Relocating to Memphis?

[mandrws1]

I think there are some who get an elitist thrill out of downgrading Memphis and creating a self-fulfilling prophecy. They must get the same kind of visceral satisfaction, and feel some level of promotion in social status, that Leonard Maltin gets when he creams a movie. Sort of a "if you criticize it, you must be too good for it." Therefore, to achieve that status, what do you need to do? Dis it. And it spreads. And creates a misperception on visitors and transplants about what kind of city Memphis is.

I dont wanna bombard yall with my slang, but those people are simply called "HATERS" a.k.a. "PLAYA HATAS"! I often think of them as losers because with all of the many positive things to do in Memphis, they can't find a single one because they obviously don't fit in with everyone else who's enjoying living in such a wonderfully unique place! There's a guy who posts on urban planet that lives in Memphis and downs the city all the time, but I won't say names......

[sleepy]

I don't want to scare off our future transplant by overemphasizing certain negatives that Memphians feel about Memphis which is what this thread seems to be doing.

I've lived in a number of cities, and many, many people in those cities remark about their towns the same way that Memphians remark about Memphis, no more, no less.

[Bears]

I don't want to scare off our future transplant by overemphasizing certain negatives that Memphians feel about Memphis which is what this thread seems to be doing.

I've lived in a number of cities, and many, many people in those cities remark about their towns the same way that Memphians remark about Memphis, no more, no less.

True. We aren't trying to scare fearlessvk, just trying to inform her of what some coworker might say to try and scare her by saying the city is "dangerous" or "ghetto" or whatever and its simply not true. She should go out and see what a great city we have and that we aren't naive idiots when we say Memphis is a great place to live.

[Clobber]

Yeah, just take what people say with a grain of salt, and realize the self-deprecating nature many Memphians have.

Memphis is a great, uniquely soulful city with great people. There are probably a number of organizations that could easily help with getting acclimated. And if you're not comfortable joining an organization, I, and I know many of us, know of folks who will be glad to help you out.

[sleepy]

Yeah, just take what people say with a grain of salt, and realize the self-deprecating nature many Memphians have.

I just find it strange to find more talk of self-deprecation on this thread than most others. Memphis is no more unique in its self-deprecation than most any town I've lived in. What is unique about Memphis is that Memphians tend to think for some reason that they're novel in that self-deprecation and go on at great lengths about it. That attitude in and of itself is pretty parochial.

I get really, really tired of hearing the term "self-loathing". Go to a suburb of Chicago and ask them what they think of Chicago. They'll say it's the pits, but they won't think they're special or unique in that regard.

[jmduke]

For our fearless soon-to-be transplant: I flew an out-and-back trip to a FL panhandle city last night/this morning for our local NWA regional airline and my captain had lived in both Boston and San Mateo, CA prior to living in Memphis. He said he thoroughly enjoys living in Memphis and compared it favorably to his former locales. So there's another vote for our fair city.

[fearlessvk]

Hey again everyone!

Wow, I'm pleased to have provoked so much discussion!!! In any case, don't worry about scaring me off - I've already tracked down all the hyper-negative Memphis commentary on the internet that you could possibly imagine. So no one is going to say anything I haven't already encountered. It wasn't until I stumbled on this place that I started to have some glimmer of hope that I wasn't about to squander the next 4 or 5 years of my life in lonely misery.... (it's doubtful I'll stay in Memphis forever, not because I'm expecting to hate it, but just because I eventually want to move on to a different university that has more faculty who do the kind of work I do - this is what you would call a "starter" acaemic job....)

