprawl, that we were the burbs, etc.. etc.. Then they started complaining that we were taking business from them. Today we have a HUGE boom in our downtown. We have new buidings coming up left and right. And we are our own city. Miami can no longer ignore us. And most people who come down here would rather live in Fort Lauderdale than in Miami, since its much cleaner, much nicer, and with the same amenities (with the exception of sports teams, but miami is on the verge of loosing the marlins). I know I certainly would never want to live in Miami. The skyline shot is beautiful, but the street level sucks.

I get the feeling that the same thing happens with Nashville and their smaller neighbors. The problem is that these neighbors are competition. And Nashville is having a hard time keeping up. This isn't a dig at Nashville, but I do find it funny that if Nashville is the better place to live in, why should it care what gets built in Williamson County or Rutherford? For example, do you think Chicago cares what gets built in Aurora? Do you think Manhattan cares what gets built in Jersey? No. Why? Because they don't need to. Is nashville a great place? Yes... if it weren't I wouldn't want to move there. But is Franklin great too? Yes. I could live in their downtown. If I didn't care much for a boomnig downtown, I would live in downtown cool springs. Why? Because 20 years from now its not going to be a sleepy suburb. Their will be towers, their will be a core. And it will be a nice PLANNED city. Just like Fort Lauderdale is. And maybe these companies rather go to downtown Cool Springs and grow with the city, than go to Nashville.

Nashville is nice. But for people who don't like gritty, Franklin is probably nicer. And anyways... its a COUNTY away. They SHOULD try to get any company thats in the market. And Nashville should figure out why people are prefering to go to their neighbors to the south, and make whatever changes are necessary to stay competitive. That is the way a free market works. If you'll read the articles that came out around the time of the Nissan deal, you'll see that Nashville practically gave Nissan to Williamson county on a silver platter. I think a little competition is healthy. Nashville, being the Big Brother, shouldn't be scared of Williamson and Rutherford Counties. If it really is the better city, create better incentives and go after the money, instead of complaining that its not fair for Williamson and Rutherford to get everything. Those 2 counties must be doing something right if people want to live and build thier companies there instead. Find out what it is and change.

[rocky top buzz]

Lexy, why don't you tell us what you really think

I don't think this is Williamson County versus Davidson County. Williamson county offers campus-type environments for companies, and Davidson offers towers. If you start seeing 20 story office buildings going up in Franklin, or Maryland farms moving to Davidson, then you have a competition. It seems like each style is suited for a different clientel, and no one should be mad that onew is chosen over another. These are private companies and they can do what they want. They could build a sprawling campus in Joelton if Davidson county encouraged it.

The company I work for is located in East Nashville, and it used to be in the NationsBank building in downtown. Why did the company move? Parking was around $100 A MONTH!!! Why pay that when there's plenty of good office space elsewhere? That's one example of why not to work DT. I will say, however, that I was in the MAryland Farms area a couple of weeks ago, and when I left to go home at 5 PM in the afternoon, that was the worst suburban traffic I've seen outside of Atlanta!

[Relient J]

Thanks for the support, linclink!

Lexy, I definitely respect your opinion on Murfreesboro, and your arguments have definite merit to them. I think Murfreesboro is experiencing growing pains. The growth may well have been more than the city could cope with in the past, and may still be that way today. I even heard one of the city managers on WGNS admit that they made a mistake with the St. Andrews/Cason Ln. area. I think the Gateway project is a step in the right direction though. I shows that the city is working toward a pro-growth vision. The city has recently been working on city-wide design ordinances as well that will likely have a positive impact on the look of the city.

[LA_TN]

Yes, Murfreesboro has had more than its share of growing pains.

I agree that Davidson Co. needs to change whatever is causing companies to go to Williamson Co. There is room for office complexes inside of Davidson Co.

I don't agree with Cool Springs/Franklin being a well-planned area. It just didn't happen that way. One developer decided to build a mall then the area around I-65 was planned. Beyond that, there are no plans. I think that area shows a little progress, but not much. They are only thinking about the area by I-65 and eventually they will have to spread - then the pains will become evident.