The crime stuff doesn't phase me - I lived in Oakland, CA for 4 and a half years, where my family was convinced I would get mugged (or worse) if I ever set foot outside my apartment after the sun went down. I know how cities can develop these reputations for excessive crime when outsiders are unable to comprehend that there might be dangerous PARTS of town but there might also be beautiful and hospitable parts of town. Technically Washington D.C. invariably rates as one of the most "dangerous" and "crime-ridden" cities in the country, but this needn't affect you unless you foolishly wander into the wrong part of town. I'm always struck by the fact that, despite DC's consistent negative ratings on these "dangerous city" lists, that doesn't seem to bring down the city's overall reputation, whereas cities like Memphis, New Orleans, and Baltimore instantly signify to sooo many people blighted ghettos. I can only conclude there's something very fishy and unfortunate happening to the reputation of cities which are also known for having large African-American populations.

I'm much more scared of the mosquitos than the criminals - since moving to the Bay Area, I don't think I've gotten a mosquito bite in 7 years!!!! I'd almost entirely forgotten about the existence of bug repellent...

Anyway, since you all seem to love the opportunity to talk about memphis, I'll just bombard you with a million random questions - pick and choose whatever you feel like answering, and of course feel free to ignore me as well

-- Someone earlier mentioned Memphis' very active "visual arts" scene. Is this largely centered around galleries? In a particular part of town? I ask because in reading up about Memphis, I've certainly encountered stuff about the Brooks Art Museum and the Dixon (?) Gallery, both of which certainly sound great, but both of which also sound largely focused on older art - renaissance stuff and impressionist stuff, I gathered. I'm curious what kind of modern and contemporary art scene exists in the city? Something outside of kitschy touristy galleries, I hope?

-- I am a huge film nerd.... the video store someone mentioned earlier sounded wonderful.... but I'm also curious if there are any theaters or venues in town which screen classics or older movies? I know it's going to be impossible outside of NY or LA to find a comparable film scene to SF, but I'm hoping the occasional screening will keep me happy!

-- How much do native Memphians actually use the trolley as a means of transportation? I know it's not sufficient without a car but is it something you could rely on to get around certain parts of town, and to get to various downtown/midtown places worth visiting, or is it really very much just a tourist attraction or a novelty?

-- Speaking of public transportation, I also found on the MATA transit web page some information about plans for a regional rail system (MATATRAC) and was wondering what this is all about and how serious it is.

-- How tolerant is Memphis for gays and lesbians?? I have a million gay and lesbian friends in SF, many of whom I hope will visit me. Many of them, being in SF, are suspicious of a Southern city which also has a reputation for beng the "buckle of the bible belt" and such. From my own scattered readings I gather midtown is the most gay-friendly part of town, but I'm wondering what native Memphians' overall impression is on this front. I've always found that cities who embrace their gay and lesbian population also tend to be exciting, interesting, and vibrant places, and I'm hoping that Memphis isn't too intolerant on this front.

-- I'm actually hoping upon first moving to Memphis to find roommates and not live alone. Obviously on a professor's salary, unlike a grad student's salary in the Bay Area (don't ask...it's painful!!!), I could afford a pretty nice place of my own, but since I literally don't know a single human being in memphis, i thought it would be less lonely at first to live with someone, or with a few people. But in SF anyone looking for roommates immediately uses craigslist, and the Memphis craigslist is still pretty new and not very active. Anyone know what services are best to use for a young person looking for roommates? (defiintely from what everyone here has said midtown, and especially cooper-young, sounds like my destination of choice!)

-- Random curiosity: is Memphis absorbing a lot of prior New Orleans residents in the wake of Hurricane Katrina?

-- More random curiosity: speaking of Memphis' unfair poor reputation, I suspect some of you are familiar with this book about the "creative class" by this guy Richard Florida which came out in 2001 or 2002 and argued that conventional wisdom about what makes a city attractive was all wrong in the "information age" and that cities had to be hospitable places for the young "creative class" which is the bedrock of the new economy. Lots of buzz words and pop-urban theory no doubt, but Memphis was ranked a miserable 49 out of the 49 largest cities in terms of its attractiveness to the "creative class" - beneath places like Oklahoma City and Grand Rapids, MI. This struck me as hard to believe, given Memphis' cultural history - although New Orleans also ranked low on the list, which made me even more suspicious about the type of factors this guy was using to measure a city's creativity. In any case, though, I'm wondering if this book was a big deal in Memphis, how people responded, if people had an opinion about his ranking system, etc etc?

Thank you so much in advance for indulging my stupid newbie outsider's questions!!!

Cheers,

S

[fieldmarshaldj]

-- How tolerant is Memphis for gays and lesbians?? I have a million gay and lesbian friends in SF, many of whom I hope will visit me. Many of them, being in SF, are suspicious of a Southern city which also has a reputation for beng the "buckle of the bible belt" and such. From my own scattered readings I gather midtown is the most gay-friendly part of town, but I'm wondering what native Memphians' overall impression is on this front. I've always found that cities who embrace their gay and lesbian population also tend to be exciting, interesting, and vibrant places, and I'm hoping that Memphis isn't too intolerant on this front.

Y'know, I see questions posted like this from time to time, and it tends to raise my blood pressure. Given the Bay Area's infamous reputation of colossal intolerance and bigotry towards the religious, Conservatives, and Republicans as a rule, it's hard not to see the hypocrisy that us "Southern types" are expected to cater towards "certain classes" when the reverse is never seen. Unless your friends are intent on screaming their sexual proclivities from the moment they fly into the airport, I'm sure they'll have no problems.

[sleepy]

Well, I'll be happy to answer those questions as best I can, but it'll take a day or two. Plus all the posters will get into arguments over their answers! Btw--while I'm a native Memphian, I spent 25 years in New Orleans and now teach (adjunct) at 2 small colleges in southern Minnesota and northern Iowa. Anyway, New Orleans by far was my favorite, but unlike most southern cities, Memphis has an urban core--midtown and downtown--that actually resembles an old city--sort of a southern version of a mini-Chicago.

Anyway, there's a journal/blog that a downtown Memphian does which I read occasionally--

http://paulryburn.com/blog/

You might want to contact him at [email protected]

From reading his blog, I imagine he'd be happy to answer questions.

Edit: Fieldmarshall is a conservative republican/libertarian (not that there's anything wrong with that!) from Nashville, 200 miles east of Memphis. Both Memphis and Nashville are democratic strongholds, so I wouldn't take his politicalizations of your inquiries as representative of either city. I mean, you ask a question about gay tolerance in Memphis and he's got to rant about the Bay area.

[fieldmarshaldj]

Edit: Fieldmarshall is a conservative republican/libertarian (not that there's anything wrong with that!) from Nashville, 200 miles east of Memphis. Both Memphis and Nashville are democratic strongholds, so I wouldn't take his politicalizations of your inquiries as representative of either city. I mean, you ask a question about gay tolerance in Memphis and he's got to rant about the Bay area.

Ugh ! A Libertarian ? You have pooped in my Rice Krispies, suh !

Like I said, it was just a rather irritating question. Unless someone is doing an over-the-top "Will & Grace" caricature and getting up in people's faces, why would it even need to be asked ? If the question does have validity, so did mine if a religious Conservative/Republican asked about what kind of intolerance they would face visiting the Bay Area. It works both ways, y'know.

[sleepy]

Ugh ! A Libertarian ? You have pooped in my Rice Krispies, suh !

Like I said, it was just a rather irritating question. Unless someone is doing an over-the-top "Will & Grace" caricature and getting up in people's faces, why would it even need to be asked ? If the question does have validity, so did mine if a religious Conservative/Republican asked about what kind of intolerance they would face visiting the Bay Area. It works both ways, y'know.

But the question wasn't posed by a conservative Christian moving to the Bay Area. The question was posed by someone wanting to know whether the stereotypes of the South which had been formed by her Bay Area gay friends were true or not. Yet you respond with your own stereotype which is probably equally untrue.