I think most people would agree with me in that they want the surrounding counties to help Nashville grow as a metro, not just lure companies from Davidson Co.

[Relient J]

^ I would agree with that to the extent that its in the best interest of both parties. It would depend on the project.

[linclink]

I think most people would agree with me in that they want the surrounding counties to help Nashville grow as a metro, not just lure companies from Davidson Co.

Hey LA TN ,

I don't think I understand this line of reasoning. Why would a surrounding county be more interested in helping Nashville grow than it would be in helping itself grow? And why look at it as though they were "luring" companies away from Nashville. That line of thought presupposes that the companies which are relocating to middle tennesse are the rightful "prey" or "property" of Nashville. That is simply not true. When a company decides to relocate, they are free to go to the city or county of their choosing. And the fact that they chose one over the other does not, in my opinion mean that the company was lured away, nor "stolen" from Nashville. Nashville cannot claim something that doesn't belong to it. Nashville does not have a monopoly on the relocation market in Middle Tennessee. Would urbanists like to see all companies moving to downtown Nashville so they could have super cool skyscrapers and a dense downtown? Sure. But to accuse surrounding counties of being a detriment because they are being chosen over Nashville does not make any sense at all. And to expect them to sit back and not be proactive in getting as much business as possible to come to their cities and counties makes even less sense. Remember, Williamson and Rutherford counties have schools and other public services which they must provide. Last I checked Nashville doesn't help the surrounding counties in paying for schools, police, fire, roads, etc... etc... These counties are doing what they should do, looking out for their residents. A few people I know in Franklin told me that in the 5 years they had lived in Franklin they had only been to Nashville twice. They work in Franklin, shop in Franklin, have their recreation in Franklin, etc... Why should their elected officials look out for Nashville and its residents instead of the residents of their county? I really think that if Nashville wants to be a first class city, if it wants to compete with other first class cities, than it can't rely on the generosity (or lack thereof) of the surrounding counties in passing up on business.

[Lukin]

^^^ I completely agree with you linclink. I think alot of people on this site forget that people, businesses, and retail choose to locate in williamson/rutherford for a reason. Not everyone wants to live in an urban community, and you know what? That's ok. Franklin and brentwood might not be anything without nashville, but Nashville probably wouldn't be much without them either. If there weren't affluent suburbs, i seriously doubt nashville would have the appeal that it has. less businesses would relocate anywhere in the mid-state if there weren't options in both urban and suburban settings. There is a reason that people choose the suburbs over nashville: less crime, better schools, cleaner enviornment, less traffic, and bigger houses with more land. I doubt that many parents with three kids are going to consider signature tower a feasible option.

I think that alot of the hostility towards the suburbs is really unfounded. Franklin has one of the nicest, most pictaresque downtowns in the south. Its beautiful and offers a whole lot that nashville could never (remember that the franklin cinema has already had two hollywood premiers). And while cool springs or maryland farms might not be pretty, I think its really important to remember that they aren't stealing any businesses from nashville. As linclink said, the businesses are choosing those areas because they want to be in suburban office parks. If they didn't have the option of the suburbs then i doubt they would be in the mid-state area at all. Would you rather the businesses choose cool springs or memphis or charlotte or atlanta? I seriously doubt nissan would have relocated to this area if cool springs hadn't been an option. I think we would be hearing about a dallas suburb snatching them up. Remember: relocations to the nashville suburbs are GOOD for nashville!

[Relient J]

Great posts, linclink and Lukin! The two of you eloquently expressed what I could not. I work in Nashville, so I have a definite interest in seeing Nashville grow and continue to be the strong Middle Tennessee city that it is. However, I love my city Murfreesboro, and I'll root for companies to come here over Nashville or Franklin any day of the week. This doesn't mean that one city is better than the other, I just want to see the city of which I'm a citizen be the best that it can be. Were I a Nashvillian I would undoubtably root for Nashville over the other cities in the region.

[LA_TN]

Somebody shoot me...