[fieldmarshaldj]

But the question wasn't posed by a conservative Christian moving to the Bay Area. The question was posed by someone wanting to know whether the stereotypes of the South which had been formed by her Bay Area gay friends were true or not. Yet you respond with your own stereotype which is probably equally untrue.

Imagine if the question had been posed by a Christian Conservative and the scorn the elites would make at it ! I am just wondering exactly what this "stereotype" of what the young lady's friends believe would happen if they visited ? Would they be abducted by Southern Baptists, taken to a secret location, and forced to watch Pat Robertson/700 Club reruns until they turned straight ? As I said, it was simply an irritating and offensive inquiry.

[Bears]

-- Speaking of public transportation, I also found on the MATA transit web page some information about plans for a regional rail system (MATATRAC) and was wondering what this is all about and how serious it is.

-- Random curiosity: is Memphis absorbing a lot of prior New Orleans residents in the wake of Hurricane Katrina?

-- More random curiosity: speaking of Memphis' unfair poor reputation, I suspect some of you are familiar with this book about the "creative class" by this guy Richard Florida which came out in 2001 or 2002 and argued that conventional wisdom about what makes a city attractive was all wrong in the "information age" and that cities had to be hospitable places for the young "creative class" which is the bedrock of the new economy. Lots of buzz words and pop-urban theory no doubt, but Memphis was ranked a miserable 49 out of the 49 largest cities in terms of its attractiveness to the "creative class" - beneath places like Oklahoma City and Grand Rapids, MI. This struck me as hard to believe, given Memphis' cultural history - although New Orleans also ranked low on the list, which made me even more suspicious about the type of factors this guy was using to measure a city's creativity. In any case, though, I'm wondering if this book was a big deal in Memphis, how people responded, if people had an opinion about his ranking system, etc etc?

The trolley line goes thru the Medical District and Downtown. It was meant to be for tourists but helps St. Jude workers and other Downtowners go out to lunch or people can park for free in Midtown and go to a Grizzlies game or some other event at Fedex Forum. Downtown straddles the Mississippi River long but only a couple of blocks wide. The trolley goes in a loop around downtown so its easy to go anywhere. The Midtown line only goes down Madison thru the Edge, Medical District, and Little Saigon.

EDIT- Forgot to say MATATRAC is a very early plan to be completed by 2020. 1st complete line is scheduled to be done by 2010 from Midtown to the Airport. From there on, the line to Collierville and Germantown (suburbs in Southest Shelby County). There are railroad tracks that already go from the fairgrounds to these suburbs and the airport line will intersect them. I think this statement maybe confusing to someone unfamiliar to the city. Can somebody please post a picture of a map of the lines I'm talking about? Also point out where the U of M and other landmarks are.

There were many Katrina evacuees in Memphis right after the hurricane hit. Not as many as Baton Rouge or Houston but enough for Ray Nagin to make stops and have meetings in Memphis. No way to know how many are actually in town but many have said Memphis will be their homes for good. Part of the Voodoo Music Festival was moved from New Orleans to Memphis because the organizers said Memphis has a very similar vibe to New Orleans.

Yea I read about that creative class thing. I wonder what made him think that? Memphis has always had a very creative citizens. Saliva, Three Six Mafia, Justin Timberlake, Ingram Hill, Chris Parnell (from SNL), Craig Brewer (producer of Hustle and Flow), Issac Hayes, BB King, and of course Elvis just to name a few are all from here and the Memphis College of Art attracts creative students from all over and they're always doing a few projects around town. And I've also heard Memphis is the most mentioned city in songs, so it inspires quite a few singers.

[sleepy]

Now that the political tit for tat is hopefully out of the way, maybe I can give you some answers. As I said earlier, I don't live in Memphis any longer, but try to keep my ear to the ground so to speak:

1. Visual art--the South Main area is full of independent galleries. Here's a list:

http://www.southmainmemphis.org/galleries.asp

Also, there's some sort of artists' consortium in that area called Delta Axis http://www.deltaaxis.org/powerhouse/ and another downtown called Marshall Arts.

That's downtown. I imagine other areas, Midtown in particular, have galleries as well, I'm just not familiar with them. Once a month, there's a trolley tour of the downtown galleries with free rides, wine, and so on.

2. Film--Don't know much about it. There's a Memphis Indie Film Festival, and Memphis has been a center of location filmmaking for awhile (local Craig Brewer with "Hustle and Flow"). I'm not sure about venues, but I believe the Malco Theater in Overton Square in Midtown might show classics and/or older films. I believe the Orpheum downtown does as well. Certainly, the museums and colleges will show those.

3. Streetcars/Public transit--locals who use the streetcars are primarily those who live or work downtown, or those who are parking elsewhere and attending some event. It's not a commuter line. Tourists use it a lot as well. One stub goes east down Madison Avenue to Midtown and it's rarely used at all since it stops in the middle of nowhere. It was built to connect to the LRT line to the airport which, btw, is temporarily on hold pending funding issues.

4. Gays--no one will care whether your friends are gay or not, at least in the city. There are gay bars all over and so on. But to be honest, they would probably attract some stares if they were walking around holding hands in some of the suburbs. There were only 3 state senators in TN who voted against a ban on gay marriages--2 were from Memphis and 1 was from Nashville.

5. Roommates--don't know where you'd look.

6. Katrina evacuees--12,000 came to Memphis. I've read of some staying, I don't know how many.

7. The Creative Class--I've always thought that by "creative" he assumes the creation, marketing, and selling of software and other technology. That's a new--and imho a poor--spin on the word "creativity". As you say, places like New Orleans and Memphis were pretty much off the list, although both cities have--in the true sense of the word--created and contributed much to America's culture. Heck, Memphis was the birthplace of the blues, a center of soul music, and has a vibrant music scene today. There's a book, "It Came From Memphis", by Robt. Gordon, which details those contributions. I just like "organically" hip cities which have a uniquely un-selfconscious, creative vibe and Memphis is one of those.

From the questions you ask, I think you'd enjoy living downtown. It's gritty, soulful, cheap by Bay Area standards, with plenty to do, safe, great restaurants, bars, full of singles, and you can park your car on the weekends and get around by streetcar.

[mrwest]

Anyway, since you all seem to love the opportunity to talk about memphis, I'll just bombard you with a million random questions

-- Memphis' very active "visual arts" scene.

-- I am a huge film nerd....

-- How much do native Memphians actually use the trolley as a means of transportation?

-- plans for a regional rail system (MATATRAC) and was wondering what this is all about and how serious it is.

-- How tolerant is Memphis for gays and lesbians??

-- book about the "creative class" by this guy Richard Florida

I'll take a shot at answering a few of your questions:

-- As for the visual arts scene, I would suggest checking out the Trolley Tour the last Friday of every month from 6-9PM in the South Main district downtown. Essentially all the galleries stay open late so that people can come by and see (and hopefully purchase) the art and drink wine. I went to the last one and one photo gallery had some young Croatian girls doing a dance performace. Not being much of an art critic, I can't speak to how modern the galleries are and whether they would be considered too touristy (though I doubt it).

-- Film seems to be really catching on here from Walk the Line to Craig Brewer's Hustle & Flow. And this does seem to play on down to the independant level enough where last weekend even I was able to help a friend out as an extra in his upcoming independent B style movie. The best place to see something outside the typical Hollywood fare is probably Studio on the Square in Midtown and weekly at the Orpheum during their summer movie series.

-- As for the trolley, my wife and I live in the South Main area toward the end of the trolley line. We usually walk to FedEx Forum and even most anywhere South of about Madison. The trolley is nice to have in case of bad weather, when we want to go further (i.e. the Pinch district by the Pyramid), or when we're just plain lazy

-- from what little I've heard, the regional rail system is just plans. Don't expect to see it in the 5 or so years you said you'd be here.