I think most people would agree with me in that they want the surrounding counties to help Nashville grow as a metro, not just lure companies from Davidson Co.

Why would a surrounding county be more interested in helping Nashville grow than it would be in helping itself grow?

I didn't commnicate this clearly enough, try again. I think most people would agree with me in that they want the surrounding counties to help METRO (Nashville) grow, not just lure companies from Davidson Co.

Anyway, we need Nashville to grow - as a whole (ALL 13 counties). If a company or resident moves from Nashville to Lebanon or from Smyrna to Nashvile or Franklin to Goodletsville, what has the Nashville METRO gained? Nothing. When Nissan relocates from LA to Cool Springs, Nashville METRO is a winner.

When companies or individuals outside our region relocates within the 13 county metro; then we have a net gain - its called progress. When a company or resident relocates to a different area with the 13 county metro, there is no net gain, 90% of the time. I say 90% because there are obviously exceptions (Company moves to larger warehouse from landlocked location, move to a condo DT because kids are gone, etc.)

When a company decides to relocate, they are free to go to the city or county of their choosing. And the fact that they chose one over the other does not, in my opinion mean that the company was lured away, nor "stolen" from Nashville.

Agreed, I never implied that. Again, all metro counties should be proactive in recruiting companies; but company shopping in Davidson County (or any other county in metro) normally has no net gain effect on our metro. This is just robbing Peter to pay Paul.

A few people I know in Franklin told me that in the 5 years they had lived in Franklin they had only been to Nashville twice...Why should their elected officials look out for Nashville and its residents instead of the residents of their county? I really think that if Nashville wants to be a first class city, if it wants to compete with other first class cities, than it can't rely on the generosity (or lack thereof) of the surrounding counties in passing up on business.

As for the generosity thing on passing up business, I hope I have covered that.

You can find lots of people that never go to DT or even Davidson Co. for anything. That's fine, live under a rock, be a hermit, lead a rural life - all are ok!! But please understand most have a job becuase there is a first class CITY of Nashville, the Titans/Predators, Intl. Airport, etc. Without these services in Davidson Co., Franklin's population would still be about, oh say, 2,300 people. Yes, John Doe may never leave the Franklin City limits; but the owners of the company he works for moved their company here for the amenities of Nashville - the city and metro.

[LA_TN]

On a lighter note, Please understand that I am Pro-Nashville METRO. I want Murf. to grow as much as Cool Springs or DT. I don't appreciate some decisions Franklin City leaders have made; but Cool Springs is an area of metro that is attractive, well-kept, with decent schools. We can have lectures on the good qualities of Eagleville or Madison or Germantown, but all are part of Nashville metro. If we are fighting amonst ourselves, we will not progress. Metro Unite!! Hey, there's a good campaign slogan for someone!!

[Lexy]

Suburbs deserve very little credit from me. You will never see me give them that either. Until they start acting like they have some sense, I am not going to even give them the time of day. Call me narrow minded, stupid, or whatever. But I have seen how the suburbs have "added" as some of you say...so much to the city. But yet, I have witnessed how much they take away. Go to Canada and visit their cities, which have far fewer suburbs than Americas, and tell me about quality of life in the South (or USA for that matter) again. They're not perfect, but they make us look stupid in so many ways.

[Relient J]

Lexy, I have no intention to call you or anyone else here derogative names. I respect your opinion, and I'm glad you're here. I too hope that every city within Nashville's MSA sees growth and prosperity. At the same time though, I'm pro Murfreesboro and Rutherford county above those other areas. The metro, after all, is just a statistic. We're just talking about commuter patterns.

Lexy, in what ways are the suburbs "taking away"? What are they taking away from?

[linclink]

Hey LA TN,

Thanks for the clarification! And just to clarify, when said,

"Why would a surrounding county be more interested in helping Nashville grow than it would be in helping itself grow?"

I WAS talking specifically to you... but everywhere else I was referring to the general forumers who are opposed to the growth in Williamson... I don't want you to take it personally. And I hope there are no hard feelings.