-- Midtown is certainly the area where most gays and lesbians live, although I know others that are doing well downtown. It is pretty common to see gay pride stickers, shirts, etc at Midtwon festivals like the Cooper Young festival.

-- as for the creative class, in May 2003 Memphis hosted the Memphis Manifesto hosted by Richard Florida. I don't know a whole lot about what happened but here is a link: Memphis Manifesto BTW, MPACT Memphis had a big hand in this.

One last thing, I think some of the people who are so vocal about their dislike for Memphis tend to spend a lot of time sitting on their couches in the suburbs. Memphis has a lot of fun and exciting things to do but many of them are of the hidden gem style and won't just jump out at you. I get the feeling that you'll get out and look for them anyway, but a few to start your search are: Gus's Chicken, the National Civil Rights Museum (not promoted nearly as much as it deserves for the effect it had on our history), Gibson Guitar Factory

[hgupta]

I haven't finished Richard Florida's Book. The man pisses me off because his idea of creativity is basically souless art. I actually feel that Memphis has a lot larger creative class than other cities for many reasons. Mainly, artists and musician's can afford to live here on their income from art. You would be hard pressed to find an artist that can do that in Manhattan or SF, unless they were already sucessful before they moved there. I don't think that he ever lived here, and like any city heavy on tourism, the good stuff is hidden away.

There are tons of musician's here. Bands can actually practice or record in their own homes as opposed to having to rent practice space like you do in bigger cities. I would say that well over half the people I know play an instrument or sing. I doubt Richard Florida actually counted the musicians in Gospel Choirs, Rock bands, punk bands, soul, R&B, hip hop artists, juke joints, rockabilly groups. The numbers don't add up to his claim of a low creativity index. Maybe he only included music and art that he liked? If he only looked at how much money flowed into the arts, he failed to consider that maybe people don't donate directly to art commissions because they're actively giving money to musicians and artists by going to shows and buying their products. South Main art district is growing very well, and Circuit Playhouse is now raising money to build a new theater where Kates antiques was at Union and Cooper. These happen for a reason. Maybe he failed to consider that a lot of people can't afford thousand dollar paintings from a well established artist, but it doesn't mean that they don't treasure the $50 painting they did squeeze out of their budget.

Also there is a lot of homegrown art and culture that is distinct to the delta region. A lot of art and a lot of music happening in Memphis. Its not what would appeal to a SOHO gallery and its not generic coffeeshop singer/songwriters, but it is still art, and its great music. The Ornametal Metal museum is a good example: a lot of it is beautiful art that I love, but you would never find it in a fancy gallery.

The city has responded to his book by working to implement his suggestions, (see this website on the Memphis Manifesto: http://www.volumeonemag.com/memphis_manifesto.htm, and I have met with some people who were trying to fix what they perceived was wrong with Memphis music and art scenes. The problem was that they were all outsiders who didn't know much about the music and art scenes in Memphis. They kept trying to figure out how to help musicians on Beale St, where very little of Memphis' music comes from now.

I don't care for Richard Florida's book, but I am impressed with Carol Coletta.

Anyways, to address your other concerns:

There are a lot of galleries in Memphis besides the two museums. South Main has become an art gallery district and there are quite a few others that are scattered throughout Memphis.

When friends visit me from other cities, they are always surprised how tolerant the city is compared to the southern stereotype. I knew that there are a ton of gay bars and clubs in Memphis, but I didn't realize until I read this wiki: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Midtown,_Memphis.

There were quite of few people who relocated from New Orleans. many of them have gone back by now, but I know quite a few that have stayed up here. New Orleans is probably the city most similar to Memphis, so I think its an easy fit for many of them.

[fearlessvk]

I know I keep saying this, but THANK YOU again for answering my endless questions, everyone. you guys have been more helpful than anything else I've tracked down.... and I love hearing people who are enthusiastic about their home city!