Now to all forumers in general... I find a 13 county metro to be utterly unbelievable. I don't see how a metro area can be THAT large. I think someone mentioned that it is only for population census, and not for much of anything else. A 13 county metro with one central City serving all 13 COUNTIES (mind you, not cities)... is really unrealistic I think.

Again, when I speak to this subject I do so on a comparisson basis. But I think it is a valid comparisson. I think what we went through here in South Florida will probably be mirrored in Middle Tennessee withing the next 10 to 20 years. Let me give some perspective.

When we moved to South Florida 20 years ago Fort Lauderdale was considered to be part of Miami Metro. Just to clarify, Miami is in Dade County, while Ft. Laud. is in Broward County. There is about 35 miles separating the 2 cities. Baco Raton and West Palm Beach... which are part of Palm Beach County (50 miles from Miami), were also considered to be part of Miami Metro, as they were pretty much "suburban" when compared to miami. Both these cities had some buildings downtown... but nothing to brag about... Much like Williamson County and Rutherford. Back in the early 90's Ft. Lauderdale was voted as the best US city to live in with less than 100,000 people. Most of the area surrounding Ft. Lauderdale was farmland and everglades. Now, 20 years later, Fort Lauderdale (the county seat) has a metro (within Broward County) of 1.7 MILLION people. Downtown is booming. And 90% of the residents will PAY not to go to Miami. Our schools are better, we have a world class performing arts center... we have a convention center, Arena, metro rail, and LRT will start withing the next year. We are NOT dependent on Miami, have no reason to go there (unless one is a sports fan) and while we may not be as large a city as they are... we are perfectly happy with our growth, and we DO NOT want to emulate Miami (sort of like how Nashville DOES NOT want to emulate Atlanta).

Same thing goes for Palm Beach County. They now have a Metro area (within their County) of 1.1 Million.

Today, can Fort Lauderdale exist without Miami? Absolutely. Can West Palm exist without Miami? Absolutely. Can WPB exist without Fort Lauderdale? Absolutely. Today it is no longer the Miami Metro Area. It is the South Florida Metro Area!!!! And that is as it should be. The independent growth of Broward and Palm Beach Counties (in addition to Miami Dade County) has allowed for the South Florida region to grow as a whole. So now, instead of having a Huge city, with nothing but old decaying small towns and farms surrounding (where there are little jobs, little opportunities, and much poverty), we have 3 counties that offer great job opportunities, and a comfortable style of living. We also offer options. If Miami rocks your boat... you can go live there.. if you prefer a smaller yet more sofisticated city, theres Ft. Laud. And if you prefer Palm Beach... theres plenty of opportunities there as well.

Now back on topic. I have a feeling that the same thing will play out in Middle Tennessee. In 10 to 20 years, if growth continues on the same track... you will not have a Nashville Metro encompassing 13 counties. You'll have a Middle Tennessee Metro encompassing 13 counties. The economy of Middle Tennesse will be much stronger if it has a Metro area, with a great Downtown in Williamson County, as well as another Metro area with a great downtown in Rutherford County in addition to the Nashville Metro area in Davidson County. This isn't pie in the sky either. Having lived through it down here, where no one could ever have dreamed that it would happen, I can assure you that not only is it a possibility, it is a great probability. There are to many similarities between the 2 regions for it not to happen. Like Broward, Williamson is a wealthy county. It has a high quality of life, and is very attractive to families, as well as to companies looking to relocate. Again, with both Franklin and Murfreesboro... you have areas that have already shown that they are in the game for keeps, and will probably become more agressive in going after businesses and economic prosperity. And they should. Because their growth IS good for the Middle Tennessee Metro area of 13 counties. Now does that mean its good for Nashville/Davidson county? Maybe not. But the region as a whole WILL benefit from their growth. And again, Nashville needs to find a way to stay competitive if it too wants to grow within the next few years. But it has to do so without whining about the growth of its neighbors.