I feel as though I've perhaps accidentally started a nasty vibe here though with the question about tolerance for gays and lesbians, and that really wasn't my intention, so I apologize. No one in SF, including me, imagined for a split second that it would be dangerous for a gay person to walk down the street in Memphis. However I don't think it's absurd to wonder what kind of reaction a gay couple holding hands might get - here in the Bay Area, all you need to do is venture out past Berkeley and Oakland in the East Bay and gay couples can get a lot of glares and nasty comments, and I find that sort of thing to be quite upsetting. I read an article about gay life in Memphis in the Memphis Flyer and it did mention the fact that many gays and lesbians in the city were closeted for fear of losing a job or inspiring animosity from their neighbors. I admit that that worried me, it's simply very different from the culture I'm used to, and I'm moving completely by myself to a city I'm utterly unfamliar with, so it's hard not to have some apprehensions about culture shock - I would understand if you felt the same way anticipating a move to SF (by the way, obviously this isn't the board to discuss SF, but if you were planning on moving up here and asked a question about the local Christian community and about whether it is hard to be a conservative in SF, I would try to answer respectfully and honestly and I would be sympathetic to your concerns)

Aaaaaanyway....found all the comments on Florida's book interesting, and they confirmed what I suspected - that his conception of creativity is absurdly biased toward the high-tech industry. And I certainly wouldn't disagree that a lot of people involved in that industry are, indeed, young and creative, and can contribute a lot to a local urban culture, but it strikes me as a blinkere and narrow view of creativity when that becomes the overriding definition, and somehow a city like New Orleans, as a result, rates as an uncreative city. I also noticed that Nashville ranked really high on Florida's list - does Nashville have a big burgeoning high-tech industry? I had no idea.

.....all the good things about Memphis you guys have told me aside, I'm still really unhappy about the mosquitos!!!!! i used to get eaten alive by those things in the summertime back east....

Cheers,

S

[mandrws1]

You can find a roommate on apartmentguide.com

[Clobber]

I just find it strange to find more talk of self-deprecation on this thread than most others. Memphis is no more unique in its self-deprecation than most any town I've lived in. What is unique about Memphis is that Memphians tend to think for some reason that they're novel in that self-deprecation and go on at great lengths about it. That attitude in and of itself is pretty parochial.

I get really, really tired of hearing the term "self-loathing". Go to a suburb of Chicago and ask them what they think of Chicago. They'll say it's the pits, but they won't think they're special or unique in that regard.

I respect that perspective. However, I was absolutely floored by the boosterism I experienced in St. Louis, where I lived for seven years, as well as the appreciation that folks in Tucson have for their town. In my experience, those two places have a level of often-irrational unabashed boosterism that I haven't seen for the most part in my years in Memphis.

I think other rust-belt cities might experience similar things. I have seen threads bemoaning the lack of boosterism in places such as Baltimore on sites such as ssp, perhaps they have not characterized it as "self-deprecation."

From my experience living in different places, I think the level of self-respect in Memphis is much different than other places. You obviously have different experiences; I can't say they're wrong. I just haven't experienced them.

[mandrws1]

I don't know how old you guys are, but I'm assuming its the older generation that participates in "self-loathing" because I'm 24 and the people I know that are around my age LOVE living in Memphis! Everyone I bring to the city loves it too.

[Bears]

My rough map of Memphis' light rail plan and some neighborhoods. Only the brown lines connecting downtown are used for transit now. The one in the NE was donated for light rail and the southern one is used heavily by freight.

And don't worry about creating a bad vibe. IMO it was an acceptable concern.

[Clobber]

Fearless, I'll try to fill in some places folks may not have. There's certainly a ton of stuff here to review. In addition to South Main, there is a pocket of galleries around Manassas and Madison. If I remember correctly, one of the Delta Axis galleries (Marshall Arts) is there, as is a small theater, and perhaps some other galleries. There's an outdoor sculture 'round there. It's not as big as South Main, but it's near the Medical Center (there is a new cancer clinic opening up near that block) as well as SW Tenn. Community College. So hopefully that area will get developed more. It certainly has a lot of potential to blend an art district with entertainment, restaurants, and clubs, kind of like Cooper-Young.

Also, some folks have already mentioned Cooper Young, there are some galleries there.

Most others have covered everything I would've covered.

[fieldmarshaldj]

I feel as though I've perhaps accidentally started a nasty vibe here though with the question about tolerance for gays and lesbians, and that really wasn't my intention, so I apologize. No one in SF, including me, imagined for a split second that it would be dangerous for a gay person to walk down the street in Memphis. However I don't think it's absurd to wonder what kind of reaction a gay couple holding hands might get - here in the Bay Area, all you need to do is venture out past Berkeley and Oakland in the East Bay and gay couples can get a lot of glares and nasty comments, and I find that sort of thing to be quite upsetting. I read an article about gay life in Memphis in the Memphis Flyer and it did mention the fact that many gays and lesbians in the city were closeted for fear of losing a job or inspiring animosity from their neighbors. I admit that that worried me, it's simply very different from the culture I'm used to, and I'm moving completely by myself to a city I'm utterly unfamliar with, so it's hard not to have some apprehensions about culture shock - I would understand if you felt the same way anticipating a move to SF (by the way, obviously this isn't the board to discuss SF, but if you were planning on moving up here and asked a question about the local Christian community and about whether it is hard to be a conservative in SF, I would try to answer respectfully and honestly and I would be sympathetic to your concerns)

Well, you and I are about the same age (just to clear up any assumptions I am some old fogey -- I am a young fogey), and we obviously have resided in areas where the values systems are vastly different. I don't want to turn this into a long-winded discussion of social issues. I merely tend to get hacked-off at usage of phrases such as "tolerance", as I tend to observe those screaming it the most loudly only apply it to issues with which they agree and have viscerally ugly reactions to those they disagree with. As you say, because you have many gay friends, you find it upsetting at the reaction you see from other areas outside "safe zones" at the mildest displays of affection, and that is likely going to be the reaction in most other mainstream areas of America (and whether folks agree or not, SF/Berkeley is not a mainstream area, and hasn't been for many decades) where people are equally upset at public displays (of course, if hand-holding is all that's going on, surely there are other more pressing issues to get worked up over, I'd think). Probably the worst thing I could think of for you and your friends to encounter in Memphis would be your basic crime problems (the kind you get targeted regardless of your skin color, gender, orientation, etc.), which is probably similar to Oakland in that regard... of course, they could probably cut the crime rate in half just sacking the political machine running the city and Shelby County.

[bluff2085]

I don't know how old you guys are, but I'm assuming its the older generation that participates in "self-loathing" because I'm 24 and the people I know that are around my age LOVE living in Memphis! Everyone I bring to the city loves it too.

Age probably has something to do with it. A lot of the people I know my age have parents in the area (but primarily in the suburbs) who talk down Memphis in the way that many of you have pointed out--with the accordingly blatant lack of evidence. On the other hand, their children have come to appreciate the city in ways that their parents probably didn't. This is just my opinion but the attitude that Memphis has a lot to offer has only recently become contagious.

[hgupta]

Age probably has something to do with it. A lot of the people I know my age have parents in the area (but primarily in the suburbs) who talk down Memphis in the way that many of you have pointed out--with the accordingly blatant lack of evidence. On the other hand, their children have come to appreciate the city in ways that their parents probably didn't. This is just my opinion but the attitude that Memphis has a lot to offer has only recently become contagious.

Age is one factor... the biggest factor that I have encountered is whether or not a person has lived in any other city. You don't really appreciate the city until you've lived somewhere else. I always thought I would like Philly or NYC more until I moved up there for school. Turns out that I didn't realize how good we have it in Memphis, and I moved back the first chance I had.

It seems that all my other friends who really love it here lived in another city for a while as well.