[linclink]

Hey Lukin,

I agree completely with your post!! Word for word!! Franklin does offer alot in regards to family livinig. And their old downtown is amazing. Its family friendly, while having a great urban feel in terms of a walkable downtown, and great things to do. Cool Springs is nice to... yes its a bit sprawly and suburbany... but again... once growth starts to explode... thats probably where a new downtown would be... once there are some nice towers there... it will make for a GREAT downtown. And neigborhoods WILL start to come up, where now there is only nasty subdivisions... Remember, downtowns do grow over time. Franklin wont always be able to stay as it is today (thats a shame in terms of the rural aspects and the great farms, and views, ec...... but progress and a city core will eventually come... even to Cool Springs)

And your right about the attractiveness of williamson county for a family. As a mom with 3 young kids, while I'd LOVE to live in a downtown loft or a building like the sig tower, I know that it really won't work for me. But, once the kids are in college.. boy.. we're already making plans for a great downtown loft!!! hehehehehehe

[BnaBreaker]

I, for one, of course think it is PERFECTLY FINE if someone doesn't want to live in central Nashville. I think it's fine if somebody wants to live in a suburb. Nobody, to my knowledge, ever made the claim that it wasn't. HOWEVER, this issue is FAR from black and white.

Forgive my bluntness here, but I am SO TIRED of people seeing things in the frame of 'if you don't live in an apartment downtown, you have to live in sprawl! And that's OKAY!" First of all, there can be and should be MANY shades of gray in between disgusting cul-de-sac sprawl that seems to be the only option in places like Franklin, and a freakin' 50th floor condo in downtown Nashville. Just because somebody doesn't prefer to live in an apartment, which is fine, DOESN'T MEAN that the only other option is to live on a cul-de-sac in Franklin or La Vergne.

SECOND of all, NO! It is NOT "OKAY" that people desire to live in cul-de-sac suburbia! It is okay if people want the single family home lifestyle. Perfectly fine. When I have kids, i'd like that lifestyle too. But it is not "OKAY" to desire to live in one of the typical sprawling messes in a place like Franklin. I'm sorry, but in our world we are SO FAR beyond this being a "lifestyle" choice anymore. We don't have that luxury anymore. I hate to sound like a doomsday drama queen here, but Irresponsible sprawl IS, without a doubt, helping to slowly choke our planet of its resources and destroying the environment (not to mention all the other crap it contributes to). A lifestyle choice is whether you live in a downtown apartment or a single family home. The planning of a community, the street grid, and the growth patterns are NOT a lifestyle choice. I'm just SO SICK of people poo-pooing sprawl, trying to take the middle of the road position in an attempt to cause as little conflict as possible. IT IS NOT OKAY if someone wants to move 40 freakin miles from the center of the city to live in a massive mcmansion in a subdivision full of houses that have acre yards, and buy their four SUVs. We have got to start getting this through our heads. If you want to live on a farm? Great. Live in a small town? Cool. Well-planned suburb that is tied into the central city? Wonderful. Places like La Vergne and Brentwood though are NOT "FINE". Okay...I think i might have it out of my system. For now. lol

By the way, please note that this was not directed at anyone inparticular.

[rocky top buzz]

That's a great way of putting it linkclink.

When I moved here, I personally thought of this area as similar to Atlanta. Atlanta has Suburbs of Marietta, Duluth, Sharpsburg, Fayetteville, etc... And Nashville has suburbs or Murfreesboro, Franklin, Hendersonville, Ashland City, etc... The problem is, it doesn't really work that way here. The outlying cities are not totally dependent on Nashville. Yes, the museums, the sports teams, the arenas are here in town, and you do have to have a Nashville-type leader in the area, but look at Murfreesboro: they are moving in the direction of mass transit, they are building a convention center, they have their own network of traffic cameras... While there is no way they would be where they are today without Nashville's growth, fact is, people wanted to get out of town and get to a more rural area. With Murfreesboro exploding, I know a lot of people who moved there to get out of the city are now moving to Shelbyville. Should Murfreesboro hate Shelbyville? Some of you probably would say yes.